[2014 Super Rugby] New Zealand conference

[TRF Mr Fish]

[TABLE="class: grid, width: 500, align: left"]
<tbody>[TR]
[TD][/TD]
[TD]Blues[/TD]
[TD]Chiefs[/TD]
[TD]Hurricanes[/TD]
[TD]Crusaders[/TD]
[TD]Highlanders[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]1[/TD]
[TD]Woodcock[/TD]
[TD]Mackintosh[/TD]
[TD]Toomaga-Allen[/TD]
[TD]Crockett[/TD]
[TD]Fia[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]Mealamu[/TD]
[TD]Schwalger[/TD]
[TD]Coles[/TD]
[TD]Flynn[/TD]
[TD]Coltman[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]3[/TD]
[TD]Faumuina[/TD]
[TD]Afeaki[/TD]
[TD]Franks[/TD]
[TD]Franks[/TD]
[TD]King[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]Donnely[/TD]
[TD]Fitzgerald[/TD]
[TD]Thrush[/TD]
[TD]Romano[/TD]
[TD]Thorn[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]Retallick[/TD]
[TD]Retallick[/TD]
[TD]Broadhurst[/TD]
[TD]Whitelock[/TD]
[TD]Bekhuis[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]6[/TD]
[TD]Luatua[/TD]
[TD]Messam[/TD]
[TD]Shields[/TD]
[TD]Whitelock[/TD]
[TD]Evans[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]7[/TD]
[TD]Braid[/TD]
[TD]Cane[/TD]
[TD]Savea[/TD]
[TD]McCaw[/TD]
[TD]Hardie[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]8[/TD]
[TD]Kaino[/TD]
[TD]Thompson[/TD]
[TD]Vito[/TD]
[TD]Read[/TD]
[TD]Manu[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]9[/TD]
[TD]Weepu[/TD]
[TD]Kerr-Barlow[/TD]
[TD]Perenara[/TD]
[TD]Ellis[/TD]
[TD]Smith[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]10[/TD]
[TD]Kerr[/TD]
[TD]Cruden[/TD]
[TD]Barrett[/TD]
[TD]Slade[/TD]
[TD]Sopoaga[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]11[/TD]
[TD]Piutau[/TD]
[TD]Tikoirotuma[/TD]
[TD]Savea[/TD]
[TD]Guildford[/TD]
[TD]Osborne[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]12[/TD]
[TD]Nonu[/TD]
[TD]Horrell[/TD]
[TD]Bateman[/TD]
[TD]Taylor[/TD]
[TD]Treeby[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]13[/TD]
[TD]Saili[/TD]
[TD]Fruean[/TD]
[TD]Smith[/TD]
[TD]Crotty[/TD]
[TD]Emery[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]14[/TD]
[TD]Piutau[/TD]
[TD]Nanai-Williams[/TD]
[TD]Jane[/TD]
[TD]Nadolo[/TD]
[TD]Popoali'i[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]15[/TD]
[TD]Marshall[/TD]
[TD]Marshall[/TD]
[TD]Taylor[/TD]
[TD]Dagg[/TD]
[TD]Smith[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]16[/TD]
[TD]Parsons[/TD]
[TD]Elliot[/TD]
[TD]Dixon[/TD]
[TD]Funnell[/TD]
[TD]Mitchell[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]17[/TD]
[TD]Ta'avao[/TD]
[TD]Tameifuna[/TD]
[TD]Schwalger[/TD]
[TD]Moody[/TD]
[TD]Hames[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]18[/TD]
[TD]Tuipulotu[/TD]
[TD]Symons[/TD]
[TD]Reddish[/TD]
[TD]Bird[/TD]
[TD]Franklin[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]19[/TD]
[TD]Barrett[/TD]
[TD]Latimer[/TD]
[TD]Lam[/TD]
[TD]Todd[/TD]
[TD]Ioane[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]20[/TD]
[TD]Gibson-Park[/TD]
[TD]Pulu[/TD]
[TD]Smylie[/TD]
[TD]Heinz[/TD]
[TD]Tanaka[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]21[/TD]
[TD]Noakes[/TD]
[TD]Anscombe[/TD]
[TD]Banks[/TD]
[TD]Bleyendaal[/TD]
[TD]Parker[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]22[/TD]
[TD]Willison[/TD]
[TD]Muliaina[/TD]
[TD]Leiua[/TD]
[TD]Whitelock[/TD]
[TD]Fekitoa[/TD]
[/TR]
</tbody>[/TABLE]

