South Africa vs British & Irish Lions - Test 1

[Leonormous Boozer]

Murray is different as he was made captain a few weeks into tour after Gatland had time to assess his squad and be in training with them as well as get to know the player on a peronal level judging their mentality and all that. So Murray becoming captain would not have been based on some random Roulette gamble. Coaches know not to make players captain that they think is not a likely stater. I hear your Warburton case, but Murray was one picked in different circumstances.

We're talking about a coach who has left arguably the tours best player in Josh Adams out of the 23, I wouldn't apply too much logic to Amy of his decisions.

 

[Groundhog]

Beirne is imo a world class player and to leave him on the bench for me is a poor enough decision. I get what people are arguing for Lawes, I just simply disagree as you start your best players for me and without being disrespectful Beirne is a comfortably better player.

A number of pretty poor selections, don't think either side will hammer the other but would expect the Boks to win it as I don't see many areas Lions are clearly better bar maybe the scrum for the first 50, and the SA have a big edge in halfbacks, but you never know how teams will show up.

Hope Conan goes well, great opportunity for the guy and I have no doubt he's good enough. Really the only pleasant surprise as an Irish fan, but sure look I've said my piece enough. Hope the few Irish boys go well and stay fit. Still rooting for the Boks, but I do hope it's a cracking game all the same. To be even handed I was genuinely shocked Adams didn't make the team. Wouldn't drop a winger when he's that hot.

 

[big ginger 8]

Just remembered Furlong, Beirne, Henderson and Conan were all in the same u20 team in 2012, very impressive. The SA team that they played in the first game of the JWRC had both Kitshoff and PsdT.

 

[AlRums]

We're talking about a coach who has left arguably the tours best player in Josh Adams out of the 23, I wouldn't apply too much logic to Amy of his decisions.

Actually Adams's stats aren't that great

9 tackles made, 4 tackles missed 69%
13 defenders beaten
8 passes, 4 offloads
266 metres from 30 carries
5 turnovers conceded
3 handling errors
4 times kicked possession away, 3 time retained, for 266m

Out of 3 games played in SA + Japan, for 298 mins

DVdM for comparison

13 tackles made, 5 tackles missed 72%
29 defenders beaten
14 passes, 4 offloads
463 metres from 38 carries
6 turnovers conceded
4 handling errors
1 time kicked possession retained, for 10m

Out of 3 games played in SA + Japan, for 360 mins

 

[Dean Cooperfield-West]

You can have the best stats in the world but if you're not in the right place at the right time to score tries or assist in their making, who cares? Adams seems to have that lucky knack of being there when needed

 

[AlRums]

You can have the best stats in the world but if you're not in the right place at the right time to score tries or assist in their making, who cares? Adams seems to have that lucky knack of being there when needed

Plus the vision of a fly half kickng to him

 

[Scotty]

So why do SA not seem to rate Cobus Reinach? I'd put him ahead of Faf when i seen them both in the prem.

 

[Jimbo]

So why do SA not seem to rate Cobus Reinach? I'd put him ahead of Faf when i seen them both in the prem.

I'd agree the guy was absolutely electric I remember a series of almost length of the field scores largely off intercepts, only thing I couldn't think of is that he isn't as physical and seems a little more instinctive than playing to a GP.

 

[Jimbo]

This and I'm still nowhere near convinced at Lawes as an international 6. Plus if I wanted someone with that task in mind Underhill is far better suited to it and he's not even on tour.

But he wasn't selected so if the coaches have decided they need to assign someone from the squad to make life difficult for Faf then Lawes is a good fit, that may not be a tactic and may never have been, or it could be one that was only dreamt up post squad select I am just surmising possibilities.

 

[unrated]

We're talking about a coach who has left arguably the tours best player in Josh Adams out of the 23, I wouldn't apply too much logic to Amy of his decisions.

But is this alleged Adam's exclusion you mention based on the same lineup that I contest is fake because I note that Murray is not involved? So then you try to prove its validity by pointing out a Gatland idiosyncrasy? Also considering Adams is Welsh.

If it was already confirmed then yes the Adams exclusion supports the argument. For now the Adams rumour only supports my allegations.

PS. if the line up was officially revealed already I probably look like an idiot now.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Agreed on all points. Maybe would not have started Mapimpi yet and kept Nkosi. Would have kept the twins in the squad for the rugby championship and dropped Elstad. He has not impressed me. Wiese and Nicholaas Janse van Rensburg has not yet showed me why people rate them. I can't believe for the first time in my life a Springbok was selected (Janse Van Rensburg) and I have never even heard of him. For the average rugby fan maybe...

