RWC: All Blacks - Canada (02-10-2011, 15:30)

[Dizzy]

I like New Zealand and I think they are amazing for growing the game of rugby. There is no side that plays like them and they are the best team in the world. I even
own an All Blacks jersey that I bought back in 2002.

Now that being said, I have heard that "best at modern rugby" phrase before 2003 and before 2007. Doesn't mean it isn't true, but you can make the comparision. Depening on who Canada plays and who New Zealand sits, we could see 55-60 with Canada popping in a try or 80-90 against Canada 2nd string (which includes a kid at 18 years old.) It all depends who plays. Please be realistic about this and stop belittling your opposition. It only makes you look bad.
I knew plenty of very nice but very arrogant Kiwis who rubbed it in my face last time these 2 teams played in the World Cup. I can't say I didn't enjoy speaking about what happened later in that tournament.

Being overconfident about a sports team that your not apart of only comes back to bite you in the ass later on.

Ouch, bite me why don't you. I wasn't being arrogant and rubbing it in the front of your head, I was just stating what imo is going to happen.

Being overconfident? About what? That the All Blacks are going to beat any team we come up against convincingly???
That's called being a fan. You're always confident in your team no matter who they are or how good, you always have faith and believe you are going to win. It just turns out my home nation is the All Blacks and 80-90% of the time they do defeat their opponents convinvingly. Just like you believe the game will be tighter than what I think. And as for the statement "a sports team that your not involved in" real grown up bro, you might as well say that to everyone else here who has a confident opinion in their favourite team.

 

[Canucks]

Ouch, bite me why don't you. I wasn't being arrogant and rubbing it in the front of your head, I was just stating what imo is going to happen.

Being overconfident? About what? That the All Blacks are going to beat any team we come up against convincingly???
That's called being a fan. You're always confident in your team no matter who they are or how good, you always have faith and believe you are going to win. It just turns out my home nation is the All Blacks and 80-90% of the time they do defeat their opponents convinvingly. Just like you believe the game will be tighter than what I think. And as for the statement "a sports team that your not involved in" real grown up bro, you might as well say that to everyone else here who has a confident opinion in their favourite team.

I apologise if it appeared that I was attacking you. I can understand that what I said would appear to be condescending and that was not my intention but I still stand by my points.
The "sports team" comment was not meant to paint you in a negative light by saying you aren't athletic or anything else like that. What I am referring to is that you have no real control over what happens and to sit there and to say 140-6 shows a complete lack of respect for your oppostion. My point is that no actual player on the ABs would show such disrepect, so why, as an avid supporter, should you? Absolutely be proud of your country and team, and I agree what you said about faith. Hell, I've been a Vancouver Canucks fan since I was boy, I know about having faith in your team. But it just makes you look bad when belittle Canada and pass if off as just being confident.

 

[donmcdazzle]

Canada are pretty physical, and play with decent structure. You would expect them to fall away in the second half though. The most important thing for the AB's is no injuries, winning margin is irrelevant. We need good set piece, don't concede any tries, no injuries and I'd be happy regardless of how many we get. In saying that I predict about 70-odd.

 

[FlukeArtist]

I would hope Canada start their best team.

I'm sure those guys will be more than willing to play the All Blacks in NZ.
Its not like it happens on a regular basis.
I'd be gutted if I was Leesburger and they didn't select me.

I can't think of any reason they'd want to play a "b" team anyway.

 

[Bazzy]

I would hope Canada start their best team.

I'm sure those guys will be more than willing to play the All Blacks in NZ.
Its not like it happens on a regular basis.
I'd be gutted if I was Leesburger and they didn't select me.

I can't think of any reason they'd want to play a "b" team anyway.

QFT

Yeah it's their last game so would be great if they play their best team. Canada once again did get the raw deal in terms of time between games and I know that money plays a big part in this but I hope IRB takes a look at this for the next cup.

Naturally I expect All Blacks to win comfortably in the end but if Canada plays their best XV, I expect them to show pretty decent fight atleast in the first half. Realistically I'm expecting All Blacks to get into the 50's possibly 60's depending on whether Canada runs out of steam near the end due to their schedule.

