England Squad

[TRF_Cymro]

England Squad Announced.

From BBC:

Uncapped Saracens prop Mako Vunipola has been named in England's squad for the autumn internationals. The 21-year-old is added to the squad alongside Ugo Monye, Tom Youngs and James Haskell.
Tom Wood and Courtney Lawes return after missing the South African tour in the summer through injury. Coach Stuart Lancaster has opted not to select any French-based players in his 32-man squad for the four Tests, which begin against Fiji on 10 November.


Forwards: Mouritz Botha (Saracens), Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers), James Haskell (London Wasps), Phil Dowson (Northampton Saints), Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints), Tom Johnson (Exeter Chiefs), Courtney Lawes. (Northampton Saints), Joe Marler (Harlequins), Ben Morgan (Gloucester Rugby), Tom Palmer (London Wasps), Geoff Parling (Leicester Tigers), Chris Robshaw (Harlequins), Mako Vunipola (Saracens), Thomas Waldrom (Leicester Tigers), David Wilson (Bath Rugby), Tom Wood (Northampton Saints), Tom Youngs (Leicester Tigers)

Backs: Anthony Allen (Leicester Tigers), Chris Ashton (Saracens), Brad Barritt (Saracens), Mike Brown (Harlequins), Danny Care (Harlequins), Lee Dickson (Northampton Saints), Owen Farrell (Saracens), Toby Flood (Leicester Tigers), Alex Goode (Saracens), Jonathan Joseph (London Irish), Ugo Monye (Harlequins), Charlie Sharples (Gloucester Rugby), Manu Tuilagi (Leicester Tigers), Jordan Turner-Hall (Harlequins), Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers)

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Surprised at Monye's inclusion, and (slightly less so) at Haskell's too.

Apart from that it's as expected.

 

[Patchey]

Good to see Wood back. Tom Youngs could be done without but there isn't anyone else I guess...

Also, Strettle dropped is defiantly a positive. Sharples and Monye are both much better finishers.

 

[Big Ewis]

Tom Croft injured or smt ??...

 

[Peat]

Tom Croft injured or smt ??...

Seriously injured his neck when he tried to tackle Nick Easter in completely the right position last season; should be back in the next couple of months I believe.

Anyway, same ol', same ol'. The problem with the EPS from this perspective as we know the make-up of most of the squad already. Very little to get excited about, although at least for once I agree with most of what's been done - only one I don't agree on is Tom Youngs, because a guy with a sub 90pc record of hitting his target doesn't really have a place at international level, but if Gray's injured so be it. Coulda gone with David Paice I suppose... not sure this if Vunipola's ready but hell, he's exciting, Haskell's the right sort of player, Monye's the right sort of player... good enough.

 

[j'nuh]

ffs. If Lancaster allowed himself to go one year older than Monye, he could have selected James Simpson-Daniel. Or, you know, picked a decent flyhalf in Freddie Burns. Haskell? Seriously? So Fearns, Savage, Armitage, Launchbury wouldn't be better options? You know, players who won't infringe regularly and are in good form? Alternatively, it wouldn't have been a good idea to nurture Kvesic for the future?

The player I have least gripes with being selected is Youngs and that is simply because: who else? I think Dawidiuk is better, but he's not played in a few games for injury, and I'd be tempted to consider Alcott at Exeter too. With Exeter, I can sympathise with a lack of recognition for their talented players.

Apparently Marler, Corbisiero, Vunipola and if you include Saxons inclusion, Catt and Mullan, are better than Nick Wood, you know, the only prop to be nominated for Premiership player of the year last year? A guy who, if you ignore the idiots at Sky, is one of the best scrummaging loose heads in the country, and is handy in the loose too? tbf, Vunipola has started this season well, and I'm for blooding players young, so I'm not upset about his inclusion as such. I just wish the EPS was flexible enough to have him and Wood.

1. Vunipola (f it. yolo.)
2. Hartley
3. Cole
4. Lawes
5. Parling
6. Robshaw
7. Wood
8. Morgan
9. Care
10. Flood
11. Ashton
12. Allen
13. Tuilagi
14. Sharples (Sharples gets the wing he likes since Ashton will hopefully roam)
15. Brown/Goode

16. Youngs
17. Marler
18. Wilson
19. Palmer
20. Waldrom
21. Youngs
22. Farrell
23. Joseph

Not a bad squad tbf. Could be better though.

