[2015 RWC] Warm Up Match: France vs England (22/08/2015)

[91jmay]

Nothing Farrell would have done better than Ford today other than nail that long kick possibly, the pack lost us the game. They got destroyed. Not just beaten by French pack but destroyed. Our backs showed that when they get ball in hand they are still quality players but our pack is nowhere near good enough. I'd take all 8 French forwards ahead of ours on performance today.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

There isn't a number 10 on the planet that would have looked good behind the pommie pack tonight.

Disagree.
As I said earlier, a pummelled pack undoubtedly has an impact, but a good enough flyhalf will adapt and play on.

 

[NickBD]

Mako needs to start, Morgan in at 8, Wood to 6 - he balances out Robshaw.

Youngs or Webber? Take your pick, George on the bench ( he's been great).

May cannot play alongside Brown. It has to be one or the other. May & Goode or Brown and Watson (Nowell swaps).

Farrell in at 10, sorry everyone we need someone who can a: tackle, b): keep the teams shape even under pressure. Ford to the bench.

I wouldn't drop Billy V. He wasn't great today but either was Morgan last week. Morgan played last week but surely after being out for so long he'd play today also but no game time today after 6 months out I think either Easter is the back up or Morgan will be used of the bench.

Agree I'd also start Wood, Haskell is a far better option as an impact sub anyway.

 

[goodNumber10]

Nothing Farrell would have done better than Ford today other than nail that long kick possibly

he'd have made a dent on defence, for a start.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Move over Youngs and Marler and bring in the Kiwi Hartley and Corbs.

You really don't watch much NH rugby if you are calling for Corbs to start.

 

[The Jones Boy]

he was poor, the kick down the touch line your were sqeualing about was completely the wrong option, Farrell at least would have made an impact on Defence.

It's true Ford is not a great defender but when your forwards are under the kosh the best option is to march them up the park into enemy territory where if the problems continue its generally speaking a much safer area in which to have the forwards continue to malfunction. His first half was not good but the pommie pack were having a seriously awful game and there isn't a 10 in the world who would have shone under that blow torch.
The defence around the ruck at the breakdown was all about the French loose forwards getting there first and in numbers. They were playing at home and they wanted it a LOT more. Poor old Robshaw.
In the end the scoreboard was flattering to England, but hey, it's a warm up game, don't focus too much on it, things will get better, a lot better and quickly.
Don't write players off on one game unless they have a shocker of tectonic magnitude and the only two who qualify tonight are Youngs and Marler.

 

[goodNumber10]

You really don't watch much NH rugby if you are calling for Corbs to start.

Nor does he understand Hartley is suspended.

 

[ncurd]

he'd have made a dent on defence, for a start.

True but France still make their kicks and the try is probably still scored. We'd have looked a little more assured in defence but a better loss than just 5 pojnts (which flattered us). I don't think that happens.

 

[The Jones Boy]

You really don't watch much NH rugby if you are calling for Corbs to start.

He needs game time Tigs, he's a class act, he just needs game time to get up to speed. It wasn't long ago that he was monstering pretty much everyone in the world. Injuries have impeded his dominance but if they can get him fully match fit he can be a terror at scrum time again.

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Nor does he understand Hartley is suspended.

No I knew that but I don't know when he's due back. They surely need him , ill discipline or not.

 

[goodNumber10]

It's true Ford is not a great defender but when your forwards are under the kosh the best option is to march them up the park into enemy territory where if the problems continue its generally speaking a much safer area in which to have the forwards continue to malfunction. His first half was not good but the pommie pack were having a seriously awful game and there isn't a 10 in the world who would have shone under that blow torch.
The defence around the ruck at the breakdown was all about the French loose forwards getting there first and in numbers. They were playing at home and they wanted it a LOT more. Poor old Robshaw.
In the end the scoreboard was flattering to England, but hey, it's a warm up game, don't focus too much on it, things will get better, a lot better and quickly.
Don't write players off on one game unless they have a shocker of tectonic magnitude and the only two who qualify tonight are Youngs and Marler.

i'm not writing him off, nor am i basing it on one game - Ireland, prem final, this game, he had issues last season when his pack started to struggle. he's a fantastic go forward 10 - but at international level you need a 10 who can ride out the rough 15/20 and take control again.

he's not that 10 at the moment.

