Spring Tour: South Africa - England - 1st Test (09/06/2012, 16:00 GMT)

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

I think theres definitely something in the Tuilagi > wing experiment as well. Thinking about it, Wales get far more from George North coming in from his wing then we do from tuilagi playing in the centre. With license to come off his win as and when, Tuilagi could be deadly there. Then we can play 12: Barritt/Allen 13: Joseph! I'm quite excited at that, shame its unlikely.

Oh, and the small matter of getting the right halfbacks.

B10: If Haskell and Johnson were both to start it would be the other way round, with Haskell at 8 and Johnson at 6, probably

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Barritt has just said on Twitter he has had an operation to repair a tear in his eye, and that it should heal quickly.

I imagine he'll still be out for the next test (at least).
Knowing Lancaster, though, we'll have Farrell at 12.

 

[TRF_heineken]

I thought SA played rather poorly in that we were butchering opportunities with silly mistakes. The intensity made up for it but I felt we should have put this game away.

Glad to see the defensive improvements that were made over the RWC are still there.

Spies, kirschner and M Steyn should make way IMO. We got one-upped at the breakdown and I feel Brussow coming in with Coetzee moving to 8 and Spies getting the boot will go a long way to helping us out. Steyn scoring a try is probably the worst hing we could have had as he will in all likelyhood retain his place even though Lambie is incomparably more ale to direct traffic and doesn't give away anything at kicking for the posts compared to the current M Steyn and then there is F Steyn as another kicking option. Kirschner and Olivier who came off the bench are solid enough Superrugby players but not test players, please can see some test quality players come into the mix now that the water has been tested?

Hougaard brings a lot to the table but two things bug me about him; he takes his sweet time to clear a ball and with England bossing us at the breakdown he can't afford to do so and the other being he takes way too long to kick and he hasn't reached the accuracy of an on-form FdP in that department so i feel he needs to adapt his game to his stregths which are very Will Genia-ish.

I absolutely loved seeing the Free State pair of Oosthuizen and Strauss come off the bench!

Alberts had a massive game. I was concerned about his form for the Sharks but have to admit he hasn't had a bad game for the Boks yet on the side of the scrum.

Looking forward to see which team takes the most out of this match and who will make the most headway in the 'arms-race' over the week.

Morne Steyn will never live up to your standards now will he?? His defence was solid, he's passing brilliant, getting his backline away with no real problems, and scoring a try... This time his kicking was poor (even though there was a very strong wind). and still not satisfied?? Come on man, give the guy some credit!!

for the first time since the 2007 RWC final the Springboks had a gameplan, and every guy did his job, with 3 days of preparation! Am I the only one standing up and giving them the worthy applause they deserved??

Habana was again his old self like when he used to play for Meyer. Hougaard needs to work on his peripheral vision a little bit.

Our team clearly showed they still need to gel, but that will happen in due time as they get used to each other. Coenie Oosthuizen demolished the English scrums, man that guy made my day!

 

[big ginger 8]

Maybe it's just interpretation but when I'm reffing and the current directives from the RFU is to firstly concentrate on the tight heads bind and thus for me Cole was engaging with a short arm bind and dropping it. Had SA allowed the scrum to continue meaning it would collapse I personally would have been penalising Cole in most occasions for illegal binding.

As part of their technique looseheads go for a longer bind and tightheads go for a shorter one.

 

[coonor]

As part of their technique looseheads go for a longer bind and tightheads go for a shorter one.

Yes but a short arm bind on the arm is illegal, it's basically the first thing referees look for once the scrum has engaged.

 

[big ginger 8]

Yes but a short arm bind on the arm is illegal, it's basically the first thing referees look for once the scrum has engaged.

On the arm sorry you didn't specify you just said short bind.

 

[Peat]

Thoughts from the last three pages...

Botha goes high because it's a Sarries thing. They tend to throw multiple guys at the same tackle with the priority being preventing the offload rather than stopping the man, as they'd rather concede an extra 5 yards than a linebreaking offload. I don't have any proof of this, but it's just occurred to me and I believe the theory is sound. I'm no great fan of Botha, and would replace him, but can live with him staying as well. Which is just as well given the locks we brought on tour...

Farrell is definitely a problem. He simply doesn't have the vision, experience or skills to get a backline moving from 10. He just about has the skills to create something from 12 but is rendered impotent there by his complete lack of a running game.

Can't say I like the idea of Tuilagi as a wing. Don't think he's fast enough, and would probably suffer on the non-running basics. I know he's played there, but not for a while. Foden was defensively sound on the wing - attacking wise, nobody knows because nothing came from inside until right at the end. Sort out the midfield before we start to sort the wings. Personally, if he can't find a place in the centres, drop him. Incidentally, Manu does have a good offloading game, and used it the one time he could. The rest of the time he simply tried to barrel through people and didn't end the collision with his arms free and ready. Partially I think that's Tuilagi needing to rein himself in a little. Partially I think that's England needing to direct him away from traffic. Tuilagi's got quick feet as well. We're managing to turn him into less than he is.

Marler's attack wasn't that great, but then he too was sent directly at traffic. There is a flaw with England's tactics. Corbs will be the better player next week if fit, due to experience imo.

Morgan will need to be benched next week at altitude. I repeat my belief he is not yet fit enough. Makes a great impact when he hits the ball, anonymous otherwise.

 

[coonor]

On the arm sorry you didn't specify you just said short bind.

Fair enough, like I said before at the scrum different referees have different interpretation and I may be considered quite strict with binding but for me it's the main aspect to look at during the scrum.