 

[jooost82]

My team would be from the EPS:
Marler Hartley Cole
Lawes Parling need mobile 2nds with a big back row
Robshaw Morgan Johnson

4-8 lacks balance from the EPS squad could put wood at 6 and robshaw to 8 but need a specialst 8 ideally

care flood
allen tuilagi
monye brown ashton

Bench vunipola wilson youngs palmer wood youngs goode

However my preferred match day squad would be if all FIT HEALHTY AND ON FORM
1 Corbisiero
2 Hartley
3 Cole
4 Lawes
5 Palmer
6 Croft
7 Armitage
8 Robshaw - i'm a big fan of his I think as a captain he brings a lot to the squad and I know i'm contradicting myself here but croft brings so much to Eng so have to fit him in at 8

9 Youngs
10 Flood

11 Sharples
12 Allen
13 Tuilagi
14 Ashton
15 Brown

16 Marler
17 Webber
18 Parling
19 wood
20 Care
21 May
22 Burns

 

[NickNack]

England 2012 Squad for Autumn International-The Good and The Bad


Forwards: Mouritz Botha (Saracens), Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers), James Haskell (London Wasps), Phil Dowson (Northampton Saints), Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints), Tom Johnson (Exeter Chiefs), Courtney Lawes. (Northampton Saints), Joe Marler (Harlequins), Ben Morgan (Gloucester Rugby), Tom Palmer (London Wasps), Geoff Parling (Leicester Tigers), Chris Robshaw (Harlequins), Mako Vunipola (Saracens), Thomas Waldrom (Leicester Tigers), David Wilson (Bath Rugby), Tom Wood (Northampton Saints), Tom Youngs (Leicester Tigers)
Backs: Anthony Allen (Leicester Tigers), Chris Ashton (Saracens), Brad Barritt (Saracens), Mike Brown (Harlequins), Danny Care (Harlequins), Lee Dickson (Northampton Saints), Owen Farrell (Saracens), Toby Flood (Leicester Tigers), Alex Goode (Saracens), Jonathan Joseph (London Irish), Ugo Monye (Harlequins), Charlie Sharples (Gloucester Rugby), Manu Tuilagi (Leicester Tigers), Jordan Turner-Hall (Harlequins), Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers)

First Off all I would like to say that I am overall happy with this squad... But I feel that this squad should be including Steffon Armitage, his pace and his body position over the ball is phenomenal and I dont think Chris Robshaw can do that. Yes we know that Chris Robshaws Understanding of the game is very good but if you look at the Top International Teams such as New Zealand, Wales and Auestrialia they have players such as Richie Mccaw and Warbuton. But I can not knock Chris Robshaws Captonicy.

Secondly I am very happy that Nick Easter did not make the squad (simple) He is a outstanding club player but he has never been outstanding in an International match, for example when we saw Ben Morgan (who is in the squad) come in the Six Nations He had a massive impact to the team against wales and France. I am VERY happy about Mako Vunipola has been given a chance, His form for Saracens has been outstanding, but can he perform at an international standard? we will hopefully find out with-in the next month.

Lastly I dont like Ugo Monye being in the squad, He hasent had much game time this season, But again I hope he proves me wrong!

I would have like to seen Freddie Burns, Jonny May and Matt kvesic.

My Team-

1) Joe Marler
2) Dylan Hartley (C)
3) Dan Cole
4)Courtney Laws
5) Mourtiz Botha
6) Tom Johnson
7)James Haskell
8)Ben Morgan
9)Danny Care
10)Toby Flood
11)Charlie Sharples
12) Anthoney Allen
13)Manusamoa Tuilagi
14)Chris Ashton
15)M.Brown

Subs: 16) Mako Vunipola 17) Tom Youngs 18)Tom Palmer 19) Thomas Waldrom 20) B.Youngs 21)Owen Farrell 22) JJ

 

[mstar]

Predictable squad.


Just dissapointed that Steffon Armitage not added, i guess Lancaster thinks he has enough cover in this position who can do a good enough job.


Monye was knocking on the door surprised he got the nod. BUt lets not forget he played for the Lions.


I be interested to see how Wood gets on will he get a game -unlikely? i think others who are on-form (Tom Johnson, Robshaw, Haskell) probably a little in front of the queue.


I am glad to see Haskell back i thought he played excellent against SA he brings us that extra "muscle"


Lawes go straight into the starting line-up.


I havn't watched much of Botha this season how is his form/playing guys?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Botha playing as crap as ever.
He really is just Borthwick without the lineout work - tackles/hits up like a kitten and is just generally useless.

I think Armitage playing in France doesn't help his chances, agree he should be there though he's been playing superbly for Toulon since he moved there (and then for Not Nots beforehand too).

