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Would NZ pick Nadolo ?

I have seen alot of Gear before and during Toulouse, I just think that for a winger in the All Blacks he has scored 8 tries in 14 test which isn't great. I know Huget is worse with 6 in 26 but after the 6 nations he really went up in my opinion. Now thinking about it I would push Visser way up, scores a hell of alot of tries.
So overall Gear incredible talent, big scary runner but hasn't got alot of strings to his bow, which is probably why he hasn't got as many caps as he should. Huget gives you a bit more versatility and has recently found a scoring touch internationally.
 
Best I could find as far as his Toulouse, i.e. most recent form:



His tries against England as a Baabaa:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HET5aDcICIE

To me Saffycen your post is exactly what I'm talking about in terms of underestimating Gear, you horrible, horrible monster. I'm not out here to prove I'm right, I don't really care about that, it's just ppl don't understand how good this guy is. One on one, you're basically fkd against him with the ball in hand. How many times have I watched a Top 14/H Cup match and you see Gear just outclassing everybody and just found myself going "yep, that's just...that's just Gear for ya...". Runs like hell, makes the break, still going, ppl trying their best to catch him, too elusive, gets away, still going...he's top, top class for a winger. I've really seen what I claim time, and time and time again.
 
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no no, I've seen what he can do. Seen enough, he's up there. Forgot Manuel Montero, easily in that list.
Montero is another relative newbie that should form part of the discussion, yeah. Hendricks has scored 5 tries in 7 matches now and it goes to 6 if you count the penalty try against Wales? That's a pretty good ratio to start off from against top opposition. The only thing counting against him is he is 26 already so a 10 year carreer is certainly beyond him. He had a very rough life and him getting out and on the narrow road is something of a fairy tale.

You say watch out for Guitone and Thomas (well TT I've had my eye on since the u20 JRWC and now that he is at Racing!). I'd like to add another name. Watch out for another IRB JRWC wizwings in Seabelo Senatla and Cheslin Kolbe. One of them will take over from Habana post RWC 2015.

Both now at WP/Stormers.

Here they are combining for SA at u20 level;
 
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^ good for him then, mental toughness is everything..

Montero is 14 tries in 12 starts (16 matches overall) for Argentina. And he's 22yo...
 
Typical Kolbe;




^ good for him then, mental toughness is everything..

Montero is 14 tries in 12 starts (16 matches overall) for Argentina. And he's 22yo...

A big boy with blindside flank dimensions. He'll get loads more particularly with the likes of Tuculet and Sanchez running the show for Arg and the attacking intent they've shown of late. 14 tries in 12 starts, hey. That's impressive. I was under the impression he's only had a handful of caps, like in the 5 to 7 region.
 
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nice that Kolbe guy is just a Speedy Gonzales. There'll always be a place for the little man in Rugby, because those shorter guys have that low center of gravity, blazing speed. Even South Africa and their all-mass vision will pick a guy like that because what he brings is just priceless.
 
His tries against England as a Baabaa:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HET5aDcICIE
To me Saffycen your post is exactly what I'm talking about in terms of underestimating Gear, you horrible, horrible monster. I'm not out here to prove I'm right, I don't really care about that, it's just ppl don't understand how good this guy is. One on one, you're basically fkd against him with the ball in hand. How many times have I watched a Top 14/H Cup match and you see Gear just outclassing everybody and just found myself going "yep, that's just...that's just Gear for ya...". Runs like hell, makes the break, still going, ppl trying their best to catch him, too elusive, gets away, still going...he's top, top class for a winger. I've really seen what I claim time, and time and time again.
I don't underestimate him at all. Using the words Gear incredible talent and big scary runner is just what you said, but in less words. Did you see him much in New Zealand ? As he was a bit more moblie then and an even better player, I think you rate him in the top 5 because you have your Toulouse tinted glasses on , as not that long a go he wasn't rated in the top 15 wings in the world you said :rolleyes:
But if New Zealand had every winger available would he get in ahead of Savea, Kahui, Ranger, Piutau ? I would probably select him because I just love his style of play but is he any better at running through people than Ranger ?
 
I rate him as a better winger than all of them barring Savea. Kahui is a world class centre and a very safe option on the wing, but he's pretty wasted there in my opinion. Again, Ranger is a centre and was becoming a very good one, but he doesn't actually have all that much pace to him (he used to five years ago...when he was a winger). Piatau is a fullback who looked nice on the right wing, he has the skill set that I'd probably prefer him on the right wing ahead of Gear who never plays there, but I'd take Gear on the left wing because I think he is just a better runner. It's funny but by the time it looked like Gear was going to get selected as a starting left wing, Savea came along. They're pretty similar players except one was 22 and the other was 28.

