MMA/UFC thread

[Cruz_del_Sur]

He is very good, but, as i said earlier, he's got the best marketing, by a mile. The difference between the hype and his actual credentials is not small.
I mean, how many fighters besides Conor do you hear talking about "numbers" in a press conference*? That's a big bloody tell. He draws just as many people to press conferences as he does to fights. And sure, that brings money, but as someone who enjoys MMA and gives a flying turd about press conferences, he's aint that special.

There are at least 3 guys in each category that have a shot against him (dos Anjos, Khabib and Johnson and Aldo, Mendes and Edgar).

He is no St Pierre, no Silva, No Emelianenko, no Penn (at his best), he's no Royce Gracie.


I have no doubt he trains like a bull and that his focus is second to none. The way he goes up and down in weight classes is not an easy thing to do well at that level without giving some advantage. Credit where credit is due.

*Mayweather in boxing, but then again he's also been known for using that as an excuse to dodge fights.

 

[munstermuffin]

But Cruz selling the hype is part of game. I know little but I think in the Featherweight he's just too powerful and bigger that the 3 there aren't really serious challenges in 1 sense. Maybe Aldo but well I think mentally he has Aldo done.

At lightweight I don't think Dos Anjos would be any good.

Point being he has topped 2 weights which is impressive and while some people may not like his antics the facts are he has financially blown UFC to a new level and he does back up his hype. The way he redesigned himself to avenge the Nate loss was impressive

 

[profitius]

I'd say it won't be long until people get bored of listening to Conor McGregor. He is entertaining but he can repeat himself only so many times.


On a side note, many Irish people are embarrassed by him and his fans with their soccer chants.

 

[munstermuffin]

I'd say it won't be long until people get bored of listening to Conor McGregor. He is entertaining but he can repeat himself only so many times.


On a side note, many Irish people are embarrassed by him and his fans with their soccer chants.

And equally you play with fire enough times you'll get burnt. In that he knows it's a short career. He will be out of it I believe in next 2 years as his style means if he stays to long he will get a hammering.
I'm not condoning his style just saying hype is part of all of it now. People with no skill and gift of gab can get far

 

[TRF_Olyy]

But Cruz selling the hype is part of game.

At lightweight I don't think Dos Anjos would be any good.

You can be a fan of the sport of MMA without liking prize fighting.
I love the sport and watch as much as I can from all corners of the world, I could give two ****s what ppv numbers conor gets compares to x, y or z, I just want to see them right.

Also RDA is a mother ****ing BEAST of a fighter.

I'd say it won't be long until people get bored of listening to Conor McGregor. He is entertaining but he can repeat himself only so many times.

A lot of people in the MMA communities i frequent are getting sick of him, as you say he does repeat his lines over and over and over. Everyone's a bum, his suits are expensive, he runs this town/city/division/company.
I think he peaked with the Aldo fight, everything after that has been corny and rehearsed as **** (him repeating the same money lines at Diaz no matter what he said, having no comeback to Alvarez when he brought up him quitting his job to go on the dole and have his girlfriend support him).
Conor's also said some very questionable things that people never seem to remember - called Siver a nazi, called Nick/Nate cholos and fajitas, said that if he ran Brazil he'd kill everyone in the slums that wasn't fit to work.

 

[SelimNiai]

Just watched 205. Did they find Widemans head after it got kneed into oblivion? Also, how did Stephen Thompson make it through to the decision, thought that knockdown and guillotine would have seen him off, would have finished most people.

Im torn on McGregor, no doubt he has all the skills and he has the charachter, though I don't like the in ring antics, the over the top gimmicks in the build ups.

 

[Cruz_del_Sur]

But Cruz selling the hype is part of game.

Not for me. It is actually a turn off. Have you ever heard Messi, Michael Jordan or Lomu telling a reporter "**** you, do you know how many t-shirts i sell?"
They'd be called ridiculous. The three i mentioned above sold out stadiums on their own on a team sport!

Bring it down to MMA: I think most people can't remember a single catch phrase from guys like St Pierre or Silva or Emelianenko. Focus was on the fights and the fighters, not on whether they were driving a rolls, wearing ****ing prada or eating beluga.
Don't get me wrong, i can understand the entertainment value, it's just not what attracts me. If it's on i won't change the channel, but i am not the kind of person who would tune in just to see McG arrive late to a press conference wearing a mink fur coat (read about this one!).