 

[UilamOsa]

I apologise if it appeared that I was attacking you. I can understand that what I said would appear to be condescending and that was not my intention but I still stand by my points.
The "sports team" comment was not meant to paint you in a negative light by saying you aren't athletic or anything else like that. What I am referring to is that you have no real control over what happens and to sit there and to say 140-6 shows a complete lack of respect for your oppostion. My point is that no actual player on the ABs would show such disrepect, so why, as an avid supporter, should you? Absolutely be proud of your country and team, and I agree what you said about faith. Hell, I've been a Vancouver Canucks fan since I was boy, I know about having faith in your team. But it just makes you look bad when belittle Canada and pass if off as just being confident.

Well then, I apologise on behalf of those that believe that the AB's will put more than 50+ (80+ for me) against the Canadians.

I mean no disrespect and have become a fan of the Canucks (Mostly DTH & Kleeberger) but can see no other result.

That said - if the world were to stop and the AB's were to lose - I would stand and applaud the Canucks and so would the majority of the rugby world. (although the boks & aussies & poms would be laughing their respective asses off)

 

[Canucks]

Well then, I apologise on behalf of those that believe that the AB's will put more than 50+ (80+ for me) against the Canadians.

I mean no disrespect and have become a fan of the Canucks (Mostly DTH & Kleeberger) but can see no other result.

That said - if the world were to stop and the AB's were to lose - I would stand and applaud the Canucks and so would the majority of the rugby world. (although the boks & aussies & poms would be laughing their respective asses off)

I appreciate that. I really do but how your looking at it is fine.

It's not about one comment, it was a continuous thing. I do think depending on who plays it could go from 50-60 to the 80s if Canada for some reason plays their 2nd team. I mean being realistic on who plays and such it could be either of those.
My issue is that someone was summarily dismissing Canada as a crap team without looking at any facts. Clearly, the ABs are a much much much much better team, but not 140-6. Canada has some pretty good players, none as good as the ABs, but still some good players and if there was a tier 2 tournament, you'd see Canada be in the upper echelon of the tier 2 teams.

As I said before, I like the AB's, I have an All Black jersey (and an Auckland Blues) I bought in 2002 and routinely stayed up to 5 in the morning to watch the Blues play Super12. I hope as much as you guys that they can win it at home and cheer for you, but not to the point to slag off any other teams needlessly.


Now that being said, one of the Canada players (not naming any names) that I used to play with had a bit of a mouth on him. I must say, it will be satisfying watching him play the ABs.

 

[Larksea]

140-6....

the Boks, (out of all the teams) are the holders of the highest winning margin so far... but that was against Namibia... I think the AB can do much better playing their weakest team in their group...

Canada beat Tonga and Drew with Japan, and because this is the last pool game their is no reason for Canada to play a 2nd string team or rest their top players. I expect this game to be at least as tough as the Tongan game. Maybe more so.

 

[Darwin]

Bit of a worry for the AB's, with Kieran Read rolling his ankle at training. The AB's coaches are playing down the injury, so hopefully it is nothing to worry about, however Read does need some gametime before the knock-out phase.

I heard Kieran Crowley on the radio today stating that Canada would play its top team versus the AB's. This is good news not only for Canadian supporters, but for the AB's, as they need as hard a game as possible to prepare them for their quarter-final.

 

[Larksea]

I think Guildford could very well be in line for a run. He will be desperate to take the field and show he's a better player than the Aussie game and could have a blinder. Hard to imagine him doing enough to force to a position in the 1st side though unless there is a more serious injury. With kahui now one of the first names down and Jane, SBW and Toeava ahead of Guildford in the wing pecking order.

 

[mchose]

Well +100% chance of losing, all I can say is I'm damn proud of my team for making it this far, and I hope that rugby continues to gain popularity in Canada. Maybe in years to comes Canada will become a contender May the best team win!

 

[LittleGuy]

Bit of a worry for the AB's, with Kieran Read rolling his ankle at training. The AB's coaches are playing down the injury, so hopefully it is nothing to worry about, however Read does need some gametime before the knock-out phase.

