2014 6 Nations: France vs Ireland (Round 5)

[Rich Taff]

That specific sort of smiley there makes it difficult for me to interpret whether you're insulting me or the man who commissions sightings...

Saffycen, usually players look before hitting the ruck, just saying! A penalty? Yeah. A yellow? Possibly. A red? No way.

I'm being both mysterious and pedantic. I'm a mystedantic! (and I'm not insulting either)

 

[munstermuffin]

Tom Wood "can" play 8 you don't want him there internationally if you can help it though .....

Ireland must have a better 8 than an out of position flanker

POM was a natural 8 all through underage

 

[CAB_for_ever]

Is the sighting commissioner even coming after Healy actually? Not a chance it was a red and if it wasn't Healy people wouldn't be calling for it.

I agree there... I wouldn't have redcarded healy. Yellow surely, cause it was the second infringement in few seconds and so near the line, but not more than yellow. I considere the result of his "anticipation" wasn't to Knock out Picamoles but to slow the french game.

 

[munstermuffin]

Can I just say not to stoke a war but Leinster fans called for POC to be banned last year with Dave Kearney incident for same type of thing. Personally myself I don't think Healy will or should be cited. He wasn't aiming for anyone and while reckless he was attempting something that was legal. Some here say it was a headbutt etc but it was nothing like it and yes he clashed heads with Piccamoles but was not intentional and was clearing a ruck at crucial period of game in a crucial area of pitch.

 

[Big Ewis]

I read a great post on some forum from a French poster, it sums up the situation for me:

"PSA is not helping his cause it seems. But the France we like to remember of the 70s and 80s is unlikely ever to return. It's kind of unfair to compare. Back then, opposition teams were not that well prepared (NZ apart). So a little passion on the day, allied to natural talent, was enough to win a few memorable games. The fact they were drinking pastis for breakfast and sneaking a cigarette or two at half time didn't matter so much. Now, all the top sides are well drilled. Even the Pumas. Only the French still inhabit a kind of quasi-amateur world. And that goes for the coaches too. Too much inbreeding and politics in the FFR. One can understand Noves not wanting the job. But to watch Cotter go to Scotland and Schmidt go to Ireland without even trying to keep them in France is just dumb. Which other top 10 national team doesn't have a kicking coach? Or a referee coach? Or priority over clubs in terms of rest periods and team preparation? Or even a dedicated national rugby stadium with a half-decent playing surface? No wonder the good coaches won't touch the job….

So yes, PSA is a bumbler. So was Lievremont. But the French are unmanageable anyway given the club vs country issues. PSA's replacement (after RWC) is likely to be Galthie/Ibanez/Pelous. Anyone see a pattern here? So we French supporters are condemned to watching another generation of talent go to waste…. Imagine Picamoles, Fofana, Huget, Fickou, Dulin etc in an Irish province style set-up. That would be something! "

 

[FrenchFan]

Just seen parts of the game and I have a few points
-How was Healy not sent off ?
- Basteraud did not seem to have as good a game as the comments made out. He made a few good breaks then launched the ball forward I don't see how people said he had a great game ? And this is coming from a Basteraud fan.

should have been a straight yelllow agst Healy. Can't clear a ruck with your head.

well Basta didn't have a bad game in the championship. His defense is coming good. He was a right handful thru the game and made some goodbreaks and the irish midfield couldn't handle him. Look at the number of players it took to stop him every time and the yardage he makes in a congested midfield.
in 0:08 he runs thru Sexton ODriscoll like they're not even there, just watch - the irish midfield pair were anonymous agst him, not bad for a guy supposedly so unfit... Thing is I didn't see any side take advantage, if he was unfit, with the pace of the games nw then surely he should have been exposed, he wasn't. Its not like he was done for pace at any stage. And he stayed on for the full 80. I'd love to be that unfit. Its one thing to state he is unfit, another to expose him on pitch...
Sexton is still seeing stars, poor Johnny, Bastareau will be coming his way again in Top14

 

[FrenchFan]

i think ferris will be good for Clermont think there is hard competition in toulouse for him with Dusautoir, Nyanga and Picamoles

yeah and don't forget also Galan and Camara who is only 19 and already playing for the first team. Yeah definitely no room for Ferris except on the bench.

