A Political Thread pt. 2

[General Melchett]

Could you imagine if they actually did boot Sunak right now?

What a barrel of rats.

I'm no fan of his and I'm not saying he's doing a good job but he does seem to be at least trying to reduce inflation and sort the economy out even if it will cost him politically. Johnson/Truss & co are happy to offer irresponsible tax cuts, let inflation soar and generally trash the country for the sake of staying in power. They are truly despicable.

You'd like to think there would be a huge public/media backlash if we had yet another unelected PM with no mandate. The pressure to call a GE would be too great. I'm sure there are plenty Tories who genuinely believe that Boris could come back and win an election.

 

[SG59_]

I'm no fan of his and I'm not saying he's doing a good job but he does seem to be at least trying to reduce inflation and sort the economy out even if it will cost him politically. Johnson/Truss & co are happy to offer irresponsible tax cuts, let inflation soar and generally trash the country for the sake of staying in power. They are truly despicable.

You'd like to think there would be a huge public/media backlash if we had yet another unelected PM with no mandate. The pressure to call a GE would be too great. I'm sure there are plenty Tories who genuinely believe that Boris could come back and win an election.

When he first got in, I was hoping he would at least be more competent and better behaved, but he's proven to be just like the rest tbh. He just hides away whenever he's caught out. He's still doing crap contracts etc, not helping people and doing everything to look after big busines. I didn't think he would be so spineless mind.

Having said that, it's clear to see why we have him. The tories are out of talent and we can all see the damage they've caused since they've got in. He's effectively the caretaker.

I do honestly wonder where we're heading. This country really is in a bad way and I'm not sure even labour can or want to fix it. They're itching to get in, but they don't really offer any solutions.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

I'm no fan of his and I'm not saying he's doing a good job but he does seem to be at least trying to reduce inflation and sort the economy out even if it will cost him politically. Johnson/Truss & co are happy to offer irresponsible tax cuts, let inflation soar and generally trash the country for the sake of staying in power. They are truly despicable.

You'd like to think there would be a huge public/media backlash if we had yet another unelected PM with no mandate. The pressure to call a GE would be too great. I'm sure there are plenty Tories who genuinely believe that Boris could come back and win an election.

He's less blatant than the others but he's still involved in a **** load of shady dealings (and remember he was chancellor so was no innocent in the previous regimes) and he's still been redirecting money from poor areas to wealthy areas. The fact he is viewed as "decent" says nothing about him and more about how far the Tories have fallen.

 

[General Melchett]

He's less blatant than the others but he's still involved in a **** load of shady dealings (and remember he was chancellor so was no innocent in the previous regimes) and he's still been redirecting money from poor areas to wealthy areas. The fact he is viewed as "decent" says nothing about him and more about how far the Tories have fallen.

Not disputing that. He's the marginally lesser of two evils as Truss/Johnson are worse IMO. Truss deliberately sent the economy into a tailspin. The sooner they're booted out the better.

 

[Amiga500]

It all just keeps saying to me "representative democracy doesn't work". Or at least in the current shambles.

How many in the cabinet are qualified to run a large organisation? How many would be even entertained in an interview list for a C-suite position in a big company?

My solution:
- Get rid of house of lords.
- Replace it with a house full of representatives nominated by significant professional bodies.
- The house of professionals table bills internally. If they are approved there, they are forwarded on to the commons.

- The house of commons vote on it - if it passes there, then it has passed into law.
- The house of commons does not propose law. They have proven themselves too incompetent to do that.
- If the house of commons deems a representative in the professional house to be acting not in the public interest, they can have them recalled for a different nomination from the body.
- If a body puts in 3 "bad-uns" in a row, they can be suspended or excluded from the house of professionals.


Less of the unstable 4-year shite, less of the punch and judy crap - more legislation that makes sense and more knowledgeable folks at the top that can tell civil servant assholes to do one when they present shite.
The public voting for the commons does not result in abrupt U-turns in government, but it can steer the ship with a slightly different emphasis.

[Another thing is the civil service. Far too hard to lose your job there for incompetence or negligence. That needs resolved.]

 

[SG59_]

It all just keeps saying to me "representative democracy doesn't work". Or at least in the current shambles.

How many in the cabinet are qualified to run a large organisation? How many would be even entertained in an interview list for a C-suite position in a big company?

