New Zealand v Wales - Saturday 26 June 2010 - Hamilton

[Jake Heke]

Dear god i hope Rene Ranger gets on the field. That guy could singlehandedly tear the entire Welsh team into shreds.

I'm sure he will get some game time, i was hoping Cruden would start instead of Carter, he needs to be tested hard

 

[TRF_Cymro]

Daniel Braid will be a good alternative for McCaw I feel. He had a superb season with the Reds and if he shows some good form with Auckland then I feel he will be in the squad to cover McCaw.

 

[nickdnz]

Yeah, Braid in my mind is the ideal cover to McCaw. Ranger I'm a little worried about. He has so much attacking skills, but has this slight "self destruct" tendancy. He will either be unstoppable or he will make errors. I'd place him on the wing when he comes on, just to be safe, though i think in the centres is where he is best.

 

[[email protected]]

if we want a good crack at the all blacks, then we have o improve our line outs, and scrums

 

[cyRil]

I'd have Gough on the bench too if he was in the squad. He'd offer much more than Deiniol Jones, who just doesn't cut it at international level.

I don't look at it as Prydie getting dropped, but giving Harries a chance. If Gatland made that clear, I don't see a problem. Prydie has been solid, but as many others have said he needs regional gametime to improve. He shouldn't really be continuing to playing at Premiership level yet represent Wales really, it's just farcical when you think about it, but that's what's gonna happen unfortunately.

MichaelBoard, although Tovey's all round game is possibly slightly better than Biggars, Biggar is the more consistent at this moment in time. We've gotta remember that Tovey only switched to playing 10 permenantly for the Dragons midway through this season, whearas Biggar has had two full seasons as first choice at the Ospreys. I therefore feel that Biggar is 6 months to a year ahead of where Tovey is. The main difference is in defense, this is an area Biggar has improved hugely in this season, so much so that he's the one that leads the Ospreys defensive line nowerdays. Tovey on the other hand can be a little shaky in defense when playing 10, kinda how Biggar was a year ago. That and the fact that draughting a player from outside the original squad into the starting 15 in front of another who's been involved for the past year and a half would send out all the wrong kind of signals. Biggar should start no matter what imo, then Jones or Tovey on the bench.

Gough is in the squad Dull, he was drafted in as cover for Warburton.. As you do.

 

[cyRil]

I'm sure he will get some game time, i was hoping Cruden would start instead of Carter, he needs to be tested hard

You should play him against a decent team then.

 

[dullonien]

Gough is in the squad Dull, he was drafted in as cover for Warburton.. As you do.

Oh, hadn't realised that. Then he should be on the bench. Did they see Alun-Wyn as emergency backrow cover then?

 

[DuncTheDoodle]

John Yapp is out with an ankle injury. Should be James starting, with Mitchell on the bench. Sudden we're short on looseheads!! How did that happen?

New Zealand: Mils Muliaina; Cory Jane, Richard, Kahui, Benson Stanley, Zac Guildford; Daniel Carter, Jimmy Cowan; Tony Woodcock, Keven Mealamu, Neemia Tialata, Brad Thorn, Tom Donnelly, Jerome Kaino, Kieran Read, Richie McCaw (capt).
Replacements: Aled de Malmanche, Owen Franks, Sam Whitelock, Adam Thomson, Piri Weepu, Aaron Cruden, Rene Ranger.

EDIT: Didn't see it was already posted. Sorry guys! Anyway, my heart sunk when I saw Woodcock- He was the finishnig of Wales' scrum last week, as someone beat Adam Jones in the technical side of scrummaging (First time I've seen that in many years.)

 

[admartian]

John Yapp is out with an ankle injury. Should be James starting, with Mitchell on the bench. Sudden we're short on looseheads!! How did that happen?