 

[mstar]

I can't find a fan of Botha on TRF lolz


Agree the guy has a strange tackling technique of diving down into the ground like a sack of patatoes. BUt can't fault his work rate. Unfortunately I don't think he was ever Lancaster solution or prefered Lock anyway so i can see him slowly being phased out of the starting line-up.


I think we all agree Steffon Armitage he is a specialist and against Warburton he was more then a match for him. But i can;t complain to much as Robshaw did a great job as number 7.


Question for you guys... do you think Tom Johnson keep will start as 6?
I think his form is good and work-rate is immense and is very quick around the park.

 

[j'nuh]

Unfortunately I don't think he was ever Lancaster solution or prefered Lock anyway so i can see him slowly being phased out of the starting line-up.

This is true. IIRC, Lancaster didn't have many lock options when he originally named his first EPS and Botha's inclusion in subsequent squads has been forced by the restrictive nature of the EPS. Really, he has just made up the numbers, with Parling and Lawes the obvious starters and Palmer the preferred sub. Expecting him to be dropped, along with a few others, in Jan 2013. Would like to see Launchbury or Savage promoted in his place.

 

[Patchey]

I think the Armitage point has been done to death now. You could argue that both Delon and Steffon deserve a place on form but the RFU and Lancaster have been pretty clear about not picking them. If they want an England place they need to be playing in the Aviva.

I really doubt Allen will get the nod, Baritt or Farrel will get the 12 shirt.

 

[j'nuh]

They've said that Farrell is being taken as a flyhalf, thankfully. Agree though, Barritt is probably going to be picked. I think they'll probably consider JTH before Allen too. tbf on Barritt and the Sarries though, they've played some decent attacking rugby in the last two rounds of the HC. Can't look past that demolition of Edinburgh, and the comprehensive win against Racing. Barritt's run some decent lines. Would prefer Allen though, as I think he'll link with the outside backs better.

Out of interest, who replaced Hodgson when he retired from international rugby?

 

[Teh Mite]

Hopefully Bomber will select Dowson. Means Mallender will have to use some imagination and pick someone who's not playing like a donkey.

 

[Peat]

They've said that Farrell is being taken as a flyhalf, thankfully. Agree though, Barritt is probably going to be picked. I think they'll probably consider JTH before Allen too. tbf on Barritt and the Sarries though, they've played some decent attacking rugby in the last two rounds of the HC. Can't look past that demolition of Edinburgh, and the comprehensive win against Racing. Barritt's run some decent lines. Would prefer Allen though, as I think he'll link with the outside backs better.

Out of interest, who replaced Hodgson when he retired from international rugby?

They've played some decent attacking rugby with Hodgson at fly-half - the difference between him and Farrell is is bigger than the jungle. Personally, I see nothing to be thankful for about the idea that Farrell's being regarded as a fly-half.

I also really hope Tom Johnson doesn't start (to answer another post) because while he has many admirable traits, he's not big enough for a test-match blindside, and it shows. While Haskell has his flaws, he's at least big enough for the job, so please let it be him... or Wood.

 

[Teh Mite]

If you're playing Wood, why not swap him and Robshaw?

You know, to play them both where they play on a weekly basis?

Crazy notion...

 

[Peat]

If you're playing Wood, why not swap him and Robshaw?

You know, to play them both where they play on a weekly basis?

Crazy notion...

Can't recall the last time Robshaw played 6 and it's not like Wood's never played there. Don't really care if they lined up the other way mind, although I prefer my faster bigger player at 6.

 

[j'nuh]

They've played some decent attacking rugby with Hodgson at fly-half - the difference between him and Farrell is is bigger than the jungle. Personally, I see nothing to be thankful for about the idea that Farrell's being regarded as a fly-half.

Agreed. I mean that I'm thankful that he's considered a flyhalf rather than a center. Whilst I think Burns is better in most areas of play at the minute, Farrell does have some decent traits that make for a good flyhalf. He has in the past done well in kicking from hand. If he makes us meters when the ball is in the middle of the field, I'm happy. My concern is when we're in an area of the field where we should be looking at introducing the backline. I think in these cases, as long as he passes the ball down the line fast enough, someone else down the backline can create something. Alternatively, tell him to hug one of the touchlines in attack.

I just don't want him stood halfway through a backline, where moves can break down because he hasn't a clue with ball in hand.

 

[Peat]

I think we're arguing about whether we'd prefer to have **** or **** added to our morning coffee here - the best place for Farrell is out of the EPS until he's capable of doing his job properly in either position.