England 2023/24

[BPM]

No thanks for us, but I'd feel quite differently if switches to Fiji.

 

[Crash Hamster]

No thanks for us, but I'd feel quite differently if switches to inside centre.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

We've got form for parachuting foreign 8s in as well.

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

We've got form for parachuting foreign 8s in as well.

Hoskins is better than Temina or Shields tho

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

And we brought Waldrum in and you could say the same about the way Morgan was pulled across from wales.

Although I loved Morgan, massively underrated.

 

[Geordie]

We dont need him with CCS and Willis developing nicely.

 

[Geordie]

And we brought Waldrum in and you could say the same about the way Morgan was pulled across from wales.

Although I loved Morgan, massively underrated.

So many what ifs about Morgan. On his day was a real class act.

 

[NotTooAmused]

12 tries and 8 assists from back row. Must be a reason he's not getting picked...

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Apparently defence and workrate is in the toilet

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Hoskins is better than Temina or Shields tho

Hopefully lessons have been learned following the hype around Shields and his fast tracking - decent player but not at the level we'd been led to believe. And 8's the least of our problems anyway, even if I doubt Earl will be the very long term solution.

 

[Geordie]

Back row is going to be a real dilemma...

Id say set in stone is

4 - Itoje
5 - Martin
6 - Chessum

Meaning 2 places (and reserve) being fought over by :
Chandler Cunningham-South (Harlequins, 7 caps)
Sam Underhill (Bath Rugby, 38 caps)
Tom Curry (Sale Sharks, 53 caps)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, 5 caps)
Ben Earl (Saracens, 33 caps)
Alex Dombrandt (Harlequins, 17 caps)

I dont see how you can drop Earl at the moment...hes consistently one of our best ...even if hes not seen as a "long term 8"
CCS is the developing powerhouse who surely commands the bench spot...and covers 6 and 8

So that leaves...the 7 spot for:
Sam Underhill (Bath Rugby, 38 caps)
Tom Curry (Sale Sharks, 53 caps)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, 5 caps)
Alex Dombrandt (Harlequins, 17 caps)

Tough choice to make bar Dombrandt who shouldnt be there IMO.

Underhill for me...his destructive power is just too much to not include.

So
4 - Itoje
5 - Martin
6 - Chessum
7 - Underhill
8 - Earl

Agree or disagree...?

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

5 - Martin
6 - Chessum

Beyond Itoje, none of them are set in stone imo - Martin more than Chessum, but he is by no means nailed on to play 6 imo.

 

[BPM]

And we brought Waldrum in and you could say the same about the way Morgan was pulled across from wales.

Although I loved Morgan, massively underrated.

Except Morgan was only ever Wales qualified on residency. Not a poach in any way shape or from.

 

[BPM]

Back row is going to be a real dilemma...

Id say set in stone is

4 - Itoje
5 - Martin
6 - Chessum

Meaning 2 places (and reserve) being fought over by :
Chandler Cunningham-South (Harlequins, 7 caps)
Sam Underhill (Bath Rugby, 38 caps)
Tom Curry (Sale Sharks, 53 caps)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, 5 caps)
Ben Earl (Saracens, 33 caps)
Alex Dombrandt (Harlequins, 17 caps)

I dont see how you can drop Earl at the moment...hes consistently one of our best ...even if hes not seen as a "long term 8"
CCS is the developing powerhouse who surely commands the bench spot...and covers 6 and 8

So that leaves...the 7 spot for:
Sam Underhill (Bath Rugby, 38 caps)
Tom Curry (Sale Sharks, 53 caps)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, 5 caps)
Alex Dombrandt (Harlequins, 17 caps)

Tough choice to make bar Dombrandt who shouldnt be there IMO.

Underhill for me...his destructive power is just too much to not include.

So
4 - Itoje
5 - Martin
6 - Chessum
7 - Underhill
8 - Earl

Agree or disagree...?

Disagree. Earl was poor in NZ. He has credit in the bank and is the man in possession, but I'd strongly have considered playing Willis at 8. Mental he's not in the squad. He should be there over Dombrandt.

In recent England games, CCS has done more to warrant keeping his place than Earl, but I agree Chessum will likely come back in at 6.

 

[LIONSxv]

I dislike the idea of Chessum at 6 with a passion. CCS carrying and tackling far outweigh SB line out fetish and compulsion to stack the line out.

CCS is 6 foot 5 so should be a very good 3rd jumper, even if a bit heavy.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Kinda feel the same,
Chessums have some good performances at 6 so I wouldn't be mortified to see him there again, but would rather we focus on him at lock and pick 2 of him/Martin/Itoje with the third on the bench

 

[Scotty]

Kinda feel the same,
Chessums have some good performances at 6 so I wouldn't be mortified to see him there again, but would rather we focus on him at lock and pick 2 of him/Martin/Itoje with the third on the bench

My thoughts 2 itoje/Martin with Chessum off the bench is strong and then 3 of CCS Earl Curry Underhill Dombrant, 4 of these in the backrow.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Worrying thought, with Coles out injured, does Chessum at 6 mean Ewels on the bench

Or two back row on the bench.

 

[Reiser99]

Worrying thought, with Coles out injured, does Chessum at 6 mean Ewels on the bench

Or two back row on the bench.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Beyond Itoje, none of them are set in stone imo - Martin more than Chessum, but he is by no means nailed on to play 6 imo.

Itoje will be set in stone, but should he be?

Traditionally thought of as our best scrummaging lock, but now hard to think that Martin doesn't provide more power.

I'd say Chessum is just as good in the line out if not slightly better. Bit taller too which is always helpful.

Martin's probably better carrying in the tight, similarly Chessum in the wider channels.

In the tackle Martin probably hits hardest.

Itoje's best at winning turnovers, but offset by the number of pens conceded.

Over 80 mins Itoje (on a good day) probably has the highest overall work rate.

In terms of impact Itoje's been a constant but can sometimes go quiet in terms of his own performance and impact on others. The team simply seems to look better with Martin in it, it may be that his simple agggression inspires people more than Itoje's more cerebral approach.

Itoje has the experience and is probably the best all rounder. But he's a hybrid. Would you take him over Martin as a TH lock? Or over Chessum as the athlete and line out specialist? What's the best combination?

I think there's a place in the team for both Martin and Chessum. They complement each other well, are a club combo and I'd love to see them given a shot in the row. Won't happen, obvs.

At 6 carry on investing in CCS. Power with and without the ball and an improving line out option. Work to do on skills, but don't wait until he's the 'finished article', he can already contribute a lot.

Underhill at 7. Nuff said.

Earl at 8 for now. Summer I suspect was more tiredness than anything else, but in time I want to see a bigger guy there whether T Willis or CCS.