 

[Big Ewis]

And yet Basta couldn't make a pass to save his life...at least in Bleus. Have seen him feed his teammates well in Toulon.

He's actually taken such a dimension this tournament that I'm almost starting to ask myself if he shouldn't start for us. Look, Fickou is good, he's got fantastic individual skill but he's still a bit reluctant to pass it when needed and extremely young.
Maybe we should go Fofana+Bastareaud with Fritz off the bench, but Fofana+Fritz with Basta off the bench sounds brilliant too.

I'd have loved to see what Lamerat or Yann David can do at test level, both in the more brutal register, but they might get their chance later, still young.

 

[FrenchFan]

I read a great post on some forum from a French poster, it sums up the situation for me:

"PSA is not helping his cause it seems. But the France we like to remember of the 70s and 80s is unlikely ever to return. It's kind of unfair to compare. Back then, opposition teams were not that well prepared (NZ apart). So a little passion on the day, allied to natural talent, was enough to win a few memorable games. The fact they were drinking pastis for breakfast and sneaking a cigarette or two at half time didn't matter so much. Now, all the top sides are well drilled. Even the Pumas. Only the French still inhabit a kind of quasi-amateur world. And that goes for the coaches too. Too much inbreeding and politics in the FFR. One can understand Noves not wanting the job. But to watch Cotter go to Scotland and Schmidt go to Ireland without even trying to keep them in France is just dumb. Which other top 10 national team doesn't have a kicking coach? Or a referee coach? Or priority over clubs in terms of rest periods and team preparation? Or even a dedicated national rugby stadium with a half-decent playing surface? No wonder the good coaches won't touch the job….

So yes, PSA is a bumbler. So was Lievremont. But the French are unmanageable anyway given the club vs country issues. PSA's replacement (after RWC) is likely to be Galthie/Ibanez/Pelous. Anyone see a pattern here? So we French supporters are condemned to watching another generation of talent go to waste…. Imagine Picamoles, Fofana, Huget, Fickou, Dulin etc in an Irish province style set-up. That would be something! "

its been tried before back in 80s and 90s. Provinces have never worked here. Nobody wants them. Please join a club, a real one, not virtual and see how its done.

 

[Big Ewis]

well I mean it's always been that way for Ireland, that isn't what's made them good lately, it's obviously Joe Schmidt. But it sure doesn't hurt them either, to be euphemistic, that they're basically all on one team that happened to have been coached by the very Schmidt for years.

In France, we're way decentralized, spread out all over Top 14 geography, and unlike England we don't make the effort to put the priority or any kind of serious emphasis on the national team. England are spread too into many different clubs, but then they've got a real coaching staff and a real common culture when they come together as they play in white and represent the Saint George cross.
A bit antithetic from where we stand really...

 

[FrenchFan]

I read a great post on some forum from a French poster, it sums up the situation for me:

"PSA is not helping his cause it seems. But the France we like to remember of the 70s and 80s is unlikely ever to return. It's kind of unfair to compare. Back then, opposition teams were not that well prepared (NZ apart). So a little passion on the day, allied to natural talent, was enough to win a few memorable games. The fact they were drinking pastis for breakfast and sneaking a cigarette or two at half time didn't matter so much. Now, all the top sides are well drilled. Even the Pumas. Only the French still inhabit a kind of quasi-amateur world. And that goes for the coaches too. Too much inbreeding and politics in the FFR. One can understand Noves not wanting the job. But to watch Cotter go to Scotland and Schmidt go to Ireland without even trying to keep them in France is just dumb. Which other top 10 national team doesn't have a kicking coach? Or a referee coach? Or priority over clubs in terms of rest periods and team preparation? Or even a dedicated national rugby stadium with a half-decent playing surface? No wonder the good coaches won't touch the job….