Yeah, I don't know a thing about the guy either other than having read his name off a Montpol Wiki page once looking for SA players in France. That said we are short of lock depth with RG out and if its between a random guy playing in France or Orie for 4th choice lock who hopefully won't see game time in the tests anyway I know who I'd go for so I'm glad the staff do look further afield and I trust the bloke has the goods.

Just nicked this off Twitter: The Times names the following as Lions side:

Hogg; A Watson, E Daly, R Henshaw, D van der Merwe; D Biggar, A Price; W Jones, L Cowan-Dickie, T Furlong, A W Jones (c), M Itoje, C Lawes, T Curry, J Conan. Replacements K Owens, R Sutherland, K Sinckler, T Beirne, H Watson, I Henderson, C Murray, O Farrell.

Team announcement now brought forward.

True or not? You decide...

That is a very good side to be fair. I read the stats higher up RE DvdM vs Adams but I think Adams would be better vs us specifically but that said I'm no test coach.

So why do SA not seem to rate Cobus Reinach? I'd put him ahead of Faf when i seen them both in the prem.

I think just Faf's defensive game around the ruck and covering is the point of difference, he reads the game well in defense and we do like a 9 who does the work there. Joost probably the best in the business in that regard. FdP was always in position for chip kicks and though not the most physically imposing player did make his cover tackles. IE its more Faf's play without the ball than with it why he is our top dog IMO at least.

I dont agree nyakane was second choice. Sure he didnt start against the all blacks, but neither did the beast. Thar was about the opposition - rassie saw a weakness in the all blacks reserve scrum and wanted to exploit it. Nyakane was brilliant all through 2019, pretty hard to see why hed be second choice.

I agree Nyakane was 1st choice TH going into the 2019 RWC. Its just that since then he actually has had some domestic rugby and faced Georgia and the B&I Lions and in ALL of those games he has looked a shadow of his 2019 self in the scrum specifically, which is something we would otherwise actually like to use as a weapon for letting the score board tick over in 3 point increments putting pressure on the opp and feeding off of mistakes, scoring on turn overs and intercepts. Its not 2007 any more but a lot of our rugby we still like to play without the ball. We just know we are as a rugby nation.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Getting pretty excited for this match now. Should be a cracker.

Good to see Form players picked and picks have have not been overly biased towards Wales. Good mix from each nation.

Gats keeping the likes of Faletau, Williams, Adams back for 2nd test if needed.

Bring on Saturday.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Yep, when all is said and done these are two sets of great players and should be an intriguing game. Trusting Nyakane's class to show through and that we won't miss Vermeulen too much.

 

[unrated]

Rassie said that because some of the players are low on game time they did not want to risk the 6/2 split. Players will play until the coaches realize their can't fulfill the job required of them. If we can build up enough match fitness expect to see a 6/2 for the second or maybe only the third test with Francois Steyn covering the whole Backline along with a 9.

Edit: Nienaber said this not Rassie

 

[Dean Cooperfield-West]

The leak was bang on


Lions: Stuart Hogg; Anthony Watson, Elliot Daly, Robbie Henshaw, Duhan van der Merwe; Dan Biggar, Ali Price; Wyn Jones, Luke Cowan-Dickie, Tadhg Furlong; Maro Itoje, Alun Wyn Jones (capt); Courtney Lawes, Tom Curry, Jack Conan.

Reps: Ken Owens, Rory Sutherland, Kyle Sinckler, Tadhg Beirne, Hamish Watson, Conor Murray, Owen Farrell, Liam Williams.

Only difference is Henderson drops off the bench and Williams comes on. 5:3 rather than the 6:2

 

[McTallshort]

Glad Conan is 8. Not sure about AYJ coming in but hopefully he prove me wrong.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Not the worst team he could pick but not the best by any means.

AWJ is a joke. Jones over Sutherland I get is preferable, both good players.

Lawes at 6 is odd. He has some really poor games there but every now and again he has a blinder at 6 so hopefully he has one of those games, but Bearnie has looked way better.

No Adam's is odd, I expected Daly at 13 though, he's played well there.

 

[unrated]

I stand corrected.

 

[big ginger 8]

Really feel for Henderson.

Delighted for Conan. In fairness if you swapped Lawes and Beirne I'd be excited enough about the team.

 

[General Melchett]

Not exactly the same as the leaked team. Sanjay is on the bench instead of Henderson.