If people want to rule him out based on not having that many strings to his bow then that's fine, but I'm not sure how George North is in there then. He's just Gear but not as fast or strong..
 
I rate him as a better winger than all of them barring Savea. Kahui is a world class centre and a very safe option on the wing, but he's pretty wasted there in my opinion. Again, Ranger is a centre and was becoming a very good one, but he doesn't actually have all that much pace to him (he used to five years ago...when he was a winger). Piatau is a fullback who looked nice on the right wing, he has the skill set that I'd probably prefer him on the right wing ahead of Gear who never plays there, but I'd take Gear on the left wing because I think he is just a better runner. It's funny but by the time it looked like Gear was going to get selected as a starting left wing, Savea came along. They're pretty similar players except one was 22 and the other was 28.

If people want to rule him out based on not having that many strings to his bow then that's fine, but I'm not sure how George North is in there then. He's just Gear but not as fast or strong..

Because I have seen North do it on a lions tour and quite alot internationally. I agree they are very similar but I would say he is stronger than Gear and he is not as selfish as Gear, the ball normally dies whenever Gear has it where as North does bring in other players. Look they are both great players and Gear is around the top 5, I think only Habana and Savea would be in every top 5 then from 3 to 10 could be any number of players
 
In fairness to Gear, he's never exactly been given consistent opportunities to prove himself to be that good. I would argue he has been better than many of them over a consistent period of time (in fact I think he's probably been the best finisher since around 2008). Fortunately Howlett, Rokocoko and Gear all benefited from playing in good Super Rugby teams. Gear moved from the Hurricanes to the Highlanders and stood out for both of them, despite being very under-performing teams.

Sadly the All Blacks selected wingers after a rough 2009, who were very comfortable under the high ball. I think Gear got tarnished with Rokocoko (who I also love) as a winger who may be exposed in the air, and so didn't really get his opportunities. As we've seen with Savea, the logic has changed a bit to show that you can work on aerial skills.

In fairness to the AB's selectors if Gear had taken the chances he was given they probably would have given him a consistent chance to prove himself............ (I don't necessarily believe that, it is just fun to wind up Nick. Though Gear didn't really take his chances initially I thought he really took his chances on the 2010 end of year tour, so deserved more chances after that).
My biggest issue with Gear has always been his consistency. I do think he had issues on defense (mainly positional), under the high ball, and with his work-rate, but I felt he has largely addressed these issues. My only real concern is his habit of being outstanding one week, then completely disappearing the next. For every strong match he had for the Highlanders (and he had a few) we would get a match where he just seemed to show no enthusiasm at all. Instead of smashing people (both on attack and defense) he seemed to quietly jog around the field and went into contact like a hemophiliac kitten (to quote Nickdnz, though he was referring to a different player). For me this inconsistency seems to be more physiological than physical. Whenever he has played for the NZ Maori he was been quite simply outstanding, and during the 2010 end of tour he played 3-4 excellent test matches in a row. I just want him to go out and smash people every week (like Savea does), as I believe he is capable of this....


I have seen alot of Gear before and during Toulouse, I just think that for a winger in the All Blacks he has scored 8 tries in 14 test which isn't great. I know Huget is worse with 6 in 26 but after the 6 nations he really went up in my opinion. Now thinking about it I would push Visser way up, scores a hell of alot of tries.
So overall Gear incredible talent, big scary runner but hasn't got alot of strings to his bow, which is probably why he hasn't got as many caps as he should. Huget gives you a bit more versatility and has recently found a scoring touch internationally.

I believe it was only 6 tries in 14 tests.....

In saying that I'm actually going to defend Gear's try scoring record at test level. Though 6 tries in 14 tests seems poor for an AB's winger, during the period that he played for the AB's that isn't actually a bad record. One thing to consider was how the AB's used their wings under Graham Henry from 2008-2011. Most test sides became very adept at the drift defense over this period, meaning the AB's wings in general had very little space to display their talents. Rather than continuously pass the ball out wide and limit the space of the wings the AB's played a far more direct style during this period. There was a lot of one-off running close to breakdown (lead by Kaino), with the halfbacks looking to put forward runners into gaps (this really suited the likes of Weepu, Cowan etc). The AB's also attacked a lot in the midfield, with Nonu and SBW particularly prominent as ball runners. While there was some discontent in NZ about our lack of strike weapons out wide I can see why Henry and co. chose the more conservative route - if you aren't able to get the ball to your wings in space it won't matter how big/strong/fast they are, and indeed picking a safer player with a much higher work-rate may be the best option.