So yes, PSA is a bumbler. So was Lievremont. But the French are unmanageable anyway given the club vs country issues. PSA's replacement (after RWC) is likely to be Galthie/Ibanez/Pelous. Anyone see a pattern here? So we French supporters are condemned to watching another generation of talent go to waste…. Imagine Picamoles, Fofana, Huget, Fickou, Dulin etc in an Irish province style set-up. That would be something! "

well its not wasted on the clubs for sure !!

i agree with the point made in post u quote about Cotter & Schmidt. I made same point about Cotter that he should have been approached for an assistant coaching or consultant type of job. But that would require a modicum of foresight on FFR's part. Don't agree about the quasi amateur thing. Its a thing of the past. Many foreign coaches incl. team and individual fitness coaches here have helped change the amateur approach to S&C. Thats positive.
I agree about the need for a kicking coach. Quesada who now coaches SF with success did some great work with the national side and was highly regarded. It certainly helped him get his job at SF. Can you believe there is also no dedicated defense coach either?!
you know you can kiss your priority over clubs goodbye

 

[gaston le gaff]

Funny man you are... But most of "specialists" hear on C+, on L'equipe 21, and on many other channels or newspapers have said Machenaud did it great and some even says we have lost because Doussain replaced Machenaud... Galthié is truly "isolé" in his comments... and abvout your last lines of your comment, you know where you can put them... I haven't lesson to receive from you... and about "arse" you know something.

What makes it even funnier is a vast majority are calling for Galthie to be the next French coach yet you find his comments isolé (isolated) like he talks crap because you do not agrree, another typical frenchman raler raler raler, vous etes les experts a raler, jamais content. The French team has at the moment very little vision are coached badly and the player selection is in the least strange. with a WC on the horizon they need to turn this failure around, the agression that has always had a domminant French pack is no longer there and individuals are now playing as individuals and not as a 15 man team, both PSA and Lagisquet bring nothing to the table only charisma at the press conferences, unfortunately this will not change so how is France going to win a World Cup heaven knows, are they going to be always the bridesmaid and never the bride, not even mentioning the SH, Ireland England are making tremendous progress internationaly we are treading water. Many say the TOP 14 is to blame but France has massive young talent which is not coached properly at International level. Take Montpellier for example 2004 they came up to the TOP 16 as it was then, they did not get relegated but a couple of times came very close, and they were a regular bottom regions placed team,(9,10,11,12) along came Galthie and his first year without any new players managed a TOP 14 final and since H Cup qualification every season and they are a regular top 4/6 placed team, yes money has been injected into the club but not as much as some other teams, money will get you the players but it does not mean they are going to play well, its the coaching that is by far the most important, look at Racing and what they have not done, bar spend loads of cash. When France get a decent coach and not a YES man who keeps the FFR suits happy then and only then can France even think about winning a World Cup

 

[Big Ewis]

What makes it even funnier is a vast majority are calling for Galthie to be the next French coach yet you find his comments isolé (isolated) like he talks crap because you do not agrree, another typical frenchman raler raler raler, vous etes les experts a raler, jamais content. The French team has at the moment very little vision are coached badly and the player selection is in the least strange. with a WC on the horizon they need to turn this failure around, the agression that has always had a domminant French pack is no longer there and individuals are now playing as individuals and not as a 15 man team, both PSA and Lagisquet bring nothing to the table only charisma at the press conferences, unfortunately thie will not change so how France aregoing to win a World Cup he

I agree we obviously lack a whole lot in the tactical department, as this game against Ireland was a success but still didn't show a whole lot of gameplan.
But although our pack has faltered a few times this tournament, we did look very good at the breakdown against Ireland, a team whose aggression there is feared by all teams.

As for the World Cup. I see France pulling another typically French tournament: i.e. will impress in both beating superior teams, and losing to inferior ones or coming close in both instances.
We have too much quality that we'd get thrown out of the tournament like dirty socks, no matter how bad we may play collectively, but at the same time will lack the strategy and guidance to be consistent and solid enough to make it all the way over the top.
And the pool stage will be a handful with Ireland in ours. We'll advance for sure, but we may advance second, and that means we face the All-Blacks in the 1/4F.

 

[FrenchFan]

I agree we obviously lack a whole lot in the tactical department, as this game against Ireland was a success but still didn't show a whole lot of gameplan.
But although our pack has faltered a few times this tournament, we did look very good at the breakdown against Ireland, a team whose aggression there is feared by all teams.

As for the World Cup. I see France pulling another typically French tournament: i.e. will impress in both beating superior teams, and losing to inferior ones or coming close in both instances.
We have too much quality that we'd get thrown out of the tournament like dirty socks, no matter how bad we may play collectively, but at the same time will lack the strategy and guidance to be consistent and solid enough to make it all the way over the top.
And the pool stage will be a handful with Ireland in ours. We'll advance for sure, but we may advance second, and that means we face the All-Blacks in the 1/4F.

of course they can. We dont exactly fear Ire at a RWC. And wouldnt put it past them to knock the AB out again!
The team will coach itself from now on. The leaders will emerge and play their game. Same thing happened in 1999 2011. There were more than glimpses of that on Sat. Screw PSA and his team. Players will stop listening to them & get on with it. PSA can write the press releases and smile at the press conf.

