[RWC2019][The Final] England vs. South Africa (02/11/2019)

[Leonormous Boozer]

I worry if we get dragged into an arm wrestle - I rate our pack to match the physicality of the Boks pack, however I don't rate our discipline. It was very good vs New Zealand but traditionally/lately has been real poor - could see SA chipping away 3pts by 3pts until it's a real mountain to climb if we're not careful.

I read somewhere that these two have only scored one try between them in world cup finals. Jones' biggest challenge is to make sure his players don't go into their shells a bit with nerves, if SA can get ahead or keep the game scoreless in the first 15 while hitting hard it's gonna get ugly and England haven't won ugly in a while!

Easier said than done though, I still have this as 75/25 England. Can't stress how shite my predictions have been since that typhoon though!

 

[Ben Gerber]

15-9 to England. England have been outstanding and will have some *well placed* confidence after beating the AB's

Boks have a great track record in the World Cup.. but given recent performances, quality of coaching and probably stronger desire (because of the last World Cup) I think we will do it.

I am watching the game with some serious rugby heads. We are go proing the TV and recording our reactions. If anything priceless comes up I'll post them up

 

[Yoshimitsu]

I reckon the whole game comes down to who starts better. England have good form in this regard but it's no guarantee. The hardest time to blast through brick wall is when they are fresh. I suspect the Boks will be better in the first 10 mins than New Zealand were.

I can't see the Boks tactics being any good for chasing a score. They were never behind against the Welsh. However, if they get ahead their suffocation tactics are near perfect. England will have to go full Australia on them and we know what happens when that goes wrong.

If England score early and get at any point a 10 point lead they'll go on to win comfortably. The same for the Boks... England are more likely to get there quickly but overall probably no more likely to get there at all...........

Frankly it's all too terrifying to comprehend!

 

[MarkyH]

Every flipping Monday the ford / farrell rubbish starts. Always a slow news day...

 

[User1245]

I think some English fans are being a tad naive about this Boks team. Remember this is the team that the All Blacks haven't been able to beat in New Zealand two years running.
Wales was always going to be a grind. They dispatched Italy very easily. Won the Rugby Championship.
Yes England put in a great performance against the ABs but the ABs were also smoked by the wallabies earlier in the year

 

[Pom in Exile]

So this isn't exactly the final matchup I wanted. Just moved to London a couple of days ago and believe I'm the only South African in the office. So either my first week of work next week is either going to be great or terrible.

Nevertheless, I plan on watching the game in an English pub with my Springbok jersey on. I don't believe this will be a high scoring game and I think it should be close given the two best defenses in the tournament, but I'm not feeling particularly confident. Still have faith though and am looking forward to kick-off.

Mate, you won't have far to look for somebody else in a Springbok jersey, there's loads of Saffas in London. Good luck in the new job, in a new country and in the game. Well certainly the first two anyway.

 

[Pom in Exile]

Saturday's final is not only between two lifelong enemies, but also between two very astute coaches.

Lifelong enemies? I get that everybody hates England but can't really think of any nation these days that would be classed as an enemy, not in a serious way anyway.

 

[Pom in Exile]

B&I Lions? Next tour is in SA

Gatland's already got the gig hasn't he?!

 

[Kapa O Pango]

Springboks tatic is to let Faf spin the ball on his finger for 80mins

 

[Leinster Fan]

On the subject of Ford/Farrell, surely England would be mad not to start Ford? Regardless of playing ability and whatnot, if Farrell is carrying a knock you want another kicking option on the pitch. You don't want his issue to flare up after 20 minutes and be left without a goal kicker. Not like they have an option to replace him with either, Slade has looked iffy and Joseph isn't getting much time (and a Tualagi-Jospeh would be so one-dimensional). Not many changes on either team (as you'd expect at this stage) I imagine, if Nowell is fit he could probably replace Joseph on the bench but that's it probably.

On the SA side, I understand why Le Roux is in the team but surely a player in form as poor as he is can be dropped. Not sure who would replace him though (any SA fans who can enlighten me?) Kolbe will come back in if he's fit as well presumably.

 

[j-dawg]

I read somewhere that these two have only scored one try between them in world cup finals.

Robinson in 03 and Cueto in 07. Change my mind.

 

[User1245]

Gatland's already got the gig hasn't he?!

