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England vs USA Eagles

Ludlow is rank average.... considering England's current options on the flanks.
If he (or any of them) had been around and competing 10-15 years ago - we'd have had a far better backrow.

These things are cyclical I guess. Some generations have a glut of back rowers, some of props, some of centres; whilst another generation might be struggling to find one upper-international class player for that unit.

Without having your pick of the very best athletes produced, there's no real way of evening that out.
I agree to some extent … I wouldn't have picked Ludlow for the squad, let alone for a start and the captain's armband, but he must be showing something Eddie likes.

I actually think Ludlow is good enough for test rugby - I'm just not sure how he makes the squad when the likes of Tom Curry and Jack Willis are available.

There's something here that reminds me a bit of Mark Wilson. Not necessarily in style of play - more from the POV, that he's the least glamorous option, but one who other players look up to as a leader and for serious graft. If Ludlow can show he's a younger version of Wilson, that's not a bad thing.
 
Umm … there are 12 uncapped players in the 23 and 8 in the Starting XV. It may be against Tier 2 opposition, but this is a test match, not an A game.
Agreed, we've got all of 2 players who are regular starters; 1 who could be called a regular bencher, and 1 other who's a semi-regular bencher.
You'd be hard pressed to find a less experienced international team.

You could argue that Slade and Underhill are wasted caps, as we already know everything we need to about them - but you need a leadership group of some description; players who are comfortable at international level and won't get caught like a rabbit in the headlights, and allow others to play around them. Usually, you're looking for that in the spine of the team - from the spine of this team there's not one single capped international.

Out of 23 players, 21 of them could be classed as "unknown quantities" at test level.


ETA: Of course, that doesn't mean I'm necessarily happy with the selection; but criticism based on having too much experience is just... weird.

ETA2:
Back in March, my suggested team for USA & Canada was:

IMO it should be about development of the fringe, getting game-time into fringe squad members, and running the rule over players who might break through in time for the RWC.
But keeping an eye on it always being preferable to bring new players in alongside the established where possible, there absolutely needs to be players who know the patterns and requirements.

1. Genge
2. LCD
3. Stuart
4. Ewels
5. Hill
6. Willis
7. Underhill
8. Dombrandt

9. Spencer/Robson
10. Ford
11. Cokanasiga
12. Devoto
13. Slade
14. Odogwu
15. Malins

Significantly more experienced than this (and I still don't understand how Jonny Hill made the Lions squad - I can only think the "conspiracy" theory about Gatland wanted firmly established dirt trackers who wouldn't challenge the test team is actually accurate).

Out of interest, my bench was swapping around between:
Obano, West
Dunn, Barbeary
Heyes, Street
Martin, Ribbans
Earl, Hill

Randall, Mitchell
Simmonds, POC
Thorley, Steward, DeGlanville
 
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I definitely would've started Robson

I've not been impressed with Randall since he came back - he's still sniping and playing well off the cuff but his fundamentals look poor

Though I can understand EJ wanting to get him tied to England, plus what's an England test series without giving Robson 30-40seconds off the bench each game
 
I definitely would've started Robson

I've not been impressed with Randall since he came back - he's still sniping and playing well off the cuff but his fundamentals look poor

Though I can understand EJ wanting to get him tied to England, plus what's an England test series without giving Robson 30-40seconds off the bench each game

Is Randall a product of Welsh or English rugby?
 
Hartpury College and then Bristol academy, I think
I don't think he went to Hartpury til he was 18. So age 4-18 his rugby education was all in Wales and then 18 - present England.

Don't get me wrong, I don't care as I don't buy into this "product of whatever system" argument but I would say if you only used that argument he's more Welsh than English.
 
I don't think he went to Hartpury til he was 18
Why would he move to a sixth form college after finishing sixth form?
Went to an RFU funded school, then the full whack of an RFU academy
Don't know how you could claim he's anything other than a product of the RFU systems tbh
 
Just out of interest - what's Randall's actual qualification for Wales?
As far as I can tell, it's only residency - which passed once he left Wales - or have I got the regulations wrong? or he got a granny google can't find?
He seems to be English by birth, English by parentage, English by residency, and English by self-description; but Welsh by temporary residency, that is no longer current

Why would he move to a sixth form college after finishing sixth form?

Wiki says he moved aged 17
 
Just out of interest - what's Randall's actual qualification for Wales?
As far as I can tell, it's only residency - which passed once he left Wales - or have I got the regulations wrong? or he got a granny google can't find?
No I believe it's just residency. Both parents are English (assume same for grandparents) and born in England. Just lived in Wales for 13 years or so.
 
Just out of interest - what's Randall's actual qualification for Wales?
As far as I can tell, it's only residency - which passed once he left Wales - or have I got the regulations wrong? or he got a granny google can't find?
He seems to be English by birth, English by parentage and English by residency; but Welsh by temporary residency, that is no longer current



Wiki says he moved aged 17
Nope, no Welsh relatives

Apparently if you live in a country for 10 consecutive years you become permanently qualified for them
 
Nope, no Welsh relatives

Apparently if you live in a country for 10 consecutive years before you turn pro you become permanently qualified for them
TY - didn't know that one, but I have to say that I like it
 
I don't think he went to Hartpury til he was 18. So age 4-18 his rugby education was all in Wales and then 18 - present England.

Don't get me wrong, I don't care as I don't buy into this "product of whatever system" argument but I would say if you only used that argument he's more Welsh than English.
He's probably more welsh than half the welsh team these days then by your reckoning.

I just feel sorry for the lad, born in slough then forced to move to terrible Wales at aged 4. Can't think of anything worse poor lad.
 
He's probably more welsh than half the welsh team these days then by your reckoning.

I just feel sorry for the lad, born in slough then forced to move to terrible Wales at aged 4. Can't think of anything worse poor lad.
Mate. He was born in Slough. ******* Slough. Lol.
 
The whole North of England is one big **** hole. You can throw in the South West as well. He he.
 

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