 

[Kiwiwomble]

i would actually expect stanley to start for us with baker on the bench, then smith can move to midfield if needed and baker comes on at 15

 

[ABs2011]

Somehow the Highlanders getting Fekitoa slipped under my radar. Good signing for them and NZ rugby IMHO.

So for me on paper (and barring injuries):
Crusaders>Blues>Chiefs>Hurricanes>Highlanders.
In reality:
Chiefs>Crusaders>Blues>Hurricanes>Highlanders.

Thoughts?

 

[Kiwiwomble]

if we can keep the majority of that squad fit we might do better than i thought, pretty well rounded....just not a hell of a lot of depth out wide, franklin and evans are going to be big next year.

I actually think one of our bigger problems has not been the squad but how hard Joesph thrashes the team in training...they seem exhausted when they run ON the field...if brown can help temper that aspect of training and these guys can gel better than the "stars" did last year then i think we can work our way back to mid table

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

Interesting that Nathan Harris, the BoP hooker called into train with the All Blacks last season has not made any of the squads. Likewise for Ged Robinson (who has WTG spot with the Highlanders), who somehow thought he had a chance of making the All Blacks.

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

John Kirwan wants Gareth Anscombe to return to the Blues

http://www.espnscrum.com/super-rugby-2014/rugby/story/204939.html

Blues coach Sir John Kirwan would like to re-sign Gareth Anscombe, describing as "short-sighted" his decision to de-list the playmaker shortly after his appointment in July 2012.

Kirwan signed Chris Noakes and Baden Kerr as replacements, leaving the Auckland playmaker in the cold after one Super Rugby season in which he scored 99 points in 10 games. But Anscombe had the last laugh, joining the Chiefs and winning the Super Rugby 2013 ***le.

Anscombe was criticised for perceived defensive frailities, but he has improved with the Chiefs, for whom he is first-choice goal-kicker and helps Aaron Cruden launch a two-pronged attack. Kirwan, meanwhile, is still searching for a long-term option in the Blues No.10 jersey and he has since signed Benji Marshall from rugby league as he seeks answers.

"It's been interesting watching Gareth and I'm happy to say that I might have got some things wrong," Kirwan told Sportal. "The door is always open. He's just re-signed with the Chiefs for one more year so I'm really happy to look at [bringing him back in 2015] for sure."

Kirwan said he had planned to re-assess Anscombe's abilities while he was playing for Auckland in the ITM Cup, but the player did not feature once for Wayne Pivac's side after undergoing off-season surgery on both shoulders.

Anscombe has thrived under the Chiefs culture created by coach Dave Rennie, but he would be able to play in his preferred five-eighth position on a permanent basis if he returned to the Blues. Sportal understands, however, that Anscombe is unlikely to return to play under Kirwan after a source close to the Auckland-born player said that details of a discussion between the pair had damaged their relationship.

"Wayne Pivac pulled Gareth aside at training and told him he was about to receive some bad news, but I don't think was prepared for the things JK [Kirwan] said to him," the source told Sportal on condition of anonymity. "JK basically said to Gareth 'you lack courage and you've got no clue about how to run a football team'. He even told Gareth to go and have a look at Chris Noakes' defensive statistics to justify why he had been dropped. Gareth came out of that meeting extremely upset and hurt by the things that were said to him. He didn't deserve that."

