England v New Zealand - 2 November 2024

[Welsh Exile]

Apparently, there's a rugby match on Saturday. Anyone care to speculate on how that might go?

England will lose by 3-5 points.

 

[ncurd]

Way back when, I think 2006 or 2008 I was at Murrayfield for the Calcutta cup and Scotland had a bunch of people dressed up as extras from Braveheart on the pitch waving swords, shields and axes.

Good film for historical accuracy that

The Haka is a part of rugby I don't think we should arguing if it belongs unless Maori groups in NZ take exception. My understanding is they don't.

Why WR want to stop team fronting up (provided its respectful) and adding to the spectacle is baffling I'm sure you can brilliant TV angles and iconic images regardless. But honestly I care less about this than the roof in Wales this is distraction that comes up way too often.

 

[AlRums]

Didn't they only win because an English man John Chard of the Royal Engineers was in charge.

Asking for a friend

Most of them were English and at the time it was an English regiment, didn't become the South Wales Borderers until 2 years after the event.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

England will lose by 3-5 points.

Call yourself a Welshman?

While I think we should win we're not yet good enough at seeing tight ones over the line so I could deffo see something like that.

 

[McTallshort]

Midlands v ABs. What a time to be alive. That's awesome. Things were better back then.

So were the combovers. Dusty (not much) Hair got the winning points

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

If I had to bet I'd go NZ but this is as 50/50 as you get I think. Wouldn't be surprised with a big win either way at the same time, England seem primed to either make the jump up to the top 4 which have seperated themselves a bit or take a not insignificant step back after losing important backroom guys.

Beauden being touted as the 10 almost wants me to switch the prediction to England but he does seem to have form.

 

[Welsh Exile]

It's disgusting how well this mob match up against NZ when you look at sorry old Wales. I honestly don't get it. We can't be that bad, even when we were good.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Genuine question.

The haka has Maori origins. Māori or Māori descendants are a minority. Presumably the hakas are done with Māori agreement, but do all Māori feel that way? Do non Māori players feel comfortable doing them? Do all Kiwi fans feel that it represents them? When did it cross over into being representative of NZ as a whole?

I think NZ is fairly unique among ex colonies in terms of the sheer extent to which native culture survived and even got adopted by the colonisers.

 

[McTallshort]

Didn't they only win because an English man John Chard of the Royal Engineers was in charge.

Asking for a friend

As much as I would like a Royal Engineer to take the credit it was actually Com Dalton who was the actual hero. He was a seasoned soldier who was offered a commission in the commensurate and found himself at Rorkes Drift with 2 young daft officers and a load of sick Welshmen.

He was the one who saved the situation.

On the game I'm hoping England will win but expect NZ to pip them owing to their current form.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

We can 100% win if we play the right tactics and use the bench correctly.

SB…hold my beer

I feel a loss coming, caused by tactics and bench use. Just don't think SB has what it takes unfortunately.

 

[Rugbyfan564]

I think NZ is fairly unique among ex colonies in terms of the sheer extent to which native culture survived and even got adopted by the colonisers.

And the native culture was the least established as the Māori only arrived in New Zealand themselves from arround 1300 onwards. (Having had a Māori heritage teacher at school we had whole lessons on Māori history that very few in England must have ever had.)

 

[Saintjay]

All Blacks by 12. I think we are going to kick the leather off it. We'll be caught cold, D will be rusty and we will get cut open.

Then we can get back to the following topics moaning about Borthwick, England coaches, Furbanks not being international standard and the Lions selections.

Always the optimist. Would love to be wrong.

 

[TommiG88]

This thread is killing me. Too much foreign involvement

 

[IT157]

I read Marler has been slagging off the Haka and deleted his Twitter account. I always feel slagging off the Haka just before playing NZ is never the smartest move so I approve of his comments even if I found them slightly insensitive.

The haka should have been banned years ago.

 

[Reiser99]

On Marler himself. He's said before that he sees himself taking on the villain role in matches and squads to protect his team mates. It's affected his mental health, but he still does it so others can focus on their game. Wonder if there is an aspect of this here. Leave camp, say something controversial, rest of the team can prepare in peace and quiet.

 

[West Country Wail]

On Marler himself. He's said before that he sees himself taking on the villain role in matches and squads to protect his team mates. It's affected his mental health, but he still does it so others can focus on their game. Wonder if there is an aspect of this here. Leave camp, say something controversial, rest of the team can prepare in peace and quiet.

I don't think the team would appreciate him handing over red meat to the ABs

 

[Reiser99]

I don't think the team would appreciate him handing over red meat to the ABs

Is it though? I doubt the team care that much and will probably stay focused on their own prep.

 

[BPM]

I don't really understand the upset here TBH. He was actually saying he wanted the Haka to be more confrontational like it was in the Samoa RL game or not bother. Is that really that controversial?

 

[Which Tyler]

I don't think the team would appreciate him handing over red meat to the ABs

If the AB's get that precious about the Haka, then A] it says some really bad things about their professionalism, and B] where have they been for the last 25 years?

On the Haka itself, my view is the same as it's been for a decade or more - I enjoy it (and the Siva Tau etc), the problem is that it's more protected than a scrum half at the breakdown. Opponents have to just stand there, at a respectful distance, and take it. The iconic hakas are always the ones where the opposition accept the challenge on their own terms, usually getting in the faces of the performers.

Get that cameraman out of the way - or use spidercam in the same spot, but 8' off the ground, and let the players get on with it.
If a David Campese wants to piss about in the deadball area doing warm ups, or taking some shots at goal - let him. The only one getting shown up as a disrespectful twazzock is himself

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

"Joe Marler is right - rugby has indulged bullying, pompous Haka for too long".

That's the headline from the ever shy and retiring Stephen Jones in the Times. Fair to say that he doesn't sit on the fence in the article.