England 2023/24

[TRF_Olyy]

Shouldn't be in the squad on current form, tbh

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

If M Smith doesn't get a proper chance now I really will give up.

Mind you he started last year's 6N too before doing shirt Hokey Cokey with Farrell.

Our 10 / 12 combos were ridiculous….

Smith / Farrell

Farrell / Lawrence

Farrell / Lawrence - continuity!

Smith / Lawrence

Farrell / Manu

 

[Which Tyler]

Shouldn't be in the squad on current form, tbh

09. Mitchell
10. F.Smith
12. Dingwall

22. M.Smith

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Article about Opoku-Fordjour in Rugbypass, and he said:

Steve Borthwick's scrum coach, Tom Harrison, visited Sale recently but according to Opoku-Fordjour, "we didn't speak at all".

Obviously he's not in with a shout of a call up this 6N but bit weird to just snub him when he's a starter for the u20s, you'd think they'd want to at least give him a nod and say he's been playing well or whatever

Every time I hear anything about this England set up it sounds very playground, very cliquey

 

[LIONSxv]

Article about Opoku-Fordjour in Rugbypass, and he said:

Obviously he's not in with a shout of a call up this 6N but bit weird to just snub him when he's a starter for the u20s, you'd think they'd want to at least give him a nod and say he's been playing well or whatever

Every time I hear anything about this England set up it sounds very playground, very cliquey

Borthwick has black marked him as he isn't a line out option. It's a pre-requisite for new props

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Article about Opoku-Fordjour in Rugbypass, and he said:

Obviously he's not in with a shout of a call up this 6N but bit weird to just snub him when he's a starter for the u20s, you'd think they'd want to at least give him a nod and say he's been playing well or whatever

Every time I hear anything about this England set up it sounds very playground, very cliquey

You'd have thought so, but I wouldn't be reading too much into it either. He's not in the frame at the moment and maybe timings didn't quite work, who knows.

Up against some saffers at the weekend. Whoever they field won't be an idiot, next step in his development.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

You'd have thought so, but I wouldn't be reading too much into it either. He's not in the frame at the moment and maybe timings didn't quite work, who knows.

Up against some saffers at the weekend. Whoever they field won't be an idiot, next step in his development.

Yeah I'm gonna give benefit of the doubt and say that they're just trying not to put any pressure on him. AOF was invited to that England scrum camp a few weeks back so he's clearly in their thoughts. He's yet to start a game of senior rugby; it makes sense to stay hands off for now.

Coincidentally was looking at some of his scrum clips last night and it really struck me just how small he is. And I mean that in a good way. Sale list him as 115kg but just looking at him next to guys like LCD and Creevy I struggle to believe he's any heavier than 108 right now. He may have come into pre-season at 115 but there's no way he's currently playing at that weight. The fact he's dominating scrums at the size he is is crazy. He's gonna be an absolute monster once he fills out more.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

View attachment 18705
Skivington head coach, Waldouck in charge of defence, Vesty in charge of attack.

Strong Gloucester contingent. Disappointing.

Honestly makes sense I suspect pretty much all the other clubs would want to be focused on using this 6n's break as a mid season pre-season deal.


Gloucester and Falcons are the two teams def out of the top 6 race.


Vesty has long standing association with RFU and that's prob why he did it

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Sale list him as 115kg but just looking at him next to guys like LCD and Creevy I struggle to believe he's any heavier than 108 right now

Think he's 111kg atm (that's what the article said, anyway - doubt they weighed him beforehand though)

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Yeah I'm gonna give benefit of the doubt and say that they're just trying not to put any pressure on him. AOF was invited to that England scrum camp a few weeks back so he's clearly in their thoughts. He's yet to start a game of senior rugby; it makes sense to stay hands off for now.

Coincidentally was looking at some of his scrum clips last night and it really struck me just how small he is. And I mean that in a good way. Sale list him as 115kg but just looking at him next to guys like LCD and Creevy I struggle to believe he's any heavier than 108 right now. He may have come into pre-season at 115 but there's no way he's currently playing at that weight. The fact he's dominating scrums at the size he is is crazy. He's gonna be an absolute monster once he fills out more.

Agreed, I thought he looked pretty small as well. He'll naturally get stronger and technically better over time, but if he's scrummaging OK at that kind of size I wouldn't actually encourage him to get too much bigger as it can be really awkward scrummaging against a much smaller prop. Dan Cole probably still has nightmares about Thomas Domingo.