I think SA should keep Steyn at 10. He controlled the game well and offers a kicking game which really damaged England. Maybe if SA win the next test Lambie could be given a run at 10 but I think Steyn is the player that will have more influence in beating England.

 

[racingmetrofan]

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,16024_7805193,00.html

Barritt out for next weekend and England waiting on Brown with a hand injury according to planet rugby.

 

[Sker]

Another thing we're missing I think is that for the first time in four or five years we might actually have a front row that other teams will start to fear. With the aging but legendary John Smit our scrum was always a weakness.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Mike Brown out of the tour with a broken hand/torn ligament. Nick Abendanon has been called up to replace him.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Mike Brown out of the tour with a broken hand/torn ligament. Nick Abendanon has been called up to replace him.

Shame for Brown but it should put an end to the two fullbacks experiment which although I was quite curious to see turned out to be pretty futile and prevaricating the act of actually finding another credible winger. I hope Strettle isn't resorted to though.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

You never know, they might just replace Brown with Goode and go from there!

 

[j-dawg]

Big shame, he looked good.

Am I the only one that thinks England will pull off a win this Saturday?

 

[Peat]

You never know, they might just replace Brown with Goode and go from there!

Or stick Bendy on the wing, safe in the knowledge he's played tons at full-back...

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Big shame, he looked good.

Am I the only one that thinks England will pull off a win this Saturday?

You perhaps are, although I admire your optimism.

We stand a credible change but I just feel in the coming weeks South Africa will improve at a rate faster than our own improvement, as they really were starting from scratch for that 1st test.

It's very possible but only, in my view, by striking early and making SA chase the game, like we did against France in the six nations. We have to make them play more rugby and thats where our strong defence and determination will be rewarded because it will frustrate them if they try things and they don't come off. But in order to stirke hard and early we need to do things differently in the backs.

 

[Sker]

I think it's possible for England to win, they've been playing good rugby, then again maybe if our team is a bit more settled Saturday...

Guess we just have to wait


EDIT: Your fly-half scares the living **** out of me, not about the way he plays but about the way he looks. Looks like he wants to eat someone or make sweet love to them, or both.

EDIT 2: If Pienaar/Lambie/Steyn starts next week, one of them can kick at posts, Morne is not good with the goalkicking this year.

 

[j-dawg]

You perhaps are, although I admire your optimism.

We stand a credible change but I just feel in the coming weeks South Africa will improve at a rate faster than our own improvement, as they really were starting from scratch for that 1st test.

It's very possible but only, in my view, by striking early and making SA chase the game, like we did against France in the six nations. We have to make them play more rugby and thats where our strong defence and determination will be rewarded because it will frustrate them if they try things and they don't come off. But in order to stirke hard and early we need to do things differently in the backs.

You speak alot of sense. England tried to beat the Boks by bashing them up physically. At the end of the 1st test some of those South Africans looked like they had been in a fight rather than a rugby match. As you say, England need a different approach while keeping the 'white wall' defensively that they used well in the 6 nations. If the backs up their game we have a good chance.

 

[Saintjay]

I think we may have missed the best chance we had. Like others I would be happy to take one win out the three and last saturday was the best of the tests to do that.

The set piece can hold it's own as can the defence but unless we solve the 9,10 and distribution issues for attack we are going to struggle. We need to be hitting about 25 points in a match to be winning imo, and the backs can't manage that.

 

[Darwin]

Thoughts from the last three pages...

Botha goes high because it's a Sarries thing. They tend to throw multiple guys at the same tackle with the priority being preventing the offload rather than stopping the man, as they'd rather concede an extra 5 yards than a linebreaking offload. I don't have any proof of this, but it's just occurred to me and I believe the theory is sound. I'm no great fan of Botha, and would replace him, but can live with him staying as well. Which is just as well given the locks we brought on tour...

Farrell is definitely a problem. He simply doesn't have the vision, experience or skills to get a backline moving from 10. He just about has the skills to create something from 12 but is rendered impotent there by his complete lack of a running game.

Can't say I like the idea of Tuilagi as a wing. Don't think he's fast enough, and would probably suffer on the non-running basics. I know he's played there, but not for a while. Foden was defensively sound on the wing - attacking wise, nobody knows because nothing came from inside until right at the end. Sort out the midfield before we start to sort the wings. Personally, if he can't find a place in the centres, drop him. Incidentally, Manu does have a good offloading game, and used it the one time he could. The rest of the time he simply tried to barrel through people and didn't end the collision with his arms free and ready. Partially I think that's Tuilagi needing to rein himself in a little. Partially I think that's England needing to direct him away from traffic. Tuilagi's got quick feet as well. We're managing to turn him into less than he is.

Marler's attack wasn't that great, but then he too was sent directly at traffic. There is a flaw with England's tactics. Corbs will be the better player next week if fit, due to experience imo.

Morgan will need to be benched next week at altitude. I repeat my belief he is not yet fit enough. Makes a great impact when he hits the ball, anonymous otherwise.

Though I'm certainly no expert on English rugby, I wouldn't be a fan of putting Tuilagi on the wing either. How much experience has he got on the wing? His pace wouldn't be a concern for me, but his 'non-running basics' would be a major concern: Is he familiar with the defensive responsibilities of a wing? Is he strong under the high ball? Does he have a kicking game? South Africa are experts are targeting opposition wingers with their kicking game - any inexperience/weakness in opposition wingers will usually be exploited. Though I can certainly see the attraction of having Tuilagi on the wing, I think a test match versus South Africa is the last place you would want to experiment!