I heard Kieran Crowley on the radio today stating that Canada would play its top team versus the AB's. This is good news not only for Canadian supporters, but for the AB's, as they need as hard a game as possible to prepare them for their quarter-final.

This is fantastic news!!! The game is on in Prime time in Canada Saturday night 10 p.m. EDT(7 P.M. PDT) and I'm hoping the boys can put on a good show for what should be a pretty big audience on TV( especially as the game follows a big CFL derby game Hamilton vs. Toronto) I really feel as though this RWC has been a turning point for Canadian rugby and there is more optimism than since probably 1999-2000ish. If TSN (who are showing the RWC here) continue picking up the national team games than the followers will grow I hope they consider picking up every game not just the home ones people will tune in to see Canada play just about anyone.

I'm also wishing that a good balance is struck in the next four year cycle, I want to see young players given a chance but at the same time I don't want to see useful veterans thrown to the sidelines completely some of the darkest years in Canadian rugby have occured after RWC's 2004 and 2008 were both pretty bad and I feel as though a lot of players who could still contribute left of their own accord or were ditched. Positive results will hope boost the confidence of the younger guys, and will also bring more attention to Canadian rugby as this RWC has.

 

[Larksea]

Enlarge photo


All Blacks Coach Graham Henry and his Assistant Coaches Steve Hansen and Wayne Smith have today announced the All Blacks team for their final Pool match of the 2011 Rugby World Cup against Canada at Wellington Regional Stadium, Wellington, on Sunday October 1.
Starting XV:
1. Tony Woodcock (79)
2. Andrew Hore (58)
3. Owen Franks (26)
4. Samuel Whitelock (21)
5. Ali Williams (69)
6. Jerome Kaino (44)
7. Richie McCaw â€" captain (100)
8. Kieran Read (32)
9. Jimmy Cowan (49)
10. Daniel Carter (84)
11. Zac Guildford (7)
12. Sonny Bill Williams (10)
13. Conrad Smith (51)
14. Israel Dagg (9)
15. Mils Muliaina (99)

Reserves: 16. Keven Mealamu (88)
17. Ben Franks (13)
18. Brad Thorn (55)
19. Anthony Boric (23)
20. Piri Weepu (52)
21. Colin Slade (8)
22. Isaia Toeava (34)

 

[Larksea]

some big changes, some forced by injuries in the last game

Good thing Mills is back, I hope he has a blinder.

Forward pack is pretty much full strength, Hore would be my #1 hooker and I haven't been hugely impressed with Brad thorn. I know it's hard to quantify the work he does in the scrums but his workrate in other areas hasn't been flash. Ball carrying in particular. I'd expect a big guy with his reputation to take the ball up more than a couple of times in a game. Also Ali Williams was very impressive off the bench against france. His Ball carrying in particular was impressive getting over the advantage line from static ball.

Big chances in the backs, two most notable being Zac and Mills onto the park and SBW starting for Nonu.

Funny I was actually liking the two locks on the bench thing but I expected that to change when Read was back. But they have stuck too it. Two fresh locks is not a bad thing to have late in the game. Boric is a fantastic defender and line jumper having him fresh in the last quarter is a good call though I would like to have seen him start. He and thorn or williams starting is a great combination.

I expect peolpe to winge about not playing the strongest 15 every game. It is a balancing act. Look at Aussie now - they mostly play their best team every game and they have got to the point they have so many injuries they are starting a #8 on the wing...

 

[CDN_Rugby]

Looks like a very strong Kiwi side... Hopefully Canada puts its best team forward otherswise this could get more ugly than anticipated.

 

[Darwin]

Not a bad looking AB's side. I can only assume that Adam Thomson hasn't fully recovered from his injury, otherwise I expect he may have been on the bench. Good to see Hore getting a start at hooker, but I don't like the locking combination at all; if they wanted to give Brad Thorn a rest surely it would have made sense to start a genuine tight-head lock in his place (Boric) rather than start two loose-head locks. Given Whitelock and Boric are the loose-forward cover perhaps they didn't want to start both of them, but personally I would have started those two with Vito on the bench (assuming Thomson is injured).

