Tri Nations: Springboks - All Blacks @ Nelson Mandela Bay Stadium (20-8-2011, 15:05)

[kaftka]

Furthermore, I have stared the Club for the Appreciation of Facial Expressions, Israel Dagg chapter. Anyone want to join?

 

[smartcooky]

Finally, does Justin Marshall get paid the more he talks or something?

He's a fvcking half-back. What they hell do you expect?

 

[Shaggy]

I can't say I'm either surprised or indeed worried by the result, it was always going to be a huge ask with the untested combinations and the players returning from injury. Having said that however, this was much more a game that was lost rather than a game that was won. A minimum of six tries went begging, five of them to the AB's and one to the Boks.

The positives for the Bok's are firstly a win is a win and that creates confidence, secondly that all their players looked sharper than they did last week, other than that, I really don't think there are too many positives for the Boks to take away. They lacked any creativity on attack, and if it were not for opposition mistakes the defence would have leaked an awful lot of tries. They will be happier going into the World Cup but I don't think their chances of lifting the trophy have actually improved. The major negatives are the way the NZ backs carved up the defence and their own inability to cross the try line.

The positives for the AB's can be summed up in three names, Dagg, Toeava and Kahui. This was the test to see if they were fit enough in form enough and hungry enough to go to the world cup, all three answered with a resounding yes, particularly Dagg. With their utility and the form they showed in this game it would be hard to select SBW over Kahui and certainly on this performance Gear is a long way behind Dagg and Toeava. The line break ability and defence were excellent.

The negatives, Slade didn't fire, not that he did that badly, just inexperience and a bit of loose passing. The finishing, I expect an AB team with that many chances to convert more than one, it was mostly handling errors which should not be happening at this level. No 9's should be given a quota of kicks, like one each per game, or at least No 9's with the surname of Cowan. Other than that there was nothing really negative except for Thompson.

As to the World Cup prep, this was good prep as far as locking in the selections, it was also good mentally for the team to get a reminder that they can loose. So long as the A team fires well against the Aussies then I think we are in pretty good shape.

Exactly! ... in an ideal world, the players that were played tonight would have been brought into the side a few at a time, but, as there's very little time left, they had to be played all at the same time ... as a fan, I was hoping for an All Black win, but i'm not surprised we didn't get it with all of those changes.

The Boks deserved the win, and the ABs got what they deserved, for playing the players that they did ... they'd have to be a lot of injuries for an AB side that looks like that one, to take the field in any major match in the WC.

... Let's see how the full strength ABs go against the Wallabies in Brisbane - it should be a cracker of a game.

I think Graham Henry said it all ... the ABs lacked Maturity and patience, and squander most of the chances they had

... he also said that he didn't have a problem with the TMO decision if it was a forward pass (and it clearly was)

I think the Adam Thomson critics were harsh ... all opensides get penalised, as they push the boundaries at the breakdown

 

[kusta]

He is good in attack from first receiver, but (IMO) far from a reliable attacker at test level playing fullback. Purely because he hasn't had many opportunities though.

Well I think Lambie is dangerous from fullback the most,whereas in the first five he is able to get the backline moving and with the centres we have,its just too bad they wernt put into the game more...I'm sure it was part of the game plan to have Morne Steyn and Lambie swap positions during the game also,and Lambie did make a half break once when he joined the line,which is what makes him dangerous at fullback! But I'm not saying he wouldve made a big difference but I think he would have made a difference in our attack.

 

[kusta]

Many of you are saying the AB definatly played more of the rugby and should be more happy....well I'm saying if you rewind back to 2009 the Boks kicked most of the possession away and we let the other team play the rugby and we reaped points of their mistakes,and in that year we were undoubtedly the best team in the world though we didn't play a lot of rugby and the Boks got criticized for playing boring rugby.....but if you look at this game,you can see that we are playing the similar game, sure the game has changed now but no one says you can't win if you playing the same game plan the Boks are playing....So I don't think its really a bad thing that we are said to be poor on attack....I think come world cup defence and kicking could determine who wins games and we clearly showed we have that and with Brussow to win us penalties your'll should be scared.