The top try scorers during that period were Ma'a Nonu (19 tries), Mils Muliaina (18 tries), and Conrad Smith (15 tries). Kahui's 10 tries placed him in 4th spot, while the regular wings like Jane (9 tries in 32 tests), Sivivatu (8 tries in 24 tests), and Rokocoko (3 tries in 20 tests) all had very low scoring rates by AB's wing standards. Indeed the AB's wings scored 30 tries / 49 tests (0.61 tries/test) versus tier 1 nations over that period, with this accounting for 30/142 (21%) of the AB's tries during this period.

This has changed dramatically since Hansen took over. The AB's have played far more expansively these last few years, with Aaron Smith's passing game the key to this (there is a reason they seldom take him off the field). The AB's seldom attack through the midfield these days (one of the reasons Nonu is no longer a key player IMO), instead look to out-flank the opposition, and have big forwards (Read, Luatua, Messam, Coles) ranging wide straightening the line to draw in defenders and make room for the wings. Since the start of the Hansen era wings have scored 46 in 32 matches (1.44 tries per match), with this accounting for 46/113 (41%) of the AB's tries. To put it simply, the AB's wings are scoring tries at over double the rate since Hansen took over.

What does this mean for Gear? Personally I think Gear would be ideal for the AB's under the current game-plan. He thrives in the open spaces - if Gear had been the AB's starting left wing these last few season I believe his try scoring rate would be almost as impressive as Savea's. I don't see him fitting in on the right wing, but he would clearly be my 2nd choice left wing for the AB's once he returns.
 
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nice that Kolbe guy is just a Speedy Gonzales. There'll always be a place for the little man in Rugby, because those shorter guys have that low center of gravity, blazing speed. Even South Africa and their all-mass vision will pick a guy like that because what he brings is just priceless.

The guy weighs nothing which could be a problem in tighter games! Wiki has him at 85kg which is BS. He was around 70kgs during the JRWC and hasn't bulked up 15kgs since then. My hope for him is that he could fill out a bit without losing that step and be kinda like a SA Jason Robinson who was short but actually a very tough character.

We actually have quite a couple of these types of wings/fullbacks about in the mold of a Gio Aplon. I remember back in my school days the group areas act still meant you effectively had 'white schools' and 'colored schools' and me growing up in something of a dodgy neighborhood meant we played a lot of the colored schools and me being a biggish wing/lock I always dreaded facing off against those tiny wings that gave away literally 30/40 kgs but could turn you inside out and make you look lke an ouph. Not that they were faster, in fact over 60m I'd have them beat but that first 20 is what matters in rugby and if you didn't catch them the moment they got the ball and monster them.. watch out.
 
I believe it was only 6 tries in 14 tests.....

In saying that I'm actually going to defend Gear's try scoring record at test level. Though 6 tries in 14 tests seems poor for an AB's winger, during the period that he played for the AB's that isn't actually a bad record. One thing to consider was how the AB's used their wings under Graham Henry from 2008-2011. Most test sides became very adept at the drift defense over this period, meaning the AB's wings in general had very little space to display their talents. Rather than continuously pass the ball out wide and limit the space of the wings the AB's played a far more direct style during this period. There was a lot of one-off running close to breakdown (lead by Kaino), with the halfbacks looking to put forward runners into gaps (this really suited the likes of Weepu, Cowan etc). The AB's also attacked a lot in the midfield, with Nonu and SBW particularly prominent as ball runners. While there was some discontent in NZ about our lack of strike weapons out wide I can see why Henry and co. chose the more conservative route - if you aren't able to get the ball to your wings in space it won't matter how big/strong/fast they are, and indeed picking a safer player with a much higher work-rate may be the best option.

The top try scorers during that period were Ma'a Nonu (19 tries), Mils Muliaina (18 tries), and Conrad Smith (15 tries). Kahui's 10 tries placed him in 4th spot, while the regular wings like Jane (9 tries in 32 tests), Sivivatu (8 tries in 24 tests), and Rokocoko (3 tries in 20 tests) all had very low scoring rates by AB's wing standards. Indeed the AB's wings scored 30 tries / 49 tests (0.61 tries/test) versus tier 1 nations over that period, with this accounting for 30/142 (21%) of the AB's tries during this period.

