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Premiership Rugby 20/21 - Rd 18

Welsh Exile said:
I would say Mike Phillips could be quite dirty actually. I mean, I've never seen him do something like what Brown did but I probably wouldn't rule it out. He's never done it to my knowledge though so your point is kind of silly to me.

Did Brown know where his head was?
Could he have avoided it?

If the answer to both of those questions is yes then he's been a naughty boy. You would say no I guess but we're not likely to agree it would seem.
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My dog was behind me the otherday, id seen her and went to step over her because i knew she was there, thing is since id looked she had moved very slightly and i stepped on her paw making her yelp...i paid the fine in biscuits to say sorry. :)

Did i know she was there? Yes
Could i have avoided it? Yes

So by your logic i did it intentionally? Correct? No, to use the term i attribute to this mostly to this, it was reckless i didnt recheck or look where i was stepping, id assumed i knew exactly where she was. Obv my example is minor and different but it shows i can happen.

Ive said before in previous messages my position to which you did reply very fairly with your opinion. Brown may have thought he knew where his head was.
 
Scotty said:
My dog was behind me the otherday, id seen her and went to step over her because i knew she was there, thing is since id looked she had moved very slightly and i stepped on her paw making her yelp...i paid the fine in biscuits to say sorry. :)

Did i know she was there? Yes
Could i have avoided it? Yes

So by your logic i did it intentionally? Correct? No, to use the term i attribute to this mostly to this, it was reckless i didnt recheck or look where i was stepping, id assumed i knew exactly where she was. Obv my example is minor and different but it shows i can happen.

Ive said before in previous messages my position to which you did reply very fairly with your opinion. Brown may have thought he knew where his head was.
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This is a false equivalence for me. You're saying your dog moved very slightly which was why you stepped on her paw. If you looked at your dogs paw and then slam your foot down on it I'd call the RSPCA

I haven't heard this defence of Brown yet and my argument is that he knew where his head was so the slight movement is the bit that I say didn't happen (or was so minimal it's basically redundant)

Maybe I could accept that he intended to stamp him on the shoulder or something but misjudged it and ended up stamping his head but I just don't see anything else other than a player lashing out to be honest.
 
Welsh Exile said:
This is a false equivalence for me. You're saying your dog moved very slightly which was why you stepped on her paw. If you looked at your dogs paw and then slam your foot down on it I'd call the RSPCA

I haven't heard this defence of Brown yet and my argument is that he knew where his head was so the slight movement is the bit that I say didn't happen (or was so minimal it's basically redundant)

Maybe I could accept that he intended to stamp him on the shoulder or something but misjudged it and ended up stamping his head but I just don't see anything else other than a player lashing out to be honest.
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The main difference between most people here and yourself is most think it was a step not a stamp. Reckless not intentional. Clear red. 2 to 4 week ban not a lenthy one.
 
Scotty said:
The main difference between most people here and yourself is most think it was a step not a stamp. Reckless not intentional. Clear red. 2 to 4 week ban not a lenthy one.
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Yeah for sure, on here I seem to be more or less on my own on this one but elsewhere I don't think my view is an outlier one as I think a lot of people think it's a stretch to think he's that clumsy.
 
Just listening to the Rugby Pod and Goode says he thinks Brown did it deliberately but probably didn't mean to stamp on his head. So that's an English ex professional who is on my side at least. Lol.
 
6 Weeks. Quins statement sounds to me like they will be trying to dispute it / something is in the pipeline
 


Any reduction for Dunn is ridiculous considering it's his 2nd red for dangerous foul play of the season (think it's his 2nd in like three months?)
 
TRF_Olyy said:


Any reduction for Dunn is ridiculous considering it's his 2nd red for dangerous foul play of the season (this it's his 2nd in like three months?)
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I'd argue he should have 2 ticks in the "Aggravation" column. He was what? 3 backs from serving a ban for dangerous play?
And there's a definite need for deterrence
 
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To be honest if I was on the panel I would've looked at the Murray incident as although he escaped be cited at the time I think it's safe to say that the culture has changed now and if he did what he did to Murray today he would've certainly got a 6 week plus ban. This, to me, points to repeated reckless behaviour that he failed to learn from (though quite far apart) but I can understand why they didn't want to go back that far but I think it's a big conindende that he was this clumsy on 2 separate occasions that were very similar to each other. After all most players seem to go through their entire career without stamping on someone's head once. Let alone twice.

Not the worst thing I've seen in my life but not great either. It's done now though and glad he got a 6 week ban
 
Welsh Exile said:
To be honest if I was on the panel I would've looked at the Murray incident as although he escaped be cited at the time I think it's safe to say that the culture has changed now and if he did what he did to Murray today he would've certainly got a 6 week plus ban. This, to me, points to repeated reckless behaviour that he failed to learn from (though quite far apart) but I can understand why they didn't want to go back that far but I think it's a big conindende that he was this clumsy on 2 separate occasions that were very similar to each other. After all most players seem to go through their entire career without stamping on someone's head once. Let alone twice.

Not the worst thing I've seen in my life but not great either. It's done now though and glad he got a 6 week ban
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I assume you don't know the definition for repeated.

Both incidents were different situations but both showed reckless behaviour.

But two incidents in his playing career isn't repeated behaviour.
 
Don't Skip Leg Day said:
I assume you don't know the definition for repeated.

Both incidents were different situations but both showed reckless behaviour.

But two incidents in his playing career isn't repeated behaviour.
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More to the point - no discplinary panel (sporting, legal or whatever) can go around applying new laws / interpretations retrospectively to events several years in the past. Incidences are judges by the mores of their time. We can look back and judge the mores and hold them up against current views; but the individual acts and people can only be judged against their time.

"I think the court 6 years ago were wrong; therefore I'm going to assume a guilty judgement was passed, despite that being factually wrong" doesn't really wash in any judgement. Ever.
 
Don't Skip Leg Day said:
I assume you don't know the definition for repeated.

Both incidents were different situations but both showed reckless behaviour.

But two incidents in his playing career isn't repeated behaviour.
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No I don't know what that word means, you're right.

We're not talking about picking your nose here we're talking about really rare, highly dangerous incidents. As I have said a couple of times now, the vast majority of professional players manage to go through their entire career without coming close to doing this type of thing once. Brown has done this very rare and dangerous action twice. I mean, this is why I'm convinced both occasions had intent in there but there's no way to prove this at all tbh.
 
Which Tyler said:
More to the point - no discplinary panel (sporting, legal or whatever) can go around applying new laws / interpretations retrospectively to events several years in the past. Incidences are judges by the mores of their time. We can look back and judge the mores and hold them up against current views; but the individual acts and people can only be judged against their time.

"I think the court 6 years ago were wrong; therefore I'm going to assume a guilty judgement was passed, despite that being factually wrong" doesn't really wash in any judgement. Ever.
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Yeah fair point. I think, though, even under the culture in 2016 the citing commission got it wrong and I'm sure they'd look back on it now and accept they did.
 
Don't Skip Leg Day said:
I assume you don't know the definition for repeated.

Both incidents were different situations but both showed reckless behaviour.

But two incidents in his playing career isn't repeated behaviour.
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You tweeted Goode yet saying he's a biased Welshman who's never played rugby?
 
You're embarrassing yourself by admitting you follow/read the waffle that fat useless **** puts out, tbf
I blocked Goode a few years ago and my timeline is so much better for it
 

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