Man that dude has got a sweet gig up there. I don't get it

 

[Zed]

I haven't seen much of the Boks in 2019. Watched the ABs vs SA game and the semi. They played OK in patches against the ABs, but were very ordinary against Wales. Not sure if they had a bad game or they just don't have the players? Their pack seemed competitive, 9 was lively, 10 was pretty solid. Not sure about De Allende. He went well, but then the Welsh defence was crap for his try. If he tries he hit it up in 12 channel against England he'll be cut apart by Curry/Underhill, goes wide he'll have Tuilagi licking his lips.... I liked watching him run though, so hope he has a good game. Boks seemed ordinary past 12. The back 3 were dreadful against Wales, loads of handling errors especially when contesting for high balls, they looked quick, but little power and penetration, no breaking of tackles. I ended up missing a lot of the game, ended up chatting as the game was very uninspiring. I'm hoping the final will be a cracker, but if England play like they do against NZ and SA play like they do against Wales it will be a 30 point game (to England). SA made lots of handling errors and when the ABs did that, England generally made the most of the mistakes, either getting points or vital territory. SA will need to improve this area. This isn't rhetorical as I don't know this Boks team, but do they have the players to play a wide expansive game? That's the only way they will beat England. Trying to grind it out like they did against Wales, won't work.

 

[Derpus]

I think some English fans are being a tad naive about this Boks team. Remember this is the team that the All Blacks haven't been able to beat in New Zealand two years running.
Wales was always going to be a grind. They dispatched Italy very easily. Won the Rugby Championship.
Yes England put in a great performance against the ABs but the ABs were also smoked by the wallabies earlier in the year

The Wallabies smoking the ABs appears to be an outlier.

Anyway - anything can happen on the day and the Bokies know tournament rugby. Won't be thrilling stuff but should be tense.

England by a few.

 

[Derpus]

Lifelong enemies? I get that everybody hates England but can't really think of any nation these days that would be classed as an enemy, not in a serious way anyway.

Said it yourself, England is everyone's enemy.

 

[Zed]

I think some English fans are being a tad naive about this Boks team. Remember this is the team that the All Blacks haven't been able to beat in New Zealand two years running.
Wales was always going to be a grind. They dispatched Italy very easily. Won the Rugby Championship.
Yes England put in a great performance against the ABs but the ABs were also smoked by the wallabies earlier in the year

It's a solid, but unspectacular Boks side. They seem to be lacking in firepower with some limitations that will restrict the way they play. Very few line breaks against ABs in the pool game and Wales. They kind of remind me of a traditional English rugby team. We were lucky England didn't put 50 points on us in the 1/4s and the ABs are lucky they didn't have 30 points put on them. in the semis. If you did a combined SA/Eng XV there would be few Boks that would make the side. That said, they drew with the ABs this year, smashed us in the RC so they are capable of winning, but it won't be pretty and England would have to have a shocker. I can't see Boks changing their game plan, it will be a carbon copy of the Welsh game, which could make for a dreadful final if England get dragged into an arm wrestle. But I don't see that happening. Wales didn't capitalise on SA's mistakes, England will.

 

[Pom in Exile]

Said it yourself, England is everyone's enemy.

Don't I know it, but not sure that it cuts both ways tbh.
Anyway, jealousy's a stinky cologne.

 

[Zed]

I worry if we get dragged into an arm wrestle - I rate our pack to match the physicality of the Boks pack, however I don't rate our discipline. It was very good vs New Zealand but traditionally/lately has been real poor - could see SA chipping away 3pts by 3pts until it's a real mountain to climb if we're not careful.

What impressed me about the English back 3 was their capability in the air, receiving high balls and chasing and catching high balls. Both SA and Wales were poor in this department, unable to catch cleanly, kick, knock-on, scrum, kick and repeat, wait for the penalty... And the general handling skills of the English, not just the backs, but the forwards. They have the skillset to play a wide, expansive game. The first 2 mins against the ABs were sublime, don't really care what colour shirt they were wearing, it's good watching a rugby team play great rugby. That's why we love watching the ABs play. The level they play at has always been so much higher. England went from left to right and back again with long, accurate bullet passes. Very hard to defend against. They have no reason to get into a tight arm wrestle. Unlike previous England sides, this team has the ability to play open rugby. Does SA have that ability? Having forwards running off the 10 for 4, 5 phases and then kick and chasing isn't going to cut the mustard.

 

[Pom in Exile]

Man that dude has got a sweet gig up there. I don't get it

Me neither, think it's to do with continuity, but it's devalued the Lions a bit, for me anyway.

 

[Jer1cho]

Greeeeeat Garces is the ref