This has changed dramatically since Hansen took over. The AB's have played far more expansively these last few years, with Aaron Smith's passing game the key to this (there is a reason they seldom take him off the field). The AB's seldom attack through the midfield these days (one of the reasons Nonu is no longer a key player IMO), instead look to out-flank the opposition, and have big forwards (Read, Luatua, Messam, Coles) ranging wide straightening the line to draw in defenders and make room for the wings. Since the start of the Hansen era wings have scored 46 in 32 matches (1.44 tries per match), with this accounting for 46/113 (41%) of the AB's tries. To put it simply, the AB's wings are scoring tries at over double the rate since Hansen took over.

What does this mean for Gear? Personally I think Gear would be ideal for the AB's under the current game-plan. He thrives in the open spaces - if Gear had been the AB's starting left wing these last few season I believe his try scoring rate would be almost as impressive as Savea's. I don't see him fitting in on the right wing, but he would clearly be my 2nd choice left wing for the AB's once he returns.
You Sir, have won the argument
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You Sir, have won the argument
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The sad thing is that I've had those stats sitting on my computer (for no good reason apart from my own curiosity) for the last two weeks, and have just been waiting for a chance to use them :unsure:

Don't tell Nickdnz I said something nice about Gear either. It will ruin my reputation.
 
i prefer see him with fiji during his whole career than with the black shirt for few test matchs
Nadolo 15 cap 13 tries (Fiji record 20 tries) he can be the best try scorer of all time for fiji
 
Everyone knows when you go to France you no longer matter anymore :p.

But I agree Hosea Gear was never given the recognition he probably deserved even while he was in New Zealand. After 2010 (which he scored in every match) Graham Henry said he was probably the form winger in the world. Which is why I was somewhat irate that Drinky McGuildford was selected ahead of him for the 2011 RWC (with Gear only getting two matches in 2011 to try and stake a claim) and other players were selected as wing out of position in the 2011 RWC. To be fair to the critics, he never had a great scoring record against Tri Nations teams (in part because he was used so sparingly).

As for his career in Toulouse, he's been pretty great. He's playing more like he did when with the Hurricanes (actually getting space to run the ball, rather than being used 100x a game to try and crash the ball). What I genuinely think he does better than any other winger in the world is beat a man on the outside with pace and power. He just backs himself. He also tore England up recently for the Baabaas as you mention.

No no no... SGH said That gear is the best winger in the world... and i agree, Gear at that stage was and probably still is... His defense is immense, his kicking non existent (but a winger does not need to kick :p), his ability under the high ball was not good and for those reasons Kahui was favored over Gear in the RWC. Gear has immense speed and power... i can still hear myself screaming when Gear got the ball vs Ireland on June 23 2012... After Christian Cullen, Gear must be my 2nd favorite player followed by Cory Jane and Ben Smith... ok this is not turning into a Gear topic and not Ndolo, so on that Ndolo issue, no thanx, not him or Robbie Frueueueuen, hope i spelled that correctly. So please bring Gear back Mr Hansen, sir... imagine a Aaron Smith, Dan Carter, Julian Savea, Malakai Fekitoa, Conrad Smith, Hosea Gear, Ben Smith backline....
 
Club/Domestic - Nadolo is a 11.
International - Nadolo is a 12, 13, on occasions 11 for injury cover, but predominately a center.

But it would have been not bad to see him in the black jersey, but he needs work on his turn and chase, under the highball, defense and defense positioning, overall-set needs some work as well, but we all know he is a raw powered strong ball carrier, exceptional pace for someone who weigh 125kgs.

But Savea > Gear > Nadolo.
 
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Last season top try scorers for Super rugby Nadolo, Aviva premiership Goneva, Top 14 Talebula and IRB Sevens series Viriviri. This season Ratini currently sits at the top in top 14 followed by Talebula, Goneva currently second in aviva premiership. And you guys think the top 5 wingers are either All Blcks, Boks or Aussie and French. Any of these Fiji wingers would walk into the All Blacks and Boks. We all know in his prime Caucau not only would walk in but he would be the best All Black winger ever yet no one even remember Vunibaka who was the only non All Black player in the Crusaders dream team. He too would have been an All Black.

