New Zealand 66 vs Ireland 28 FT

[Iron Mike]

you seem to forget this is the same nation that brought you guinness ...repent from your blasphemous ways sinner !!

New Zealand

Number Of Registered Players:

145293

Ireland

Number Of Registered Players:

152830


So if you guys want to talk about depth, Ireland technically have more players

 

[MunsterMan]

Pretty sure that number is every person, regardless of age or gender playing rugby in Ireland, including tag. The actual number is a lot smaller.

 

[Darwin]

I'm not interested in the "our injuries are way worse man, we will get dicked talk" but I did see someone listed Luke McAllister as 2nd choice flyhalf and 3rd choice centre? I though it was in Graham Henry's eyes only he was rated in New Zealand or has he recovered some form?

McAlister was rated as the best 12 in NZ before he left, and reports suggested he played well up north. Since he's been back in NZ he hasn't managed to play more than a couple of games in a row as he keeps getting injured - and it always seems to be a different injury! For example he played a total of 4 games for the Blues this year (3 from the bench) due to injuries. He is ment to be playing for the Maoris this month in an attempt to get some game time, however last reports I've heard suggest he has injured himself in training! If he manages to play a few games, Henry (and the NZ public) may be able to gauge how good he currently is.

 

[Iron Mike]

Pretty sure that number is every person, regardless of age or gender playing rugby in Ireland, including tag. The actual number is a lot smaller.

Same with in New Zealand? Exact same statistics. Stop creating excuses, it is really beginning to **** me off, really, GRRR.

 

[TRF C A Iversen]

Ireland are shite at cricket You have ruined my night now CA. I have actually been mocked about Irish cricket team being shite before, but by a stupid Englishman. To be honest before that time they won a few games and got on the news I wasn't aware we had a team, as the first thing I do when I see cricket on the tv is change the channel.

I'm not interested in the "our injuries are way worse man, we will get dicked talk" but I did see someone listed Luke McAllister as 2nd choice flyhalf and 3rd choice centre? I though it was in Graham Henry's eyes only he was rated in New Zealand or has he recovered some form?

Well, in some ways I enjoy debating things like this and I do understand Ireland deserving the under-dog tag. To go to the extent of absolutely no real support or hopes for your national team is really just being a fair-weather fan.

I'm sure if Ireland somehow won the World Cup (hey slightly unlikely but not impossible), there'd be many an Irishman on the forum claiming to have been a true loyal supporter from many a year back. The fact is there is more legitimate and balanced support from your opponents in this thread.

 

[King_D'Arcy]

irelands best chance in a while to beat new zealand

This is a new way of looking at it. I'm gonna agree. You and me munster2010 against all the sceptics

 

[Thingimubob]

Same with in New Zealand? Exact same statistics. Stop creating excuses, it is really beginning to **** me off, really, GRRR.

He wasn't...he's just pointing out that the number doesnt include all adult profesional standard players... I'm 17 and am a registered player with the WRU, so I count in the WRU registered players number, even though I have no chance of getting picked for the Welsh national side.

And also Heaslip is one of the best no.8s around, along with Harinordoquy, not so sure with Spies. Don't get me wrong, the guy is a fantastic player and if you give him even a bit of space he'll take and probably score/set up a try, just not sure he does the same work in the rucks that Heaslip and Harinordoquy do. I could be wrong, I don't see him week in week out like I do with Heaslip, just going on by what I've seen of him in matches. Cant say I've heard much of Read, but I'll have to keep an eye out for him! Sure I'll hear plenty about him with Wales touring NZ and all.

Anywhoo, looks like a very good All Blacks side, looking forward to seeing Isreal Dagg, from what I've seen of him in the Super 14 he's a cracking player with bags of talent! The Irish team isn't that weak, the backs still have loads of talent and creativity (though Sexton really should be there) though they are missing some very good backrowers. Nice to see Muldoon in there, am a big fan of him- I remember him having a superb match against Toulon in the Amlin semi finals, and I still think Connacht were very unlucky to lose that one! I like Sean Cronin too, could do very well for Ireland imo!

 

[Jockstap]

New Zealand

Number Of Registered Players:

145293

Ireland

Number Of Registered Players:

152830


So if you guys want to talk about depth, Ireland technically have more players

That's a very misleading number, Ireland's total has soared from 53,000 in 2003 to 152830 today. Rugby in Ireland has had a massive boom since this teams relative success. What it means is Ireland will probably be a lot better in a couple of years time.

 

[Iron Mike]

I'm just sick of all these excuses, I like Warran Gatland's way of thinking, if you don't think you can win, I don't want you in my team. The 2007 RWC ****** me off, with Australia and New Zealand *****ing aswell. I'm just saying, you either win a game or lose it, your only as good as your backup players aswell, every team has problems and it seems a lot of the members on this forum think that every game should have an excuse riddled with it.

 

[nickdnz]

The only thing that annoys me, is that you can argue that this isn't either teams strongest side. Now that has been established, move on. It's like two amputated people arguing whos stump is shorter.

 

[coonor]

You had me up till here. While obviously a bias statement, I would say he shares the best number 8 glory with several other plays, such as Kieran Read, Pierre Spies and Imanol Harinordoquy. John Beattie and Richard Brown are on very good form aswell.

It is hard to say who is the best, there are a few top number 8's in the world right now.

The reason I think that Heaslip is the best No.8 is becase he has playeds well in every single game this year even though his pack is usually being destroyed. In othe words when te team he plas for i losing he really stands out.