I would have liked to see Weepu start at halfback again, however I suspect the halfback choice will depend on which team they are playing. Don't mind seeing SBW getting a start at 12 - given he looks like he may be on the bench in big games he probably needs as much game time as possible. Given Kahui is out, and they look like they are resting Jane after his head knock, they didn't have that many options in the back three. Personally I would have started Toeava rather than Guildford, as Toeava is much more likely to feature later in the tournament so need as much game time as possible. I actually expect Guildford to have a big game, but no matter what he does this is likely to be his one and only match.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

Im pretty sure i heard Thompson was still limping at training so needs more time.

I dont think it is far from as strog a side as we can field with a few small injuries

 

[Drogers93]

The only problem i have with the AB team throughout the WC acc is Tony Woodcock. Graham Henry rates him as one of the best loose heads in rugby however he does give away at least 2 penalties per match for not binding or hands on the ground at scrum time. I dnt understand why graham henry hasnt made note of this and done somethin about it. considerin he left crokett out of the squad who imo showed great performances during super 15 and tri nations. Jus wandering wat others think of this too.

 

[Larksea]

I "kind of" agree Drogers

Crockett looked very good for the All Blacks in performances before woodcock came back into the frame. His work rate was phenomenal for a prop and he carries the ball very well and can link really well. He's also one of the best lineout lifters around ~193cm tall. The one box Crockett didn't tick was that he still gave away a few scrum penalties but now woodcock is back and he is doing the same - though I didn't think they were "hand on the ground" penalties they have been mostly for other issues, binding & angles.

maybe it was a bit of a mistake to leave woodcock out, or maybe Crockett should have come into the squad and taken Afoa's spot? But IMO woodcock has actually been better than I expected him to be. Defense in particular, woody has been very strong, not only making some important tackles but a lot of hits he makes the opposition ball carrier gets stopped dead in their tracks allowing the All Black forwards to drive over the ruck and attempt turnovers or at the very least slow the ball down legally by forcing the opposition to drive over the ball before they can clear it.

Overall I think woody has justified his selection so far but the important part is yet to come. I can't see woody letting the AB's down in the knockout stages. With his scrum he has good days and average days but I don't think he ever has bad days or gets dominated. In particular he always seems to do well against SA, AUS and England. Who look to be NZ's biggest threat right now.

 

[james5000]

some big changes, some forced by injuries in the last game

Good thing Mills is back, I hope he has a blinder.

Forward pack is pretty much full strength, Hore would be my #1 hooker and I haven't been hugely impressed with Brad thorn. I know it's hard to quantify the work he does in the scrums but his workrate in other areas hasn't been flash. Ball carrying in particular. I'd expect a big guy with his reputation to take the ball up more than a couple of times in a game. Also Ali Williams was very impressive off the bench against france. His Ball carrying in particular was impressive getting over the advantage line from static ball.

Big chances in the backs, two most notable being Zac and Mills onto the park and SBW starting for Nonu.

Funny I was actually liking the two locks on the bench thing but I expected that to change when Read was back. But they have stuck too it. Two fresh locks is not a bad thing to have late in the game. Boric is a fantastic defender and line jumper having him fresh in the last quarter is a good call though I would like to have seen him start. He and thorn or williams starting is a great combination.

I expect people to winge about not playing the strongest 15 every game. It is a balancing act. Look at Aussie now - they mostly play their best team every game and they have got to the point they have so many injuries they are starting a #8 on the wing...

Why does Mills get the right to play fullback, he's the number two put him on the wing if you have to.

Obviously people are going to complain that they rotate too many players, they do it every game.
I don't mind rotating for one game, but to rotate every game is plain stupid.
Great teams are teams that play together consistently, you can pretty much go through any sport and its the same.
This team has many great individuals, but is it truly a great team yet? and who is in the top team?


Australian comparison is pointless, they could just as easily get injured in training. As has happened supposedly in this world cup.
South Africa have been consistent in selection and it hasn't harmed them, they actually seem to be thriving at the moment.