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[Six Nations 2018] Round 2: England vs Wales (10/02/2018)

Fair play, been a good thread so far... been a bit quiet around here of late and last weekend nobody had much to go on.
 
Reiser99 said:
I think this is the problem here. You are basing your opinion that Wales are better than Ireland because of one game, yet say that Wales can win tomorrow because it is just one game and one game doesn't always reflect current standings. You can't have it both ways. Either rankings are decided on single games or you accept it is about overall form and that while Wales played well to beat Ireland last year, Ireland are in fact better than Wales at the moment.
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well wales havent lost to ireland for 4 yrs in 6 nations (2 wins and a draw) Ireland are ahead on the rankings (3rd v 6th) but looking at the form of scarlets and wales, Id say wales will win in dublin this time , they have a bit more class in the backs imo
 
Reiser99 said:
I think this is the problem here. You are basing your opinion that Wales are better than Ireland because of one game, yet say that Wales can win tomorrow because it is just one game and one game doesn't always reflect current standings. You can't have it both ways. Either rankings are decided on single games or you accept it is about overall form and that while Wales played well to beat Ireland last year, Ireland are in fact better than Wales at the moment.
Click to expand...
well wales havent lost to ireland for 4 yrs in 6 nations (2 wins and a draw) Ireland are ahead on the rankings (3rd v 6th) but looking at the form of scarlets and wales, Id say wales will win in dublin this time , they have a bit more class in the backs imo
 
NickBD said:
Wales fans still hanging on to that, which was over 2 years ago.

We're 18 months away from a world cup I'd be very concerned if you think your team is going through as transition now. You can diminish England's wins and tournament wins all you like if it makes you feel better. Last year we did lose to Ireland but we also won the ***le.

See this is what I mean overreacting. A good 6 month spell for Scarlets and a couple of decent wins against SA/Scotland and all of a sudden you have more potential then England. In what world can you look at both set ups, first teams and thing yeah Wales have way more potential.
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Nah its based on more than that. 3 yrs beating boks, 4 yrs undefeated against the irish, just 1 defeat to the scots in over a decade, just 1 defeat to the french in 7 years, wales have been consistently strong for many years. wales v england has been very close for years and since welsh regional rugby changed welsh pro rugby in 2003 the score is just 10-8 to the english thats pretty tight. Ok looking recently wales are 6th in the world with a load of lions, a very settled coaching team, a bit stale but at least the time has evolved now. the scarlets winning the league and making european quarters now is a factor, cardiff making their european quarter is a factor, the style of play the strength at set piece and breakdown are all factors too.
 
truthteller said:
well wales havent lost to ireland for 4 yrs in 6 nations (2 wins and a draw) Ireland are ahead on the rankings (3rd v 6th) but looking at the form of scarlets and wales, Id say wales will win in dublin this time , they have a bit more class in the backs imo
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At the risk of repeating myself you are looking at a specific example to justify a broad sweeping statement. Yes Wales may have the better form against Ireland and might beat them again this year, but that doesn't make them the better team overall. It's not as simple as beat the team above you and take their place. It's how you perform over the whole year against a variety of teams and that is where Ireland are better then Wales. I have no problem with you saying you think you'll win the specific game against Ireland based on past form, it's the way it is used to justify a sweeping view point, that Wales are better than Ireland and ignoring the other evidence that does not support it.
 
The Alpha Bro said:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017–18_European_Rugby_Champions_Cup#Ranking_of_pool_leaders_and_runners-up

Every team in Leinster's pool is currently top of their domestic league too. Both have 11 wins in the Pro 14 with the Scarlets ahead on losing bonus points, and the Pro 14 log means very little Scarlets were 3rd behind Leinster and Munster last year. 9 months ago Scarlets were better after hitting a rich vein of form when it mattered and Leinster had a pretty miserable finish. In the 2017/18 season they're not better unless you value 2 losing bonus points against Ulster and the Cheetahs over Leinster's vastly superior European performance, bookies have Leinster as favourites for both competitions this year as well which I think says it all. This should be put on hold for two weeks time when its actually slightly relevant though.

As a genuine neutral who wishes both nations the opposite of success this thread has read to me like the Welsh are trying to convince themselves they're "elite" while trying to drag the English side down to a place where they can meet in the middle. I've been in that position before as an Ireland fan when nothing but your gut feeling can really convince you that your side has a chance, NZ in Chicago and Aus in the 2011 RWC were examples of this so there's obvious hope, 2016 v England was another example of it though. I do hope Wales win, its better for Ireland, I just don't see it happening in Twickers.
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You can play well all season but if you don't do
Reiser99 said:
At the risk of repeating myself you are looking at a specific example to justify a broad sweeping statement. Yes Wales may have the better form against Ireland and might beat them again this year, but that doesn't make them the better team overall. It's not as simple as beat the team above you and take their place. It's how you perform over the whole year against a variety of teams and that is where Ireland are better then Wales. I have no problem with you saying you think you'll win the specific game against Ireland based on past form, it's the way it is used to justify a sweeping view point, that Wales are better than Ireland and ignoring the other evidence that does not support it.
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bu the same token if England beat the all blacks next then you can't say your better than them
 
Reiser99 said:
At the risk of repeating myself you are looking at a specific example to justify a broad sweeping statement. Yes Wales may have the better form against Ireland and might beat them again this year, but that doesn't make them the better team overall. It's not as simple as beat the team above you and take their place. It's how you perform over the whole year against a variety of teams and that is where Ireland are better then Wales. I have no problem with you saying you think you'll win the specific game against Ireland based on past form, it's the way it is used to justify a sweeping view point, that Wales are better than Ireland and ignoring the other evidence that does not support it.
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yes ireland are worthy of 3rd place but wales will beat them and will rise above them later this year, why? They have better players. More dangerous backs and better at the breakdown too
 
truthteller said:
yes ireland are worthy of 3rd place but wales will beat them and will rise above them later this year, why? They have better players. More dangerous backs and better at the breakdown too
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.................................................... Ok Mystic Meg.
The Alpha Bro said:
This has been a surreal 48 hours for TRF...
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Mate what do you say we go on that gaycation we always talked about and leave this mad shite behind?
 
2813400_xbig-lnd.jpg



Wales play in red kit to try and capture some of our glory
 

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