 

[TheSaffycen]

well Basta didn't have a bad game in the championship. His defense is coming good. He was a right handful thru the game and made some goodbreaks and the irish midfield couldn't handle him. Look at the number of players it took to stop him every time and the yardage he makes in a congested midfield

Yeah his defence to me is no problem, it never has been, because as you say teams would target him more. His out and out pace is not brilliant but I feel Irelands midfield really under performed yesterday. This could have been because Basteraud was just too big and powerful for them, but I've seen BOD tackle bigger faster guys with ease. If Basta could pass and interact like he does at Toulon with Giteau, than Fofana and him are right up there with the best.

 

[gaston le gaff]

And if we get to the 1/4 finals and face the All Blacks!!!! and the what!!! good bye for another 4 years or do we hope to get a Wayne Barnes as Ref. At this moment in time 15 is decided if Dulin is not injured but the rest 8,9,10 a decent front row remember for the WC you need more or less two teams and there will be injuries, a game plan and vision are so important , but also a plan B as the gameplan does not always work at the moment we have no game plan at all and certaily no vision!!!!!!!!!
Unfortunately breakdowns do not win games they help but that is not enough i think there needs to be some honesty and stop hiding what is really the problem!!!!!

 

[Big Ewis]

Basta has potentially blown at least two almost 100% certain tries this tournament. The missed offload in Cardiff, and his huge break at midfield in the opening minutes against Ireland. When you make a break like that, split wide open the defense, they're at your mercy, you either make the try happen or you don't, it's not up to the defense anymore at this stage. One pass left, maybe another pass left again, try. Easy as that. Didn't happen, big forward pass, cancel everything give the ball back to Ireland...

 

[Big Ewis]

And if we get to the 1/4 finals and face the All Blacks!!!! and the what!!! good bye for another 4 years or do we hope to get a Wayne Barnes as Ref. At this moment in time 15 is decided if Dulin is not injured but the rest 8,9,10 a decent front row remember for the WC you need more or less two teams and there will be injuries, a game plan and vision are so important , but also a plan B as the gameplan does not always work at the moment we have no game plan at all and certaily no vision!!!!!!!!!
Unfortunately breakdowns do not win games they help but that is not enough i think there needs to be some honesty and stop hiding what is really the problem!!!!!

well no need for Barnes, but we sure hope it's not Joubert at least !!!!!!!!
And you're right about the rest...

 

[FrenchFan]

Basta has potentially blown at least two almost 100% certain tries this tournament. The missed offload in Cardiff, and his huge break at midfield in the opening minutes against Ireland. When you make a break like that, split wide open the defense, they're at your mercy, you either make the try happen or you don't, it's not up to the defense anymore at this stage. One pass left, maybe another pass left again, try. Easy as that. Didn't happen, big forward pass, cancel everything give the ball back to Ireland...

oh yeah easy to score a try at that level agst a combined midfield with more than a few hundreds caps like BOD & Darcy. Actually every coach will tell you that the last pass and finishing a move is the most difficult. You've played a lot of rugby Big Ewis so you're talking from experience :lol:

 

[gaston le gaff]

of course they can. We dont exactly fear Ire at a RWC. And wouldnt put it past them to knock the AB out again!
The team will coach itself from now on. The leaders will emerge and play their game. Same thing happened in 1999 2011. There were more than glimpses of that on Sat. Screw PSA and his team. Players will stop listening to them & get on with it. PSA can write the press releases and smile at the press conf.

To some point i agree but the self coaching normally comes during the WC (Galthie did it in 2003) after the players get pis*** off with the coaches but at the moment we are too far away for that to happen with 3 Internaionals tournaments to come before the next WC, but as i don't see them changing PSA i don't know what the solution is, far too early to let the players get on with it themselves. We need Stability vision and that has to come from somewhere and it will not be the present French coaches who bring that to the table, they are good for the occaisional croissants or tarte from sa grandmere.