My solution:
- Get rid of house of lords.
- Replace it with a house full of representatives nominated by significant professional bodies.
- The house of professionals table bills internally. If they are approved there, they are forwarded on to the commons.

- The house of commons vote on it - if it passes there, then it has passed into law.
- The house of commons does not propose law. They have proven themselves too incompetent to do that.
- If the house of commons deems a representative in the professional house to be acting not in the public interest, they can have them recalled for a different nomination from the body.
- If a body puts in 3 "bad-uns" in a row, they can be suspended or excluded from the house of professionals.


Less of the unstable 4-year shite, less of the punch and judy crap - more legislation that makes sense and more knowledgeable folks at the top that can tell civil servant assholes to do one when they present shite.
The public voting for the commons does not result in abrupt U-turns in government, but it can steer the ship with a slightly different emphasis.

[Another thing is the civil service. Far too hard to lose your job there for incompetence or negligence. That needs resolved.]

I like this idea, but one part would definitely need to be altered:
"Replace it with a house full of representatives nominated by significant professional bodies."

The risk here is some wealthy backers asking for favours in the form of votes in return for a "present".

 

[Amiga500]

I like this idea, but one part would definitely need to be altered:
"Replace it with a house full of representatives nominated by significant professional bodies."

The risk here is some wealthy backers asking for favours in the form of votes in return for a "present".

the checks on that being the votes within that house and the ability of the commons to have that representative dismissed - and if the body does a few repeat performances, that representative body can be suspended or banned from house of professionals.

A backer can ask a professional body to make a proposal.

That body can then choose to make the proposal.
The other peers in house of representatives can choose to approve/amend/reject.

The commons can choose to approve/reject proposal.
The commons can choose to vote for removal of the member.
The commons can choose to vote for suspension/removal of the body the member represents.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Which professional bodies would be there to represent people or tackle cartels? Supermarkets exist as a semi cartel and the professionals sent to such a body would only look to entrench that. Likewise utilities companies, telecoms etc and every body would likely be massively in favour of corporate cronyism and mass privatisation. Professional bodies have even less requirement to care about the public good than the current crop of Tories. I'm pretty sure the professional bodies would love to see the full cost of the cost of living crisis passed on to your average person whilst also recommending wages be suppressed. People of the country would be little more than piggy banks to be exploited.

I think we have also seen that the Commons will not hold people properly to account and now they would simply have another layer of deniability as they pass legislation. I'm in favour of having experts have a role in legislating but I think having them as a check with more power than the lords would be better than having them as the primary legislators. It would also means when electing an MP, they are there to either ok or block legislation others produce. If the elected government has a fundamentally different view to the professional body, it just becomes a deadlock.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

And The two long term issues of our day: Brexit and Climate change also show the limitations of our 5 year term of our HOC and their short termism outlook and lack of real cross party consensus.

 

[Amiga500]

Which professional bodies would be there to represent people or tackle cartels?

The commons represent the people. As they are supposed to do now.

But, with their power to instigate crap legislation significantly curtailed, then you'd hope the appeal levels to the current narcissists would drop - and we might get folks more interested in civics than self-grandeur in.

If the elected government has a fundamentally different view to the professional body, it just becomes a deadlock.

Grand. So the dodgy bit of legislation doesn't get passed... and there won't be the same sensationalist reporting in the news as the elected parliament isn't the be-all and end-all of creating legislation in this country (which it essentially is right now with the lords advisory only).

 

[Saintjay]

How would your professional bodies "representatives" deal with pay disputes for example. You'd certainly need professional representation from the NHS that would include the RCN, Royal college of surgeons etc. You'd also require representation of the the trade unions Unite, Unison etc. Who's members have the option of part of there membership fees going towards Labour.

The definition of professional body is to broad for this. Most work in the interests of the membership or the field they represent. Trade Unions alone have around 6.7 million members.

 

[Welsh Exile]

And The two long term issues of our day: Brexit and Climate change also show the limitations of our 5 year term of our HOC and their short termism outlook and lack of real cross party consensus.

It's led by us. People are short term thinkers. The electorate, by and large, don't want to hear about things that could happen in 30-50 years time. If a party ran on a platform of "hey guys look at what we're doing now that will sort us out in 50 years time" they'd get laughed at at the polls.

 

[General Melchett]

It's led by us. People are short term thinkers. The electorate, by and large, don't want to hear about things that could happen in 30-50 years time. If a party ran on a platform of "hey guys look at what we're doing now that will sort us out in 50 years time" they'd get laughed at at the polls.

