Super Rugby: Highlanders vs. Reds in Dunedin (29/03/2013)

[Kiwiwomble]

You are way too hard on tj, one knock one and tonnes of hit ups! I would rather he kept the ball in hand and recycle than try and pass and loose it

 

[Darwin]

You are way too hard on tj, one knock one and tonnes of hit ups! I would rather he kept the ball in hand and recycle than try and pass and loose it

If he did that every game that would be fine. However a typical game for him involves 4-5 knock-ons (and tonnes of hit-ups)....

 

[Muzzy]

The Highlanders should have gone for the try instead of that kick at goal in the 72nd minute, it was way too unlikely to score twice with only 8 minutes left. Scrum resets, lineouts etc would use up most of that time.

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

Ridiculous number of knock ons missed, embarrassing.

Ioane and Sopoaga made a big difference. Great impact players, I don't know why it's taken Joseph so long to start bringing them on before the 70 minute mark.

 

[Darwin]

The Highlanders should have gone for the try instead of that kick at goal in the 72nd minute, it was way too unlikely to score twice with only 8 minutes left. Scrum resets, lineouts etc would use up most of that time.

I thought going for the penalty was the right decision. It meant we could win the game with a penalty (or drop-goal), and I think 8 minutes was plenty of time to do this. Indeed 2-3 minutes later we got ourselves into a great position (a lineout throw inside the Reds 22 - about the same area we would have had it if we had gone for touch after the penalty), but the lineout was overthrown and we lost the ball.

 

[dasNdanger]

My condolences to the Highlanders' fans. I really wanted them to take this one, too, but just too many missed opportunities and sloppy mistakes. However, I will say that they seem to be improving, and hopefully they will find their winning pace by next match. Hopefully.

Is it just me, or is Justin Marshall a bit of a try-hard at trying to be neutral and overly "unbiased"?

I can't complain, it's not as bad as when a commentator is obviously very biased because that can give me, the armchair spectator, a false impression of the game. (I spend more time here defending Marshall than the players themselves...I'm pretty sure that's my sole purpose for being here. )


das

 

[Draggs]

I am not a fan of Nonu.
He has terrible awareness, a complete waste of ball.
He delays his passing so long that the player outside seems to have no time on it, if he even passes it. Way to much pointless kicking or taking it straight into contact. I find him painful to watch, he completely stifles what could be a classy backline.

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

I am not a fan of <strike>Nonu</strike> Frans Steyn.
He has terrible awareness, a complete waste of ball.
He delays his passing so long that the player outside seems to have no time on it, if he even passes it. Way to much pointless kicking or taking it straight into contact. I find him painful to watch, he completely stifles what could be a classy backline.

Fixed it for you

 

[dasNdanger]

Fixed it for you

Knew that was coming...


das

 

[Draggs]

Thanks Eze, saved me having to rewrite it every week.
Ctrl C, Ctrl V

 

[Kiwiwomble]

The Highlanders should have gone for the try instead of that kick at goal in the 72nd minute, it was way too unlikely to score twice with only 8 minutes left. Scrum resets, lineouts etc would use up most of that time.

This, we were down by four so a try would have put us in front and a converted one would have ment they need a try to win

 

[tenpm]

It would have given them the four-try bonus point too, IIRC.

But with these tough decisions, several points down and time running out, there's always going to be "what if"s afterwards no matter which option you pick.
And it's wasn't the option that let them down - they could still have won the match if their execution was better.

 

[Darwin]

I am not a fan of Nonu.
He has terrible awareness, a complete waste of ball.
He delays his passing so long that the player outside seems to have no time on it, if he even passes it. Way to much pointless kicking or taking it straight into contact. I find him painful to watch, he completely stifles what could be a classy backline.

When Nonu plays like this I agree. He is a waste of space. He often plays like this at Super Rugby level, but turns into a different player in a Black jersey (perhaps we should change our team colours ). At the moment he seems to take forever to decide what he is going to do - he is at his best when he makes up his mind early and just goes for it. When he passes early he is actually very effective, as he has a (surprisingly) long and accurate passing game. Likewise when he runs straight and hard (which he is yet to do for the Highlanders this season) he is difficult to stop, even though he isn't exactly subtle in his running style. He just needs to be told to act immediately once he gets the ball - delaying things works well for some players (e.g. Dan Carter), but it doesn't work for Nonu.

I have re-watched the game again, which may be a sign of my impending madness. Woodcock showed some signs of improvement, but still looked a little off the pace for me - I would relegate him to the bench next weekend. Hore too didn't offer much, with Coltman making far more of an impact when he came on (though his lineout throwing remains and issue). Brad Thorn is still working hard, with little support. I thought Hoeata again was nowhere near quick enough for the 6 jersey given our game-plan. As much as I hate to say it Ioane would be a better option at 6 for us than either Hoeata or Wheeler at this stage (though I would prefer either Boys or someone like Paul Grant..). Dixon again showed some positive signs with ball in hand, but he did miss a couple of tackles he should have made. Hardie is ok, but hasn't really hit the form he displaying at the start of last season.

While I'm not a fan of Ioane's style of play - mainly as it stifles any possibility of using the backline - it didn't actually hurt the Highlanders this match as our backline play has been pathetic all season. I still think it is a waste having him run the ball up at first or second receiver very single play (as if we were playing the 13-man code), but at least the backs aren't running sideways for a change!