 

[ranger]

The reason I think that Heaslip is the best No.8 is becase he has playeds well in every single game this year even though his pack is usually being destroyed. In othe words when te team he plas for i losing he really stands out.

This irritating because for me the "best in the world" should be a very exclusive position, a claim that should only be made when it is pretty much mutually accepted by everyone anyway. Needless to say to be regarded as the best in the world a player must have first dominated against opposition from both hemispheres consistently.

How about sticking to "Best in the Magners" or "Best in the Northern Hemisphere"?

 

[munstermuffin]

Ireland to win by 5 and ROG to be MOTM with bone crunching tackles

 

[MunsterMan]

I agree.

We will see how Heaslip does on Saturday, he WILL be playing behind a beaten pack and a rapidly retreating scrum, of that I have no doubt. I don't think there is a standout number 8 at the moment anyway but Heaslip is up there.

 

[lucky number 7]

i dont think people are beoing fair weather fans here i think we are looking logically at the match which with all due respect DOES NOT make mean we are poor supporters..

Ireland have never beaten zew zealand even with a full team and at home so going away with a very understrenght team to a place where no irishman has won is a very very difficult task indeed .

so please stop *****ing about us being poor fans or making excuses its simply logic that new zealand are the better team at the moment and with home advantage should beat an irish team without the psyco ferris and co.

 

[TRF C A Iversen]

i dont think people are beoing fair weather fans here i think we are looking logically at the match which with all due respect DOES NOT make mean we are poor supporters..

Ireland have never beaten zew zealand even with a full team and at home so going away with a very understrenght team to a place where no irishman has won is a very very difficult task indeed .

so please stop *****ing about us being poor fans or making excuses its simply logic that new zealand are the better team at the moment and with home advantage should beat an irish team without the psyco ferris and co.

That's all well and good, if out of 30 odd posts from Irish fans there was 10 posts talking about the game and how things could play out, maybe another 10 about which Irish players might make a good account of themselves despite the opposition and another 10 talking about the injuries and saying thats the reason why you'll definitely lose.

The truth is though, out of about 30 posts, the ratio would be about 25 posts about the injuries being why the Irish will lose and the other 5 about other related issues.

The ratio of defeatism is so overwhelming that it really doesn't say "great diehard fans" or somehow does it?

 

[dangandan]

i dont think people are beoing fair weather fans here i think we are looking logically at the match which with all due respect DOES NOT make mean we are poor supporters..

Ireland have never beaten zew zealand even with a full team and at home so going away with a very understrenght team to a place where no irishman has won is a very very difficult task indeed .

so please stop *****ing about us being poor fans or making excuses its simply logic that new zealand are the better team at the moment and with home advantage should beat an irish team without the psyco ferris and co.

agreed. theres alot of pressure on breaking the fact weve never beaten the all blacks and with those key injuries it makes it much more difficult. with a full team theres a good chance we can produce a win and break that record which is a big thing so when these injuries pop up it has a much bigger effect on us than for new zealand. also ireland don't get to play the all blacks that often so it would be nice to see a full team play and see where they are at. believe me, im not trying to take anything away from the all blacks... they are a great team and if they beat us this weekend i will not complain, however i think the whole point is that if we have our best players available we can really see if our team is actually going forward. a win against the all blacks is pretty major and a huuuge step forward.

 

[TRF C A Iversen]

Then it'd be great to beat a full strength All Blacks too. Sadly it's two depleted teams playing. New Zealand have 6 debutantes in their 22. More than Ireland sadly.

So, I guess that full strength encounter will have to wait for both teams some day. We'll just have to settle for two depleted sides playing each other until then.

 

[Feicarsinn]

I'm going to chance the direction of this thread. Ireland are uber awesome. If we don't beat the All Blacks I'll be embarrased beyond measure. O'Driscoll to score 2 tries and a cheeky DG.

 

[durbutter]

You'll have it though, its the Irish mentality.

So how can Ireland win. Well we'll write off the scrum. The line-out will have to be solid on our own possession and realistically should try and cause major disruption to the AB's. Not out of the realm of possibility as MOD and DOC are very decent and Hayes at least should contribute alot to the lifting, Heaslip and Muldoon are also decent line out operators.

If this happens then we shouldn't be starved of possession.

NZ at the breakdown are a scary enough prospect. Ref's interpretation aside, we'll have to blast the ruck as much as possible. we'll need the forwards to really be concentrating on this. Again we need Hayes to contribute. Again if we get parity in this area, get qucik ball then we cpuld do damage.

Quick ball. TOL needs to get himself right for this game, defense aside, he's been poor this season. You'd wonder what a half back pairing of String/Sex could do? Is TOL there to tackle for ROG? With a like for like on the bench in Reddan, this is an area of weakness in the team, assuming TOL's poor form continues.

I'm not worried about the outside backs, give them good ball and they'll do damage.

However with the selection of ROG and the weather supposed to be crap, will Ireland elect to kick the leather off the ball and win the game with pick and drive/maul/ garryowns. In poor weather maybe playing a traditional "Munster" game is the right way to go about it.

Kidney's selection seems to support this.

Weather could be Irelands best ally; messy scrums, wet ball, swirling wind. For all ROG's faults, on a wet day when going wide is not on he's pretty class at controlling a game.

We should just worry about ourselves and not mind what type of team the All Blacks put out.

I've talked myself into some optimisim, the weather could be a great leveler! G'wan Ireland!