England 2023/24

[Leonormous Boozer]

That really is weird, what's the story?

Wonder if he gets snapped up by the IRFU too?

Would presume he's on a non compete so no international rugby. Head role at a club maybe? Timing doesn't make sense for that either.

 

[Booboobang]

Reckon they'll bring anyone in or just put Sinfield back there?

If they just put sinfield back thats pretty worrying again right, surely you want to hire a coach with a history of implementing the same defense... otherwise you are either going with a guy where it isnt his thing naturally or you are changing approach again, in a short period of time...

 

[Booboobang]

Would presume he's on a non compete so no international rugby. Head role at a club maybe? Timing doesn't make sense for that either.

12 month non compete, but reckon he will be in the IRFU with walters shortly after that tbh.

 

[Booboobang]

The turnover of coaches in the England set-up in the last 5/6 years has been absolutely farcical. How are you meant to build any cohesion or consistency in performance when you have such a big coaching churn?. There's obviously more to this than meets the eye.

From the times: 'Jones, who had revolutionised Steve Borthwick's defence, was understood to be unsettled by an unstable working environment' so something is obviously rotten. Also think its known he is besties with walters so could also be that.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

lmaooo

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Would presume he's on a non compete so no international rugby.

You'd have thought they'd have had Walters on one, tbf - maybe the rfu are just thick as ****

 

[Saintjay]

Let's be honest with Borthwick droning on month after month. I'd probably be on Indeed. Com like a dog after a rabbit as well.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Are non compete clauses a thing in rugby coaching?


Borthwick is out of his depth he clearly flip flops on tactics and players and is too worried what the media think.
England messed this up like they did Johnson.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Are non compete clauses a thing in rugby coaching?

Don't think they're an enforceable thing in general anyway, more of a gentleman's agreement (that they put in writing and make sound legally binding)

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Are non compete clauses a thing in rugby coaching?


Borthwick is out of his depth he clearly flip flops on tactics and players and is too worried what the media think.
England messed this up like they did Johnson.

Farrell had one. Was forced to coach Munster.

The poor *******.

 

[BPM]

Are non compete clauses a thing in rugby coaching?


Borthwick is out of his depth he clearly flip flops on tactics and players and is too worried what the media think.
England messed this up like they did Johnson.

Nothing like Johnson.

Borthwick worked his way up through assistant coach roles both at test and club level (and won a ***le). Johnson was parachuted straight in with 0 coaching experience.

Losing Jones is a serious blow though. Our defence was starting to look like a weapon. I'm not really sure what he means about unstable working environment though? Waters is literally the only person who has left during his tenure.

 

[big ginger 8]

You'd have thought they'd have had Walters on one, tbf - maybe the rfu are just thick as ****

Non-competes are pretty limited in both jurisdictions. Can see them being applicable to coaches who oversee tactics etc but very hard to apply them to an S&C coach.

Would imagine the unions are OK with abiding by them for coaches as well so it doesn't create an extra headache.

 

[BPM]

As I read it's not a non-compete, it's a notice period. I know things work a little differently in sport, but if he's resigned and being held to his notice, that's a little different. Essentially, they might not make him work 12mths notice, but he'll still be 'employed'/under contract for that period.

 

[munstermuffin]

Spoke to Felix today. If his version is accurate then I think for England it will get worst before it gets better. Has nothing lined up either. He reckons Sinfield is replacing him also. But was very unhappy with a few things and effectively Borthwick "sold him a Ferrari but gave him an Astra" was his words

 

[BPM]

I find this all quite odd. I'm not defending Borthwick, but from the outside looking in, it feels like we're on a pretty decent trajectory, so this 'it'll get worse before it gets better' narrative is confusing.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Isn't that the issue with outside looking in though? A very narrow perspective

 

[Which Tyler]

As I read it's not a non-compete, it's a notice period. I know things work a little differently in sport, but if he's resigned and being held to his notice, that's a little different. Essentially, they might not make him work 12mths notice, but he'll still be 'employed'/under contract for that period.

Yeah, non-competes are rarely enforceable, and I don't how they would be in a rugby situation.
Gardening leave is a very different thing though.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

I don't get how anyone can be sold anything in terms of the England job as it's too well known about the players, access etc etc

The only thing I can think and I am guessing, is that Borthwick doesn't let anyone run with their own ideas etc. too controlling maybe?

 

[BPM]

Isn't that the issue with outside looking in though? A very narrow perspective

Sure, but there have been plenty of times when it was very evident that off field issues were contributing to poor performances, but in the last little while, that hasn't been the case.

If it really is so rotten, I would expect it to be a little more obvious or for there to have been leaks from unhappy players.

 

[Scotty]

I don't get how anyone can be sold anything in terms of the England job as it's too well known about the players, access etc etc

The only thing I can think and I am guessing, is that Borthwick doesn't let anyone run with their own ideas etc. too controlling maybe?

It's either Borthwick is controlling leading to people being unhappy or the RFU getting involved to much and trying to dictate...its just wierd with 2 highly rated coaches going in quick succession.

Can't be due to the players as that's something you'd research and this team is getting better with his defence at the heart of it.

So must be bad relationships or lack of freedom to implement what he thinks is best.


Sinfield to come back in as defence coach and spend his wages on a good attack coach .