 

[Black Heart]

Manyy of you are saying the AB definaty played more of the rugby and should be more happy....well I'm saying if you rewind back to 2009 the Boks kicked most of the possession away and we let the other team play the rugby and we reaped points of their mistakes,and in that year we were undoubtedly the best team in the world though we didn't play a lot of rugby and the Boks got criticized for playing boring rugby.....but if you look at this game,you can see that we are playing the similar game, sure the game has changed now but no one says you can't win if you playing the same game plan the Boks are playing....So I don't think its really a bad thing that we are said to be poor on attack....I think come world cup defence and kicking could determine who wins games and we clearly showed we have that and with Brussow to win us penalties your'll should be scared.

Yes, and the All Blacks also had one of the weakest sides in 2009 than what they had had for a long time. The Boks certainly deserved to win last night but you have to keep in mind that over half of the All Blacks starting XV was on holiday. On top of that they decided to run with green combinations in the back 3, in the midfield, in the loose fowards and the second row.

 

[Black Heart]

it doesnt matter whether we played all the rugby, actually that makes it seem worse, we had all the attack in this game and couldn't capitalise with any points which should be a real worry for us because come world cup time, it seems the kick and hope strategy is going to take affect.

Whether we played all the rugby or not, the Boks won which means the most at the end of the day.

I disagree. We had a second string side who managed to break open holes in a full strength Bok side at home. Imagine the damage Nonu, Franks, McCaw, not to mention Carter would have caused.

 

[Bossco]

The AB's could also adopt the same tactics and play the kick/chase/penalty game, year in year out with the sole view of being WC champions every four years and probably even outmaster the Boks at it.

But just because you can doesn't mean you should, the rubbish we saw today from them is what was killing Rugby and despite having divided loyalty's for the sake of the game I hope they get obliterated by the AB's.

 

[kusta]

Yes, and the All Blacks also had one of the weakest sides in 2009 than what they had had for a long time. The Boks certainly deserved to win last night but you have to keep in mind that over half of the All Blacks starting XV was on holiday. On top of that they decided to run with green combinations in the back 3, in the midfield, in the loose fowards and the second row.

Oh really now? Please look at the llink below...The only significant person missing here is Dan Carter! You still had a lot of players who are starting XV this time

http://www.theroar.com.au/2009/07/04/sneak-preview-of-all-blacks-2009-tri-nations-squad/

 

[markshaw]

we played ****.

 

[lance2010]

A lost now is better then in the knock out stages of the WC guys...

Bring Back Cruden lets give SBW another run with Smith outside him and can the Back 3 be Jane,Dagg,Guilford against Aussie.

 

[ACT1NUP]

I think SA have overtaken England as the most predictable, boring, unimaginative rugby team out. I guess they'll change up there gameplan for the world cup and rather than kicking aimlessly down field they'll plug the corners all day long. I'm picking that as P Divvys not so secret weapon In all reality though the Boks have a pretty solid gameplan suited for finals rugby. Problem is take away that kicking game and the Boks offer nothing, I just can't see them troubling NZ or Aussie at the WC. ABs probably still get a pass mark. Slade was average but still shouldn't be dropped for Cruden. Just hope SB Williams is dropped, remember that overlap he completely butchered at the start where he threw an intercept? Nonu would have nailed that pass Nonu is still well and truly a class above.

 

[Darwin]

What do you All Black fans think of Colin Slade's performance? Absolute shocker in my opinion. Israel Dagg on the other hand was brilliant. I think if he had managed to make his comeback earlier he would be giving Mils a run for his money.

Slade performance was average (at best) - I wouldn't say he was that shocking though. His defence was good, and did do some good things with the ball in hand (including a good linebreak). His goal kicking was poor though, he made quite a few mistakes, and he kicked far too often. I actually talked him up a bit before the game, and he certainly didn't perform as well as I'd hoped.

Let me pondering...hmm I think we were watching the same match. Toeava is weak under the high ball, he isolates with the ball in hand, and I find he has'nt the "security" for the test match.

If you had watched any Super Rugby this season you would see that Toeava is actually very good under the high ball. I'd suggest he would be better than most international wings under the high-ball (especially considering he is usually a fullback). I thought Toeava had quite a good game - his defence was excellent,and he made a couple of clean linebreaks. He did make a couple of errors (missed a high ball, dropped the ball in contact once), but given he hasn't played hardly any rugby after a 3 month layoff I thought it was a pretty impressive performance!