 

[ncurd]

He needs game time Tigs, he's a class act, he just needs game time to get up to speed. It wasn't long ago that he was monitoring pretty much everyone in the world. Injuries have impeded his dominance but if they can get him fully match fit he can be a terror at scrum time again.

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No I knew that but I don't know when he's due back.

After the Fiji game which is why he was dropped...you don't want someone with no gametime playing Wales/Australia

 

[goodNumber10]

He needs game time Tigs, he's a class act, he just needs game time to get up to speed. It wasn't long ago that he was monstering pretty much everyone in the world. Injuries have impeded his dominance but if they can get him fully match fit he can be a terror at scrum time again.

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No I knew that but I don't know when he's due back. They surely need him , ill discipline or not.

he's suspended until after he first game...

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

He needs game time Tigs, he's a class act, he just needs game time to get up to speed. It wasn't long ago that he was monstering pretty much everyone in the world. Injuries have impeded his dominance but if they can get him fully match fit he can be a terror at scrum time again.

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No I knew that but I don't know when he's due back. They surely need him , ill discipline or not.

He has had plenty of game time @ Saints and has not shown any of his class he had.

He hasn't adapted to the scrum change.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

No I knew that but I don't know when he's due back. They surely need him , ill discipline or not.

Not until after the RWC starts

 

[ncurd]

i'm not writing him off, nor am i basing it on one game - Ireland, prem final, this game, he had issues last season when his pack started to struggle. he's a fantastic go forward 10 - but at international level you need a 10 who can ride out the rough 15/20 and take control again.

he's not that 10 at the moment.

Agreed ford goes missing when not with go forward pack bug I don't think he'll get better by not playing those games and hoping he'll learn it at club level (he will in time get better at these games). Which is why I'd give him one more chance vs Ireland but he REALLY needs to step up in that game.

I I'd tally he was better in those situations for Bath this season compared to the previous one (final aside which even then he wasn't that bad). I think possibly he's a season or two behind where we'd like him to be or a RWC. I'm just not convinced Farrell will make enough of a difference to win these games.

 

[The Jones Boy]

he's suspended until after he first game...

Oh really?
Oh... oh dear, thats a pain but chuck him in there anyway he's a good kiwi boy with the fight up front in his veins (sometimes a little too much)
Haven't you got Aussie later in the round robin phase?
He'll make that one for sure.

 

[goodNumber10]

True but France still make their kicks and the try is probably still scored. We'd have looked a little more assured in defence but a better loss than just 5 pojnts (which flattered us). I don't think that happens.

i'm not sure on that. his tactical kicking is long and he would have got us over the gain line with the simpler one out style.

We need to move Luther B back to 13, he is not gelling with Joseph (though i thought he went ok tonight), it's Brad B & Burgess at 12 and JJ or Luther B at 13.

Slade won't make the cut, if he doe sit will be for Burgess.

Lets not get it twisted, the pack was awful, and ford suffered from that. We really have an issue when we come back from the summer with generating quick ball - every autumn it's the same and we normally shale it by the 6 Nations, but (moving back to ford) even behind a beaten pack you want a 10 who looks assured and looks like he knows what his decisions are.

i didn't see that in Ford today, didn't see it in the irland game and didn't see it in the prem final.

 

[The Jones Boy]

He has had plenty of game time @ Saints and has not shown any of his class he had.

He hasn't adapted to the scrum change.

Now come on Tigs, we know your feelings toward Saints... ;-)

 

[goodNumber10]

Agreed ford goes missing when not with go forward pack bug I don't think he'll get better by not playing those games and hoping he'll learn it at club level (he will in time get better at these games). Which is why I'd give him one more chance vs Ireland but he REALLY needs to step up in that game.

I I'd tally he was better in those situations for Bath this season compared to the previous one (final aside which even then he wasn't that bad). I think possibly he's a season or two behind where we'd like him to be or a RWC. I'm just not convinced Farrell will make enough of a difference to win these games.

there is no guarantee of that.

i think ultimately he's just anothe rplayer who doesn't quite fit into the England set up as it currently stands.

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i also thought Brown showed his lack of game time today.

 

[martinspoonboy1]

On a side note, when was the last time Cole had a decent game. Constant infringements and hasn't been dominant in the scrum for a long while. Overrated at the breakdown too. When was the last time he secured a turn over. When was the last time any England player did for that matter.

I think I'm just ranting now.