New Zealand: Mils Muliaina; Cory Jane, Richard, Kahui, Benson Stanley, Zac Guildford; Daniel Carter, Jimmy Cowan; Tony Woodcock, Keven Mealamu, Neemia Tialata, Brad Thorn, Tom Donnelly, Jerome Kaino, Kieran Read, Richie McCaw (capt).
Replacements: Aled de Malmanche, Owen Franks, Sam Whitelock, Adam Thomson, Piri Weepu, Aaron Cruden, Rene Ranger.

EDIT: Didn't see it was already posted. Sorry guys! Anyway, my heart sunk when I saw Woodcock- He was the finishnig of Wales' scrum last week, as someone beat Adam Jones in the technical side of scrummaging (First time I've seen that in many years.)

Ah yes, the 'Myth' as the other Tri-Nations teams call him. (or is it just Al Baxter? :lol Definitely a good scrummager, just dipped in form in the S14, but seems to have that spark lit up again.

 

[Bargoedboy]

i wish Gareth Delve was in squad as he adds so much more than Ryan jones, far better leader and offers more lineout options as well.
One area wales has been poor is in their body language and none more so than Ryan , he does seem to shouldering too much responsibility and i beleive it affects his game, would like to see Delve at 8 and captain with Ryan at 6. i am sure we would get best out of both players then.Gough still has a lot to offer as well , Great tackler, very strong in pack and with Brad davies would really offer some power behind front row.
But to me and sad to say it for a welsh team we are poor behind the pack at moment, there doesn`t seem to be a structure or plan. Defense allthough strong for a half last week went to pieces after that, admittedley against one of best attacking sides in world.
i will cross my fingers (and everything else and hope they give it their best shot ) and hope a large defeat does`t damage youngsters too much.

 

[Draggs]

John Yapp looks unlikely for now, he rolled an ankle at training. He has been out for a while and just doesn't seem fit to start. Paul is decent, but no where near Gethin's level, as a prop or ball-carrier. Ken Owens over Huw Bennett on the bench; I'd like to see Ken play for Wales sooner than later.

Second row picks itself: Alun-Wyn and Bradley, but I'd have Ian on the bench over Deiniol.

Gareth Delve should definitely be in the squad, as unlikely as it is. Play him at 8, with Ryan and Rob on the flank. JT and Gavin were pretty much useless, I don't think McCusker can be any worse. Give him a chance to start and then I'll judge. Ryan has been off-form lately, but last week seemed to be a bit of an improvement. As far as captaincy goes, let him have this one, and come the autumn tests, it could be time to find a new one. Alun-Wyn or Gethin would be my first choice.

Mike played a pretty good game, considering the small amount of international rugby he has played over the last year. He still seems a bit more hesitant and slow at rucks than usual, but still is the starting 9. I would have Richie on the bench over Tavis, as he has played very well for Wales and has done nothing wrong to be dropped.

Still not sure about 10, with Stephen's hand injury undecided, but based on the way he played last week, he really shouldn't be starting. I'd rather see Hook at standoff, but right now that is impossible. I am still not sure about Biggar starting, but that is our only other choice.

As for the wings, I would go with Leigh and Will Harries. Leigh had a decent game, but needs to stop kicking the ball away. Tom's defence was very poor on Saturday, missing every tackle that I saw him attempt. I look forward to seeing him in about 10 months, as he is already just under 2m and 13st, and I would imagine will get much bigger.

At centre we have little choice, so Jamie and Jon start. I'd prefer a bit more creativity, but we have to work with what we have.

Lee Byrne is the only fullback choice we have, so of course he plays. He played pretty well during the first half, but was like the rest in the second. Certainly and improvement over his 6N form.

Lee Byrne
Leigh Halfpenny
Jonathan Davies
Jamie Roberts
Will Harries
Dan Biggar (if Stephen Jones is out. If Stephen is fit, he starts and Dan is on the bench in place of Jason.)
Mike Phillips
Paul James
Matthew Rees
Adam Jones
Bradley Davies
Alun-Wyn Jones
Jonathan Thomas
Rob McCusker
Ryan Jones (C)

The bench: John Yapp (depending on injury, if injured, Craig Mitchell is on bench), Ken Owens, Ian Gough, Gavin Thomas, Richie Rees, Jason Tovey, Tom Prydie.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

Wales are really struggling now. Players are dropping and the quality is not there to replace.