Overall I pretty disappointing game from an AB's perspective; they created a pile of chances, but were unable to finish them off. Part of this can be attributed to the fact that many of the players hadn't played much recently, and importantly hadn't played enough together to establish combinations. The other part of course can be attributed to the desperate scrambling Bok defence.

I thought South Africa had the edge in the tight-forwards, particularly at scrum time. I'm not at all surprised that South Africa got he edge at the scrums given the AB's front row, and the fact they were missing a genuine tighthead lock (as I mentioned before the game). The AB's selectors will be happy that Woodcock got through 70 mins, though his performance wasn't great. I think he will be included in the RWC squad, but on form he certainly doesn't deserve to be their over Wyatt Crockett. Whitelock and Williams were again quiet; I really hope Boric gets picked in the RWC (despite the fact he is still recovering from injury). Kaino and Thomson got through a lot of work, but Thomson did get himself penalised far too much. He really needs to learn to adapt to the way the game is being refereed. Messem was again quiet - I think he did enough to make the RWC squad, but I think he has the talent to be much more effective at test level.

Cowan was pretty average, as was Slade (as mentioned above). SBW was good on defence, but still doesn't challenge the line enough on attack - the few times he actually ran hard at the line he broke tackles, I just wish he would do that more often. Kahui was very impressive, both in attack and with some punishing defence. I still worry that his habit of running out of the line in defence could be exposed by better attacking teams. Gear was again pretty quiet, but looked far more secure on defence this week. I thought both Toeava and Dagg especially looked dangerous, though both made a couple of errors.

I thought most of the starting Boks tight-forwards had strong games; it is a bit of a relief to me to know that if we face the Boks in a RWC match John Smit will likely be starting instead of Bismark du Plessis! Brussow was very good, though he never actually releases the tacked player before going for the ball... it will be interesting to see how he goes with a ref who has a stricter interpretation at the breakdown. He seems like an intelligent player, so he would likely adapt pretty quickly. Alberts and Spies were pretty quiet.

I thought du Preez too was quiet, but Morne Steyn had a very good game. He is ideal for the game plan that the Boks adopted, and it will be interesting to see whether he or Butch James start in the crucial RWC matches. The backs had few chances with the ball in hand, and some of their first up tackling was a bit poor at times, but they scrambled exceptionally well in defence (Fourie, Hougaard, and Habana in particular come to mind).

 

[Black Heart]

Oh really now? Please look at the llink below...The only significant person missing here is Dan Carter! You still had a lot of players who are starting XV this timehttp://mobile.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.php?c_id=4&objectid=10582531

Look at the stats. 2009 was the All Blacks' worst season in over a decade. The names you've mentioned are collective over the course of the year, it doesn't mean that we had them all avaliable at any one point and guys like Cory Jane, Zac Guildford, Hosea Gear, Owen Franks and Kieran Read were all rookies anyway.

We lost the first game of the season (at home) to France and very nearly lost the 2nd, where, Muliaina of all people was captaining. We never had McCaw for the first part of the year and you've already mentioned that we never had Carter. Instead we had Stephen Donald to cover 10 and it should go without saying that the backline was rubbish as a result.

The two games we played against Italy (one at home and abroad) were consecutively the worst results the All Blacks have ever featured and from a technical perspective the only worthwhile result in the NH tour was the Dave Gallaher redemption match against France in Marseille. We also lost the final match of the year to the Barbarians.

It was the first time in over a decade the Boks had beaten the All Blacks twice in a season so yeah, it was a poor year for us as it was a good year for you.

 

[TRF_heineken]

All i can do is dit and laugh at all of you non-saffas comments after this game ended.

We'll take the win off course, but as the papers said all week and PDV also said. this game will be purely experimental as it's the last game before the World Cup and they had to get the last things right before naming the WC squad on tuesday.