Anscombe was uncomfortable speaking about the matter, but he told Sportal: "They wouldn't deal with a player like that here [at the Chiefs]. That's for sure."

Kirwan dismissed claims of a personal fallout, insisting Anscombe's lack of experience forced him to look elsewhere for a 'mature' alternative. "I never actually compared him to anyone else," Kirwan said. "What I did say to him in that meeting was that he needs to fix up his game defensively and that's probably the biggest part of his game that he needs to improve. I didn't question his courage. I said to him 'why aren't you doing those things technically?'.

"But those meetings are private between the player and I, and I say a lot of things to those guys. Sometimes the things that I say are things that people don't want to hear, and sometimes they are. I've got no issues with Gareth but I can only do one thing - tell people the truth the way I see it.

"Did I make a mistake axing Gareth?

"Possibly.

"He had a good season at fullback and I'm really looking forward to seeing him playing 10 for the Chiefs."

Kirwan also poured water on rumours that Ma'a Nonu had influenced Anscombe's axing before he reneged on a handshake agreement and signed for the Highlanders instead. The 87-Test veteran, who was granted permission by the New Zealand Rugby Union to find a temporary home overseas, has since recommitted to the Blues but is no longer in a position to make such demands.

"I take advice from a lot of people but then it's my decision in the end. I was pretty clear," Kirwan said.

Kirwan first met Anscombe in 2011 when the latter helped the New Zealand Under 20 side win its fourth consecutive world championship in Italy. Then he was full of praise for the North Harbour, Blues and New Zealand schools representative, but he believed the player needed to display
stronger leadership qualities if he were to step up to Super Rugby.

Kirwan said the idea behind dropping Anscombe was "to see how he would respond to pressure", and he had hoped the player would remain in the side's wider training group. But his methods were lost on Anscombe, who instead felt unfairly treated and went about proving his worth in a rival team.

"Sometimes the truth hurts and you can't package it," Kirwan said. "So I understand he's a young man and that would hurt.

And I did it to other people as well, and it's a tough part of our job. I was pretty tough on him but this is a tough industry. "He had been signed to us on a deal that was a mature deal. So it was about saying to him 'I need you to improve here, I want you to stay a part of the wider training group but if you want to go I understand'.

"If the player hasn't received the message that I intended him to get, like if he's really upset and offended by it, then he didn't hear the messages that I wanted to give him. It's not personal. I'm really happy that Gareth has been successful and if he wants to come back I'm happy to have him. But none of his people have spoken to me."

Anscombe and the Blues seem to be a logical option for both parties, but clearly a significant amount of water needs to go under the bridge before the reunion can take place.

It sounds like Anscombe isn't particularly keen to return after the way he was treated. That being said, how long will he be comfortable playing second fiddle to Aaron Cruden?

 

[lynam1104]

Kirwin seems bloody terrible at managing players.

 

[nickdnz]

To lose Anscombe was just horrific to be honest - especially when his big replacement was Noakes (very ironic if Kirwan was using Noakes as an example of defense!).

 

[Amobokoboko]

If I where Anscombe I would stay at the Chiefs, and try to win a couple more championships. The Blues might offer him more playing time. But at the chiefs he had a massive part in winning this years ***le.

 

[tenpm]

I still haven't quite forgiven JK for the idiotic decision to drop Anscombe, and I don't think Anscombe has, either. He was clearly the best option for the Blues. He's no match for Carter or Cruden in terms of attack or defence, but he's 22 for crying out loud. Think of where he could have been right now if he had had proper game time at 10 this year.

 

[Patchey]

I remember being astounded by his dropping at the time and I still don't quite believe it happened. If the article is correct that JK wanted a more 'mature option at ten then I think it is pretty laughable he ended up with Kerr and Noakes last season.

Can't see Anscombe back. Only thing I can imagine tempting his is if there was a potential route into the All Black through playing more time at ten for the Blues. As the ten jersey is already oversubscribed that is pretty unlikely.