Gatland should have bitten the bullet and gone with Delve regardless of where his future is. Id like to see Craig Mitchell sit on the bench, I reckon he has a bright future for Wales but needs some game time. Ken Owens will unlikely be put on the bench because Galtand favors Bennett for reasons that are unknown. I do hope for Gough infront of Deiniol Jones but its unlikely. Deiniol is unfortunate because when he was at his peak he was never selected for Wales. He is a good lineout option but in the modern game you need to offer more than one thing now a days.

The squad will be announced tomorrow. I don't have high hopes of really getting anything out of the game. If we can keep the score respectable I will be happy.

 

[Draggs]

I don't think it will be as bad as last week- I just hope we can score. Regardless, I'll be up at three to watch it.

I have no idea why Warren prefers Huw, but it is better than the Gareth Williams situation earlier this year. If Richard Hibbard was fit, you might see him in the squad, but I feel that priority should be on Ken, as he is only 23 and could have a good future ahead of him.

Personally, I have some serious concerns over Gatland and his selections. I admit I am a Dragons fan and it might be bias, but the non-selection of Dragons players is obvious and unjust. Wayne Evans, Will Harries, and Jason Tovey have all had great seasons, but only one has a chance of playing soon. I have no doubt Dan Lydiate would have been picked, had injury not prevented him. Charteris' absence in the Wales squad (besides injury) is understandable, he seems to have trouble going from club to international level. I am hoping Ian Evans will provide the much-needed Second Row cover.

As far as lineouts go, I have to look away for each one. It is painful to watch how disorganised the squad are when it comes to them. Add turnovers and knock-ons into the mix and we basically give games away. Our only saviour is our scrum, which when we have the right players up from (Gethin, Matthew, Adam), I feel we are honestly the best in world. Woodcock seems to be Adam's Achilles Heel, and without Gethin we lose an important ball-carrier.

Gareth Delve has had probably the best season of his career, but that has panned out to one start and one sub. I can understand wanted to choose Wales-based players first, but not to the point of allowing our team to suffer. I fear that after the World Cup (depending on what happens over the next 18 months), Wales will go through another few painful years of rebuilding.

Not this Saturday, but I still have a glimmer of hope over the November match- Lets keep our players healthy first...

 

[admartian]

My opinion of English, Welsh, Irish, Scottish rugby is, often, coaches will pick 'over the hill' players whose reputations are far more important than form and competition in order to save face against sides like NZ and SA.

What this does is hinder the development stages of up and coming players. I don't know how selection politics work up there, nor do I know who the form players are. But it seems that I see the same guys over again despite them not doing so well.

Maybe a new approach of risking by playing the more promising (and younger) players would bode much better in terms of rugby in the future. I dunno, it seems that the reason there seems to be no drop off in talent between the tri-nations side is that the younger players can play with the older and more established guys.

Dunno, I could be completely off. Just saying how I see it.

 

[Dizzy]

My opinion of English, Welsh, Irish, Scottish rugby is, often, coaches will pick 'over the hill' players whose reputations are far more important than form and competition in order to save face against sides like NZ and SA.

What this does is hinder the development stages of up and coming players. I don't know how selection politics work up there, nor do I know who the form players are. But it seems that I see the same guys over again despite them not doing so well.

Maybe a new approach of risking by playing the more promising (and younger) players would bode much better in terms of rugby in the future. I dunno, it seems that the reason there seems to be no drop off in talent between the tri-nations side is that the younger players can play with the older and more established guys.

Dunno, I could be completely off. Just saying how I see it.

Completely agree.... I mean, how long is O'Driscoll gonna be around until he finally realises hes crap

 

[Draggs]

I suppose the problem with Wales is the fact that we have a very small amount of players, compared to England, NZ, South Africa and others. That being said, it is our own problem that we cannot play a full 80 minutes.