His act was entertaining the first time, the second one, maybe the third, but it got so bloody boring after that.

Credit where credit is due thou: he certainly found his (big) niche and he is milking it like nobody's done it before. I just do not belong to that niche.

The best example i can give you is a footie one.
Some people would pick David Beckham for their team while other would rather have Paul Scholes.
People who want to sell t-shirts will chose Beckham. People who want to win games will pick Scholes. I for one couldn't care less about how many t-shirts a footie club sells.

I have no animosity towards him. He is a talented and smart guy. That is precisely why i believe he will try to dodge Khabib. He knows Khabib is a threat, probably the biggest threat, and he knows if he loses the belt his negotiating power goes down with the UFC. He will try to milk that, and if my number one priority was to make money, i would probably do the same.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Think the worst thing GSP ever said was "I am not impressed with your performance" but even that was just lost in translation cause he was trying to say he didn't think Hughes (I think?) had fought to his full potential.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Yeah, there's a difference between saying "I understand his schtick, and find it mildly amusing" and actually finding it to be something to aspire to.

 

[Jockstap]

Man, when Khabib gets a hold of Conor...
Khabib strengths are conor's weakness. Other than a lucky early first round KO i don't see how he can win.

Khabib has had little trouble bringing the floor to the ground with people who have a much better take down defense than McG. Once there, it is a matter of time. Either he will tire them, beat the crap out of them or submit them. Whatever he feels like at the time.

The only question mark for me was if Khabib's 2 year hiatus would affect them much. I think he answered that question yesterday.

Media wise would be interesting too. A verbal jouster vs a guy who doesn't say much but can put fear into people just by staring.
I don't see Khabib pulling an Aldo here and imploding.

Again, it would be smart from McG, given his #1 interest is money, to avoid this fight.

Khabib needs to prove himself against a top 5 fighter, RDA three years ago doesn't count and MJ has never been a top 5 guy. People keep bringing up 24 -0, against who?

Lucky KO? Michael ****ing Johnson nearly KO'd him in the first couple of minutes, if he can do that I can't seen him lasting two rounds with Conor. It'll go the same way as the Mendes fight.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

So you can see Khabib taking conor down with ease?
Khabib doesn't gas, he'll happily g&p for 5 rounds without slowing down. A wrestling heavy game plan is the most cardio intensive fight style which is why Mendes was ****ed after 1 round.

I love how quick people are to discount his RDA win despite RDA being on a tear before then and then after, Khabib dominated his completely when he was on top form. RDA is always a top level BJJ blackbelt and could do nothing on the floor.

Also I suggest you watch the Khabib/MJ fight again but without the commentary because he was he wasn't hurt anywhere near as bad as Rogan was shouting, he was barely wobbled and kept pressing forwards constantly.

 

[SelimNiai]

Joe Rogan is the Jiffy of MMA. Gets overrexcited easily and a lot of it is hyperbole.

 

[Jockstap]

What I mean is if Khabib takes him down I see Conor just getting back up again and eventually finishing him, like Silva used to do to his opponents. Conor did zero wrestling training for Mendes because he was supposed to be facing Aldo but took Mendes on 10 days notice. Alvarez beat Pettis by using his wrestling, he's a good wrestler, but couldn't do anything when he had Conor against the cage.

Alvarez finished RDA and it took Khabib 3 rounds.

I'll have to watch it again, but regardless, he was easily hit. McGregor is the best striker in the UFC, possibly of all time(I know some people will never except that), he moves like Wonderboy and has a left hand like Dan Henderson's right. If Conor hits him with the same strikes, it's over imo, maybe not straight away but eventually.

Conor's whole game is based on reach and distance it's one of the reasons he had such a hard time with Nate(that and the weight difference). It's why I think Tony Fergusson is Conor's most dangerous fight. I think Khabib is overated and should fight a top 5 guy before he gets a shot.

But hey that's what makes UFC so fun, anything can happen.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Why do you think conor will get up so easily?
If RDA couldn't worm his way out from under Khabib, and he's a 3rd degree black belt, I don't think anyone can.
Abel Trujillo was a 4 time all American college wrestler and Khabib got...21? take downs on him. Every time Abel got up Khabib just upended him again.
Top level combat sambo is just relentless.

Khabib's stand up is nothing compared to McGregor's, as you say. If McGregor can keep it on the feet he'll win, but it only takes Khabib to get one hand on you and you're taking a trip on dagestan airlines until the end of the round. There really is no one else like him in the ufc.

