Wales vs England - 16/03/2013

[Jbobo]

Starting to think there should be a post match hankie-distribution service for England fans for when they get beaten to oblivion by better teams. Then maybe they can man up and shut up about the referee



Edit: Just joshin' yas!

 

[SelimNiai]

Starting to think there should be a post match hankie-distribution service for England fans for when they get beaten to oblivion by better teams. Then maybe they can man up and shut up about the referee

You could say the same about supporters of the winning team being humble and not deliberately antagonizing them.

 

[Jbobo]

I know, i was only messing about, there seems to be a lot of it on the losing side too. But honestly, hasn't there been enough talk about Walsh? There were numerous decisions which went against Wales too, but England took none of these chances and Wales did. The second half in particular was well reffed, and the only complaint i can see for England could be the lead up to the first try. I'd just rather read/comment on the performances of each team which had a far greater bearing on the result and created an excellent game.

 

[Peat]

Thingimubob, not just them, it's in every newspaper carrying the story. Came up first when I went fishing for the quote. Of course the nature of the quote makes it easy to disbelieve - but then there's many an anonymous leak that turns out to be real.

Could it be? I see no reason to disbelieve it. Collapsing a scrum when you know the ref thinks the other side is causing the problems is a very easy way to buy penalties. Why wouldn't you if you can get away with it?

 

[TrueSlawter]

Has anyone got a source for the "Wales are said to have admitted privately after the match that they collapsed the scrum on six occasions"?

Also whats with the sudden u-turns really, after the game it was "no complaints" and now its this. Walsh didnt have the best game, the only major thing he really missed was Owens in that ruck. The scrum these days is all over the place in general and as someone pointed out the main one that stands out in my mind is where Youngs complained regards what Walsh asked. Binding the Welsh weren't the only ones binding on the arm etc when you've got that much going on at the same time it's bound to be hard to pick up on everything.

 

[Jbobo]

Could it be? I see no reason to disbelieve it. Collapsing a scrum when you know the ref thinks the other side is causing the problems is a very easy way to buy penalties. Why wouldn't you if you can get away with it?

And why would you admit it following the game if you knew you would get away with it?

 

[Peat]

Stick the quote in Google - don't know what paper carried the story as it's been syndicated, but you'll see plenty of papers giving it.

edit:

And why would you admit it following the game if you knew you would get away with it?

The starter for ten indeed. If they did, they probably shouldn't have. That said, they'd be far from the first rugby player I heard admitting to cheating post-game, or far from the first person to say something to someone when they should have kept their mouth shut - and as the match would have (presumably) been reviewed anyway by assessors, it's probably not a secret from the refs anyway.

 

[mstar]

Don't think I saw Cole bind onto Jenkins once, which in return Jenkins didn't bind either. Gonna re watch the match again soon and pay close attention to the scrum. Seemed to me like neither front row wanted to play fair (same as every single front row these days), and as you said, Wales simply know how to do it better!

what actually happened and its clever is that Wales would wait until England got penalised or Walsh was watching closely to the english scrum. Then depending which side walsh was, Jones/jenkins would not bind/position themselves slightly at a angle not pushing straight. The idea was that walsh would be concentrating so hard on England as they SEEMED to struggle that it allowed Wales to give walsh no option but give the penalty in their favor.

The other thing is that the England scrum is lower centre of gravity, and drive lower, Wales can manipulate this using hibbard etc by pushing downwards putting a lot of pressure on England front row to keep the scrum up and trying to push straight. Unfortunately as Walsh couldn't see the technical detail of the head line/shoulder positioning of England is lower it looks from the outside England are collapsing the scrum when wales engage. Im not sure if walsh mentioned to England to start a bit higher.

 

[Draggs]

If the tables were turned it would be the Welsh whinging about the ref.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Also whats with the sudden u-turns really, after the game it was "no complaints" and now its this.

There has not been any u-turn at all. They have not in any way contradicted their statements immediately prior to the game, that they were comprehensively outplayed in every area.
What they have done is asked questions about some of the referee's decisions. Whether this should have been made public by them is another matter.

 

[smb64]

Scrums Won

Wales 5 - 6 Ireland --- England 7 - 4 Ireland
Wales 4 - 7 France --- England 5 - 5 France
Wales 12 - 6 Italy --- England 8 - 7 Italy
Wales 4 - 3 Scotland - England 5 - 5 Scotland
--------------------------------------------
Wales 8 - 1 England

Before the England vs Wales game - Wales had won 25/47 scrums England had won 25/46 scrums.

Both teams were relatively successful in the scrum against all the other 6 nations opponents.

Ignoring the scrum for a second Wales were still dominant in every other area of play so still deserved to win - Just pointing out that England's sudden demise in the scrum, when it had been just as successful/more successful against the other 6 nations opponents as Wales's scrum was - might indicate Wales were collapsing it.

Got the statistics from here - http://www.rbs6nations.com/en/home.php

 

[Rhondda Rudie]

"In most games I've submitted glowing reports on the referees"..-Graham Rowntree

None more glowing than for George Clancy I bet.

 

[Jbobo]

If the tables were turned it would be the Welsh whinging about the ref.

The reality is that we DO have some grounds for whinging, for example a penalty against J Roberts for not rolling away when he was being held by an English forward (not sure which player) would be a major gripe with me, but i'm pretty sure Farrell missed the kick or went to touch and then lost the throw anyway. But yes basically, with a performance like that it is much easier to let these things go. I'd like to think in the reverse I would be one of the many English fans accepting that the ref had very little to do with their defeat and would tip my cap to the Welsh and leave it be.

 

[Thingimubob]

"In most games I've submitted glowing reports on the referees"..-Graham Rowntree

None more glowing than for George Clancy I bet.

Ha forgotten about that, some ridiculously harsh calls went against the Italians!

 

[Jbobo]

Ha forgotten about that, some ridiculously harsh calls went against the Italians!

Agree, it really could have been an Italian day and it would have been very well deserved too.

 

[mstar]

Wales would still of won regardless of Walsh's decisions. I just want to make myself clear before welsh supporters say its sour grapes.

 

[Peat]

The reality is that we DO have some grounds for whinging, for example a penalty against J Roberts for not rolling away when he was being held by an English forward (not sure which player) would be a major gripe with me, but i'm pretty sure Farrell missed the kick or went to touch and then lost the throw anyway. But yes basically, with a performance like that it is much easier to let these things go. I'd like to think in the reverse I would be one of the many English fans accepting that the ref had very little to do with their defeat and would tip my cap to the Welsh and leave it be.

Most English fans are going to some pains to establish they do not believe a different ref would have affected the result. The reffing performance is a topic mostly removed from the result or England's performance.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

Robshaw was NOT bikering with walsh. He was just politely asking have a look at the game again. He has every right to ask for clarification. Robshaw is actually the most polite captains in the 6N IMO.

its no secret to people who seen walsh in the Australian press etc he is a bit of a twat off duty.

Bickering may not be the right word. But was constantly moaning as were other England players. I was hooked up to Ref Mike, so heard it.

 

[Draggs]

Bickering may not be the right word. But was constantly moaning as were other England players. I was hooked up to Ref Mike, so heard it.

Rowntree forgot his round a few days ago, cheap b******.
Just jealous of Steve's looks. Don't worry Walsh, there is a modelling career out there for you if needed.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

Rowntree forgot his round a few days ago, cheap b******.
Just jealous of Steve's looks. Don't worry Walsh, there is a modelling career out there for you if needed.

Well there is that!