I have no idea what is going on in Gatland's mind, but picking players like Gareth Williams, Gareth Cooper, and Deiniol Jones repeatedly is a way to guarantee failure. While they might have been good in their day, their time has gone.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Completely agree.... I mean, how long is O'Driscoll gonna be around until he finally realises hes crap

Trolling is a art

 

[Iron Mike]

I do think Brian O'Driscoll should step aside though, and let Keith Earls have the spot of 13 in the Irish team, that is where he will be one day and BOD hasn't played to any standard in a few years.

 

[Darwin]

I do think Brian O'Driscoll should step aside though, and let Keith Earls have the spot of 13 in the Irish team, that is where he will be one day and BOD hasn't played to any standard in a few years.

Apart from being named Six Nations player of the tournament, and being in nominated for World player of the year last year

On the AB's match: No real surprises to see a few changes in the AB team, as Henry said they wanted let all the players have a run during these internationals. Interesting to see Ranger there - if they can get rid of his rough edges he has the potential to become an exceptional rugby player.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

I don't think it will be as bad as last week- I just hope we can score. Regardless, I'll be up at three to watch it.

I have no idea why Warren prefers Huw, but it is better than the Gareth Williams situation earlier this year. If Richard Hibbard was fit, you might see him in the squad, but I feel that priority should be on Ken, as he is only 23 and could have a good future ahead of him.

Personally, I have some serious concerns over Gatland and his selections. I admit I am a Dragons fan and it might be bias, but the non-selection of Dragons players is obvious and unjust. Wayne Evans, Will Harries, and Jason Tovey have all had great seasons, but only one has a chance of playing soon. I have no doubt Dan Lydiate would have been picked, had injury not prevented him. Charteris' absence in the Wales squad (besides injury) is understandable, he seems to have trouble going from club to international level. I am hoping Ian Evans will provide the much-needed Second Row cover.

As far as lineouts go, I have to look away for each one. It is painful to watch how disorganised the squad are when it comes to them. Add turnovers and knock-ons into the mix and we basically give games away. Our only saviour is our scrum, which when we have the right players up from (Gethin, Matthew, Adam), I feel we are honestly the best in world. Woodcock seems to be Adam's Achilles Heel, and without Gethin we lose an important ball-carrier.

Gareth Delve has had probably the best season of his career, but that has panned out to one start and one sub. I can understand wanted to choose Wales-based players first, but not to the point of allowing our team to suffer. I fear that after the World Cup (depending on what happens over the next 18 months), Wales will go through another few painful years of rebuilding.

Not this Saturday, but I still have a glimmer of hope over the November match- Lets keep our players healthy first...

Your biases shows also with the dislike of the Blues. Im afraid Gareth Williams was the best hooker in Wales at the time. Granted by the time he got selected for Wales he was losing some form but to say his selection was wrong is a complete incorrect one. I get a little tired of arguing for some of the same players because some people really have no clue about stuff that happens in the front row at times. Williams was the best lineout thrower in Wales and also offered round the park. When he played for Wales he was not spectacular but neither was he rubbish like what you would believe if you read some of the posts on here. Granted I am a big fan of Ken Owens at the time his performance were not that spectacular either. What people have got to realise also if they put so much expectation of Ken Owens and he flops then there will be a lot of negativity from the media and the people who believed he will flop. He is a young player and needs to be looked after but he does deserve a shot on Saturday in front of Bennett no doubt.

Also the reason why Wales did not preform for the full 80 mins was explained by the guys on S4C. Wales cannot expect to fly in 5-6 days before playing arguably the best team in the world and play 80 mins. They also believed that playing midweek games are also the way forward like they used to do, which I 100% agree with. Wales were not conditioned correctly and therefore struggled. Its not an excuse its pretty much fact. Thats why I cannot wait for the proper old fashioned tours come back. Players will then get to play against local side and also spend more time in that country and get used to the conditions.