It's what makes the fight so fascinating, it's verging on a ufc 1 type match up of a straight up wrestler vs a straight up striker.

 

[Jockstap]

Why do you think conor will get up so easily?
If RDA couldn't worm his way out from under Khabib, and he's a 3rd degree black belt, I don't think anyone can.
Abel Trujillo was a 4 time all American college wrestler and Khabib got...21? take downs on him. Every time Abel got up Khabib just upended him again.
Top level combat sambo is just relentless.

Khabib's stand up is nothing compared to McGregor's, as you say. If McGregor can keep it on the feet he'll win, but it only takes Khabib to get one hand on you and you're taking a trip on dagestan airlines until the end of the round. There really is no one else like him in the ufc.

It's what makes the fight so fascinating, it's verging on a ufc 1 type match up of a straight up wrestler vs a straight up striker.

Because the round will eventually end, plus I don't think Conor will be taken down so easily, as I said he's only ever been taken down by Mendes when preparing for Aldo and it was documented he had an injured knee going into that fight. Conor's takedown defense is very underated in my opinion. Remember Alvarez ragdolled former champion Anthony Pettis.

Abel is a NAIA all american wrestler which is basically division 3, behind NCAA divsion 1 and 2. Chad Mendes was a two time NCAA division 1 all american wrestler. Besides it doesn't matter as Abel's not a striker, it's been shown that Khabib gets hit and has tiny reach, if he comes forward on Conor he will be put to sleep. That's just my opinion based on what I saw from the MJ fight.

But who knows, anything can happen.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I was more pointing out that Trujillo had been wrestling his whole life - it becomes instinct after a while. Part of what makes Conor's stand up great is he was boxing since he could walk, basically.

Conor probably does have very good TD defence, he works with some top coaches and training partners, but Khabib has fought better grapplers and embarrassed them.
MJ has better take down defence than Conor (80% vs 74%), Trujillo had only been taken down a handful of times before being dropped 21 times by Khabib and now has 40%.

It's like fighting against Demian Maia - you know what he's going to try to do, you've just got to try and avoid it. The Blackzillians coaches said the same after the fight: they knew that if Khabib started wrestling then it's game over, so MJ had to avoid that, but couldn't.

 

[Cruz_del_Sur]

Michael ****ing Johnson nearly KO'd him in the first couple of minutes,

We watched different fights.

The relevant question here is what looks more probable, Conor keeping Khabib at bay and punishing him while doing so or for Khabib taking Conor to the ground.

as I said he's only ever been taken down by Mendes

That is, precisely, the point. Mendes took him down 3 times in one round. Imagine what a bigger and better wrestler would do.

What I mean is if Khabib takes him down I see Conor just getting back up again and eventually finishing him

He might get up, but he will do so punished.

What flips the balance for here is that i can accept that Conor can defend a take down 1, 2, 3, 4 or 5 times... not endlessly. Khabib is simply relentless and when he brings people down they come up damaged.

I'd be happy to see Khabib against another top 5, but i'd hate to see that being used as an excuse and then to see McG retiring.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

What happens when a high level wrestler gets out from under Khabib
https://giant.gfycat.com/AshamedImpoliteFieldspaniel.mp4



Exciting times ahead in the sport, though. WW is a crazy div atm, I'd love to see a Woodley/Wonderboy rematch but Maia deserves his shot.
Apparently Wonderboy's team were told, postfight, that a rematch will definitely happen but it's not the first time that Dana has told a porkie pie. If Conor demands a WW shot he'll get it, and if Wonderboy is out for a while (which he, apparently, might be) Woodley says he wants a fight sooner rather than later, so Maia at 208/209 could work. And then Cowboy is probably only two fights away from a ***le shot, and Nick Diaz will be back on the scene in the not too distant future.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Looks like McGregor is finally getting stripped of his FW belt - should've happened when he demanded the Diaz rematch.
Holloway vs Pettis is now for the interim, which seems pretty weird - just have that as the no.1 contender and then face Aldo.
Unless Aldo has legit retired and that's why this is now for the interim...

Edit: Now official that he "relinquished" his belt. However Ariel Helwani is reporting that McGregor never agreed to it, so he was stripped.

 

[SelimNiai]

Theres a reason Champions get introduced as "reigning, defending....champion". No interest in defending then its not really being a champion

Belts arent just there for the bling factor