It was Rassie Erasmus's (the only proper coach in the management) first official game part of the WC squad. it was Gurthro Steenkamp's first start in over a year.

like the past World Cups was decided, it's won on defence and kicking, Not tries!!! the boks showed in this game they can do both! it's also amazing how much better Morne Steyn plays when he has some front-foot ball from the forwards and some better passing from FDP.

i thought the Ref was pretty good. and the TMO decision was a good call, just listen in the manner in which he asked the question. "is this a try, yes or no". the TMO asked if he wanted to know what happened before the grounding and before the line, and then the Ref said yes, he could've said no, so people giving the SA TMO crap about the call, grow up!!

also, was i the only one watching the game thinking, without Crockett in the Scrum, the All Blacks will have a very hard time in games?? the AB's were heavier in the pack, yet the bokke broke them almost every time in the scrums... and it was good quality scrummaging, only one collapsed scrum which resulted in a free kick for the boks... don't think there were more than 3 restarts.

it was test rugby at it's best! uncompromising rugby, and Brussouw, damn that guy is a machine!!

 

[Black Heart]

A lost now is better then in the knock out stages of the WC guys...

Bring Back Cruden lets give SBW another run with Smith outside him and can the Back 3 be Jane,Dagg,Guilford against Aussie.

Cruden hasn't been in the framework and he won't be introduced with the WC team named on Tuesday. Personally I don't see that Cruden would be any better than Slade. He's playing great provincial rugby but that counts for nothing at test level. In saying that I don't think Slade played too badly. Aside from his kicking which wasn't the best, I thought he ran the ship pretty well in the first half. Keep in mind that this game was always going to test him aswell as the entire team.

 

[Black Heart]

also, was i the only one watching the game thinking, without Crockett in the Scrum, the All Blacks will have a very hard time in games?? the AB's were heavier in the pack, yet the bokke broke them almost every time in the scrums... and it was good quality scrummaging, only one collapsed scrum which resulted in a free kick for the boks... don't think there were more than 3 restarts.

Crockett?? Crockett's a loose head and the scrum was weak on the tighthead. The All Blacks were missing Owen Franks (the best prop in the country), Richie McCaw, Brad Thorn and Kieran Read. The Boks' scrum was very good but it wasn't exactly a top All Black scrum either.

 

[Darwin]

i thought the Ref was pretty good. and the TMO decision was a good call, just listen in the manner in which he asked the question. "is this a try, yes or no". the TMO asked if he wanted to know what happened before the grounding and before the line, and then the Ref said yes, he could've said no, so people giving the SA TMO crap about the call, grow up!!

It doesn't matter what the referee asked the TMO, the IRB protocol clearly state that the TMO can only adjudicate on what happened in the in goal (regardless of what the ref asks)! It was not a good call by the TMO, it was a call that went completely against protocol, and I have no doubt he (and possibly the ref) will get in a lot of trouble for it. The correct call was actually made, so I'm not remotely worried about it, but the TMO was definitely in the wrong in this case.

also, was i the only one watching the game thinking, without Crockett in the Scrum, the All Blacks will have a very hard time in games?? the AB's were heavier in the pack, yet the bokke broke them almost every time in the scrums... and it was good quality scrummaging, only one collapsed scrum which resulted in a free kick for the boks... don't think there were more than 3 restarts.

The AB's won't be remotely worried about the scrum. Afoa is an average scrummager; Ben Franks is better, and Owen Franks (who will start) is world class. Woodcock was only playing his second game in about 4 months so will only get better. Perhaps most importantly they were missing Brad Thorn, who is regarded by many as the best scrummaging lock in the world, and they didn't even have a traditional tighthead lock playing. When the AB's scrum is back to full strength they will no issues at all with the South African scrum.

 

[dan-the-man]

Colin Slade and Adam Thomson lost the All Blacks that game. Slade is without doubt the worst flyhlaf to ever wear the All Black jersey. He is a laughing stock. du Preez showed us again how laughable his kicking game is. Why doesn't he stick to the running and setting up tries that made him so great in 2007? South Africa are the lamest team ever. Once again no tries, nothing but up-and-unders and penalties. I don't understand how anyone can support the Springboks. Maybe you'd be more suited to watching soccer? du Preez and Steyn should definitely rather take up soccer. The most uncreative half-back combo in world rugby

 

[InsaneAsylum]

i watched the game and wish not to comment, except to congratulate the boks on the win and also to say i've never really thought much of brussouw until this game. showed a lot of courage to play on with his face smashed open, good work.