Quite apart from the secondary consideration of reduced mobility around the pitch.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Article about Opoku-Fordjour in Rugbypass, and he said:

Obviously he's not in with a shout of a call up this 6N but bit weird to just snub him when he's a starter for the u20s, you'd think they'd want to at least give him a nod and say he's been playing well or whatever

Every time I hear anything about this England set up it sounds very playground, very cliquey

I guess it depends if he is only focusing on players who they think are 6n's ready it's a limited time to visit and get feedback on all 10 clubs

 

[Jimbo]

Initially sounds pretty bad form from SB, however is it just our media staring **** as usual would it even be published by other nations media etc.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Agreed, I thought he looked pretty small as well. He'll naturally get stronger and technically better over time, but if he's scrummaging OK at that kind of size I wouldn't actually encourage him to get too much bigger as it can be really awkward scrummaging against a much smaller prop. Dan Cole probably still has nightmares about Thomas Domingo.

Quite apart from the secondary consideration of reduced mobility around the pitch.

Oh yeah I'm not at all suggesting that we try and turn him into some 130kg lump who can't move around.

Just that at 19 years of age he's naturally going to fill out more as he matures. And once he does he'll be a real weapon.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

The bits I've seen suggest that LCD's been throwing himself around to reasonable effect for Sale.

Is that representative? If so, he walks straight back in to the 23 for me.

Dan's in an interesting position with Sarries. He'll be learning from George but desperately needs minutes. With George showing no signs of stepping back and the Prem taking a pause during the 6N how's he going to get meaningful game time? Feels like he'll have a decision to make at some point - could easily see a club like Bath piling in for him.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Is that representative?

He's been decent, and getting better each game, but George, Dan and Langdon have been better this season

I'd only include him after a chat to see whether he still plans to go to France as soon as they'll sign him off - if he's only gonna be available this season I wouldn't have him in the EPS

 

[BPM]

The bits I've seen suggest that LCD's been throwing himself around to reasonable effect for Sale.

Is that representative? If so, he walks straight back in to the 23 for me.

Dan's in an interesting position with Sarries. He'll be learning from George but desperately needs minutes. With George showing no signs of stepping back and the Prem taking a pause during the 6N how's he going to get meaningful game time? Feels like he'll have a decision to make at some point - could easily see a club like Bath piling in for him.

Actually I see it as pretty similar to how George shared game time with Brits (and Hartley) until he eventually took over as first choice. He is starting games, just not every week. Unless it stops him being picked in the England squad, I don't see him leaving.

LCD isn't back to his best yet. I'd rather we went with Langdon.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

I don't know what Dans darts are like but every time I see him they seem to go amiss. Might be unfair but only the clips etc I've seen.

Unless he sorts those out he shouldn't be near the England squad. He does look good around the park but we need set piece first and foremost.

Might be unfair comment that though.

 

[BPM]

I think that's harsh. His lineout throwing definitely has room for improvement but I wouldn't have gone as far as saying it's actively bad.

LCD's took quite a long while to get up to par too as I recall.

McGuigan has been a criminal waste IMO. His form hasn't been as good as it was at Newcastle, but he's still among the best available to us. He could/should have had 30+ caps by now. He's far from ancient, but I think we've probably missed his peak.

Right now, I favour Langdon on a combination of sustained form and medium term potential. I don't think he'll get significantly better and I'm not sure I'd ever see him as first choice, but I think he's definitely good enough to be a strong contender for the 16 shirt for the next RWC cycle.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/67953379

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

I think that's harsh. His lineout throwing definitely has room for improvement but I wouldn't have gone as far as saying it's actively bad.

LCD's took quite a long while to get up to par too as I recall.

McGuigan has been a criminal waste IMO. His form hasn't been as good as it was at Newcastle, but he's still among the best available to us. He could/should have had 30+ caps by now. He's far from ancient, but I think we've probably missed his peak.

Right now, I favour Langdon on a combination of sustained form and medium term potential. I don't think he'll get significantly better and I'm not sure I'd ever see him as first choice, but I think he's definitely good enough to be a strong contender for the 16 shirt for the next RWC cycle.

Yeah I realised it might have been harsh as I've not watched loads of him but maybe not got a rounded view.

I really like Langdon but I'm not sure if he's big enough for an international hooker. So we not need them 5-10kg bigger than he currently is.