Very true. Also people use elections as their main way of protesting against those in power and this often relates to a single issue as opposed to the broader spectrum of health, education, housing etc. Look at the recent by elections - a protest vote against ULEZ. Brexit was also a protest vote because too many people were felt left behind/lack of levelling up.

Our two party system is rotten to the core. The Eton brigade have been able to cling on to power and line their pockets in the process. What's the status with Nadim Zahawi's HMRC tax investigation for him failing to declare millions on his tax return? I bet that mysteriously disappears even though he probably should be in jail or fined heavily at the very least. One set of rules for them and another for the rest of us. I would like to see Governments run like large companies with more accountability, transparency, whistle blowing, codes of conduct/ethics etc. It's far too shady and murky with people getting away with murder. **** convention. Let's have documented rules that have to be followed and proper disciplinary proceedings enacted when they're not. I would rather have smart technocrats running the country instead of this punch and judy ****** we see every week. We should be governed by smart experienced people who have a track record in running big companies or big departments rather than thick incompetent corrupt gobsh1tes who happen to be good at brown nosing and networking. The fact that someone like Truss was able to rise to the job of PM just shows how broken things are.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Very true. Also people use elections as their main way of protesting against those in power and this often relates to a single issue as opposed to the broader spectrum of health, education, housing etc. Look at the recent by elections - a protest vote against ULEZ. Brexit was also a protest vote because too many people were felt left behind/lack of levelling up.

Our two party system is rotten to the core. The Eton brigade have been able to cling on to power and line their pockets in the process. What's the status with Nadim Zahawi's HMRC tax investigation for him failing to declare millions on his tax return? I bet that mysteriously disappears even though he probably should be in jail or fined heavily at the very least. One set of rules for them and another for the rest of us. I would like to see Governments run like large companies with more accountability, transparency, whistle blowing, codes of conduct/ethics etc. It's far too shady and murky with people getting away with murder. **** convention. Let's have documented rules that have to be followed and proper disciplinary proceedings enacted when they're not. I would rather have smart technocrats running the country instead of this punch and judy ****** we see every week. We should be governed by smart experienced people who have a track record in running big companies or big departments rather than thick incompetent corrupt gobsh1tes who happen to be good at brown nosing and networking. The fact that someone like Truss was able to rise to the job of PM just shows how broken things are.

What we need is AWJ as sole leader of these here isles (might as well take Ireland back as well) I here he'll be available soon. Did you see him picking up plastic bottles after a recent Toulon game? He'd sort out climate change no probs.

 

[General Melchett]

What we need is AWJ as sole leader of these here isles (might as well take Ireland back as well) I here he'll be available soon. Did you see him picking up plastic bottles after a recent Toulon game? He'd sort out climate change no probs.

Not sure about climate change but he certainly needs to recycle a few thousand follicles on his barnet before he thinks about entering the world of politics.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Not sure about climate change but he certainly needs to recycle a few thousand follicles on his barnet before he thinks about entering the world of politics.

Nah, a General Melchett tash will more than compensate. I've been told he's growing one now.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

It's led by us. People are short term thinkers. The electorate, by and large, don't want to hear about things that could happen in 30-50 years time. If a party ran on a platform of "hey guys look at what we're doing now that will sort us out in 50 years time" they'd get laughed at at the polls.

Yeh I get it we are mostly made up of the baby Boomers, MTV and now TikTok generations with an attention span of 30 secs. It's all about me, me, me and my needs and society is becoming more and more polarised as we communities breakdown.

And this is served by political system which is not fit for purpose to deal with complex issues that require global solutions.

Just look at this school concert issue as a prime example. They must have known about this for years, decades ago but each generation just kicked it down the road for the next one to deal with until we get to this. And it might not stop there with hospitals and other public buildings affected.

So it can't just be left up to peeps to make decisions it has to be inbuilt into the political system. Layered - long term, medium term and short term and how it is brought together. No doubt a lot of bureaucracy would mean that that kind of approach will never get off the ground.

 

[SG59_]

A tory doing a good job? Is that possible?

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Nah, a General Melchett tash will more than compensate. I've been told he's growing one now.

Something's the matter. Something sinister and grotesque. And what's worse, it is going on right there under his very nose.

 

[SG59_]