Curently top 10 wingers:

Ratini
Viriviri
Talebula
Goneva
Nadolo
Savea
Habana
North
Rokoduguni(Fiji born just been named in England squad for EOYT)
Hendricks(excuse the spelling but its the boks winger who used to play sevens)

Put it this way when the IRB announced the loophole due to olympics for players to switch nations most nation would have loved to have Rokocoko or Sivivatu on their team. The Fiji coach when asked if he would like them he diplomatically said we are alright on that department but if they want to come try out they are welcome. In other words in terms of wingers competition Fiji has probably got the most depth and hardest competition for those positions.
 
Last season top try scorers for Super rugby Nadolo, Aviva premiership Goneva, Top 14 Talebula and IRB Sevens series Viriviri. This season Ratini currently sits at the top in top 14 followed by Talebula, Goneva currently second in aviva premiership. And you guys think the top 5 wingers are either All Blcks, Boks or Aussie and French. Any of these Fiji wingers would walk into the All Blacks and Boks. We all know in his prime Caucau not only would walk in but he would be the best All Black winger ever yet no one even remember Vunibaka who was the only non All Black player in the Crusaders dream team. He too would have been an All Black.

Curently top 10 wingers:

Ratini
Viriviri
Talebula
Goneva
Nadolo
Savea
Habana
North
Rokoduguni(Fiji born just been named in England squad for EOYT)
Hendricks(excuse the spelling but its the boks winger who used to play sevens)

Put it this way when the IRB announced the loophole due to olympics for players to switch nations most nation would have loved to have Rokocoko or Sivivatu on their team. The Fiji coach when asked if he would like them he diplomatically said we are alright on that department but if they want to come try out they are welcome. In other words in terms of wingers competition Fiji has probably got the most depth and hardest competition for those positions.

And you're not bias or anything :lol:.

There are plenty of Fijian wingers I love. Vunibaka, Bobo, Caucaunibuca, Delasau, Nalaga etc. Barring maybe Caucaunibuca (who may have been the best winger ever if he wasn't such a fat, stupid waste of talent) I'd easily take Habana and Savea over any of the rest. Funny Henry Speight misses out on your list of best current wingers, I'd take him over Ratini, Viriviri, Talebula, Goneva, Rokoduguni and Nadolo. As for your comment of Vunibaka being an All Black, he was technically in the Crusaders for two years while he could have been picked for the All Blacks, and wasn't.
 
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It's not bias when it's the truth. Savea is overrated, he's not even fast. He's more like Nalaga brute force and a bit of speed and as you can see Nalaga is not on my list of top wingers. Nadolo played less match then Savea in the super rugby last season yet still topped the try scoring chart. He's bigger and stronger. They probably have the same pace so what's Savea's excuse? Maybe he didn't get the same delivery as go forward ball as he does in the All Blacks but then again imagine if Nadolo was on that wing he'll be even more better as he's proven on the super rugby. I can even bring up the stats for the super rugby about line breaks, meters gained etc to show you that Savea ain't that special.
If you put Savea in a foot race with the Fijian wingers he'll be eating dust mate. Put him in sevens where there's more space Viriviri and Ratini will eat him for breakfast.
As for Habana the only thing he's got is pace and the Fijian wingers especially Ratini and Viriviri are better in that department. I reckon Viriviri and Ratini would have been better than Rokocoko and Sivivatu if they were the All Black wingers. I reckon even our backrows like Qera and Waqaniburotu can match Savea for pace and that's embarrassing.
 
Him not being fast is based on what exactly? Sorry if I don't take your word for it, but I've seen him run and he is very fast. His try scoring record is better than any Fijian players at international level (in fact his scoring ratio is ridiculous). Sure he's playing for the All Blacks, but Nadolo has his record playing teams in the PNC...and yes, Savea's stats have plenty to do with playing for the Hurricanes. Caleb Ralph has scored the third most tries in Super Rugby history on the back of playing for the Crusaders and no one would call him a great wing ;). I can't think of many Fijian wings with a great all-round game either. Good your proud of your team, but it's difficult to take you seriously when it seems all the best wings are apparently Fijian..

I also love how Ratini and Viriviri are currently the best in the world. They've played professional XVs for what? Maybe a year? (don't know how neither of them won an IRB 7s world series considering how great they are...). I'm not sure of any Tigers fan who would put Gonova there..
 
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