 

[jessta]

I doubt he will return after his treatment. In kirwans defense noakes was signed up before his tenure by pat lam, so he took up one squad place, and kirwan keen to rack up kerr gave him the other spot with the intent of also retaining anscombe in the wider training group. in hindsight he should of put kerr in the wider training group and kept anscombe as a full squad member. how he didnt think any other team would sign up anscombe is ludicrous.

 

[smartcooky]

Will Benji Marshall play at 10 for the Blues?

I wonder what he thinks of all this?

I remember being astounded by his dropping at the time and I still don't quite believe it happened. If the article is correct that JK wanted a more 'mature option at ten then I think it is pretty laughable he ended up with Kerr and Noakes last season.

Can't see Anscombe back. Only thing I can imagine tempting his is if there was a potential route into the All Black through playing more time at ten for the Blues. As the ten jersey is already oversubscribed that is pretty unlikely.

Anscombe's only other possible pathway to the All Blacks is as a fullback utility option (which he has played as for the Chiefs) but that slot is pretty much sewn up too...

Beauden Barrett (1st 5/8 / fullback)
Cory Jane (wing / fullback)
Charles Piutau (wing / fullback)

 

[Darwin]

Will Benji Marshall play at 10 for the Blues?

I wonder what he thinks of all this?



Anscombe's only other possible pathway to the All Blacks is as a fullback utility option (which he has played as for the Chiefs) but that slot is pretty much sewn up too...

Beauden Barrett (1st 5/8 / fullback)
Cory Jane (wing / fullback)
Charles Piutau (wing / fullback)

Don't forgot Ben Smith (fullback / wing / centre / God)

 

[smartcooky]

don't forgot Ben Smith (fullback / wing / centre / god) :d

Fixed that for you

 

[Patchey]

Will Benji Marshall play at 10 for the Blues?

I wonder what he thinks of all this?



Anscombe's only other possible pathway to the All Blacks is as a fullback utility option (which he has played as for the Chiefs) but that slot is pretty much sewn up too...

Beauden Barrett (1st 5/8 / fullback)
Cory Jane (wing / fullback)
Charles Piutau (wing / fullback)

Exactly. So with an All Black spot seemingly off limits for the time being he's going to stay with the Chiefs, where he clearly enjoys himself, is improving as a player and has a better chance to win silverware.

As for Benji, he has said he considers 15 his best option but I saw an interview with JK the other week when Benji as a 10/15 was discussed, so who knows?

 

[jessta]

The pre season will be very important for the blues and benji, they will assess him at 10 and 15 and see how he goes in each

 

[jessta]

Hika eliot needs to have a big year in 2014, with hore packing up shop theres a free spot in abs camp up for grabs. If he can just fix hes throws hel be in with a shot

 

[Kiwiwomble]

how old is hika?

 

[steblin]

Will Benji Marshall play at 10 for the Blues?

I wonder what he thinks of all this?



Anscombe's only other possible pathway to the All Blacks is as a fullback utility option (which he has played as for the Chiefs) but that slot is pretty much sewn up too...

Beauden Barrett (1st 5/8 / fullback)
Cory Jane (wing / fullback)
Charles Piutau (wing / fullback)

You've got to think Benji is thinking exactly the same too, his best chance at an AB's jersey will be a utility back / impact player who can play inside centre, wing, fullback and 1st 5/8 at a pinch.

From a selfish perspective I'm too excited to see a back three of Benji, Halai and Piutau to consider him for 10 ;-)

In terms of how JK handled Anscombe, I think everyone knows he handled it badly and he's good in the sense that he admits his mistakes, however it requires both parties to want to reconcile and Anscombe is in a good place with the Chiefs at the minute. Lets face it, in the first half of the season especially, he played a big role for them. The way JK went about it just speaks of someone new coming into the club and trying to make his mark, unfortunately he took the wrong tact with this one, but you can't win them all!