Aaron Smith was solid at halfback, and it is good to see him use his running game a bit more in recent weeks. Slade was ok at 10, but hasn't really improved with game-time as I would have expected. At his best he attacks the line hard with ball in hand (ala Nick Evans), but the at the moment he is just shoveling the ball on, allowing the defenders to just drift off him. Nonu looks to be trying hard, but is trying to do far too much himself. Emery continues to impress though - it is easy to forget he is still only 19! His work on defense has impressed me a lot more this season, as he seems to have worked out that tackling around the legs is a good idea.

Popoali'i was electric with ball in hand (as usual), but importantly made his tackles on defense too. Gear continues to impress me despite the poor quality ball he is receiving. I was critical of Gear often last season as he often seemed very passive with ball in hand, and didn't really make the most of the space he received. This season is the complete opposite - he hasn't received any space, but has frequently got well beyond the advantage line with ball in hand. If the Highlanders eventually manage to make space for their wings opposition sides better watch out! Ben Smith was oddly very quiet. He looked good when he got the ball, but didn't chime into he backline as much as usual. One of the reasons for this was Slade was playing fullback a lot on defense - while Slade has more than enough skills to play here, the Highlanders miss Smith's innate ability to counter attack from the back.

 

[austingtir]

It would have given them the four-try bonus point too, IIRC.

But with these tough decisions, several points down and time running out, there's always going to be "what if"s afterwards no matter which option you pick.
And it's wasn't the option that let them down - they could still have won the match if their execution was better.

^^THIS They had every opportunity to win this they got the 3 points and were hard on attack and should have scored minus the silly mistake. The reds were looking out on their feet in that last 10 minutes... honestly it would of been a pretty easy win if they werent such a shambles.

I dont know what it is. Nonu hasnt been the best at super level the last few years probably with all the team swapping and so on. He was amazing on defence i thought but the knock ons and passing wasnt the best.

Something is just really wrong with how this team is going about things. The backrow is obvious but with that bunch of players they should be better than this. I dont rate that reds forward pack but at times they made the highlanders look a little silly until the last 10min or so.

Also im not 100% it was nonu's passing in this game that was the issue i thought his outside players were constantly overrunning him or on the verge of overrunning him before he's fired the pass so he's adjusting for that on the run and it ends up with forwards passes etc.

Knock on's from nonu are normal even at test level its nothing new. That did not loose this game.

 

[Draggs]

Hmmm, Highlanders not clicking.
So close, but not enough. I honestly feel that Thomson's departure is a big part of this. The Highlanders really revolved around him, especially in attack. The backrow looks unbalanced. I like Hardie, and the injuries haven't helped in general.

Burleigh looked good last year, I think he would be better for a flowing backline than Ma'a OhNo!
Gear though, talking about putting the team on your back! Must be an AB again this year. Emery is looking lively, not shy of getting involved, good to see.

 

[Darwin]

Hmmm, Highlanders not clicking.
So close, but not enough. I honestly feel that Thomson's departure is a big part of this. The Highlanders really revolved around him, especially in attack. The backrow looks unbalanced. I like Hardie, and the injuries haven't helped in general.

Burleigh looked good last year, I think he would be better for a flowing backline than Ma'a OhNo!
Gear though, talking about putting the team on your back! Must be an AB again this year. Emery is looking lively, not shy of getting involved, good to see.

Yep, I think people are starting to realize just how crucial Thomson was. He was outstanding at the breakdown, had incredibly mobility for a loose-forward, and was our primary lineout target too. Though I was never a massive fan of his at test level, he was exceptionally good at Super Rugby level.

I don't rate Burleigh very highly. He is a good distributor, but that is about it. He would be fine with crash-ball type centre outside him, but a Burleigh/Emery midfield would really lack physicality. He is also a bit of a liability on defense too (in contrast Nonu has been pretty strong defensively this year, apart from his habit of running out of the line a bit early at times...).

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

Burleigh/Emery looked pretty good against the Chiefs.

 

[Darwin]

Burleigh/Emery looked pretty good against the Chiefs.

They didn'y play together against the Chiefs did they? I thought it was Nonu/Emery.

They played together against the Hurricanes, and while they were pretty solid in attack, Burleigh was a revolving door in defense (against probably the least physical midfield combination in the competition!).

 

[Helmy]

I honestly think Nonu needs Conrad Smith outside him to do well. He looks good for the ABs, and aside from a shitty attitude, he played well for the Hurricanes, too.

Watching his, and other key players', body language last night when the Highlanders self imploded was very telling. Mistakes were being made, yes, but rather than clapping their hands together and trying to rark players up, there were dark looks at those making errors. This led to more blunders and Nonu making the ugliest one of the lot, though I can't see him putting his hand up and being accountable.

From the outside looking in, the Nonus and the Hores see themselves as star players in the Super rugby set up and this attitude seems to lead to a group of individuals rather than a team. I recall being at the gym once with a fringe Taranaki player present, when asked by someone what Hore was like, I'm sure I recall him saying something along the lines of 'excellent player, asshole of a person'.

Funny how Hammett was the one painted as a villain all those years ago, eh.

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

Sorry yeah, meant against the Canes!