Aviva Premiership - Round 1

[Patchey]

Is Stegmann really as bad as he appeared to be yesterday? Didn't he accrue quite a few caps for quins?

Seriously though some of those signings were never going to pay off. They took Wasps' 4th choice loosehead and 4th choice tighthead from last season (when our depth was pretty poor to be honest) and made them 1st choice front-rowers. That's hardly a sign of intent.

Stegman has always been a bit up and down, I think at his best he is considerably better than yesterday, when he played very poorly.

Agree about how odd their recruitment was.

 

[goodNumber10]

Stegman has always been a bit up and down, I think at his best he is considerably better than yesterday, when he played very poorly.

Agree about how odd their recruitment was.

they just scraped the barrel.

Awful recruitment policy, you'd have hoped they'd learn from their previous trip but no..

 

[TRF_Cymro]

What's this then slag off the London Welsh thread? It is seemingly getting a bit tired.

 

[goodNumber10]

cry me a river sweet cheeks!

They were gash.

 

[psychic duck]

they just scraped the barrel.

Awful recruitment policy, you'd have hoped they'd learn from their previous trip but no..

They recruited far better last time, signing Montanella, Briggs and Ion in the front row and gave them a solid platform. This time they have wasted their budget on tubby All Blacks and signed nobodies like 4th choice Wasps props.

Last time they also kept a bit more of their promoted side, with hard workers like Mills as well. Now after ditching a lot of the players who got them up, they have created a horrible combination of a side full of average players who have been jumbled together and have only had a few pre season warm ups as a team.

London Welsh are a great argument against the playoffs to be honest. A side that finishes top over a season is more likely to have the investment and preparation to withstand a Premiership season, than one jams their way up through the playoffs finishing 4th and are then left scraping the barrel for players nobody else wants.

 

[goodNumber10]

Agreed!

 

[TRF_Cymro]

cry me a river sweet cheeks!

They were gash.

Ah another great argument!

They recruited far better last time, signing Montanella, Briggs and Ion in the front row and gave them a solid platform. This time they have wasted their budget on tubby All Blacks and signed nobodies like 4th choice Wasps props.

Last time they also kept a bit more of their promoted side, with hard workers like Mills as well. Now after ditching a lot of the players who got them up, they have created a horrible combination of a side full of average players who have been jumbled together and have only had a few pre season warm ups as a team.

London Welsh are a great argument against the playoffs to be honest. A side that finishes top over a season is more likely to have the investment and preparation to withstand a Premiership season, than one jams their way up through the playoffs finishing 4th and are then left scraping the barrel for players nobody else wants.

To be fair how much did you see last year of London Welsh and the players they let go? Lot of people in this thread have just seen that LW released a lot of players but not considered who are what was released.

The only players they should have looked to have kept was Lees, Edwards, L'Estrange and Quill. Ajuwa, Nimmo, Moss rarely cut it last year, Tonga'uiha was never truly fit, Parker, Denbee, ***terrell and Frost retired. I'm sure losing Cai Griffiths back to the Ospreys was the biggest blow

But agree with that their recruitment policy wasn't as good this time as it was last time. You look at the front row they brought in last time to this time and there is no comparison.

 

[Peat]

London Welsh didn't have much choice in recruitment to be fair. Getting in Premiership worthy (ish) players over a summer can't be easy. But then, as they never looked to set up a squad that could get up and stay up, that's still their fault.

Fundamentally, the sooner the other clubs sit them down and end their flirtation with the top level, the better for English rugby.

 

[goodNumber10]

Ah another great argument!

LOL! you Neg'd me?

Besides, what's to say their recruitment policy was there in action for all to see, they were utter garbage, and they look as though they have no where to go. I'd be surprised if they get a single win this season.

Their backs sat deep and got smashed behind the gain line, i can't recall any point where they actually broke the tackle line. Their fitness levels were awful and their defence was lacking in the most basic of skills (that's tackling in case you didn't know).

Their only hope was to play territory and pressure defence, but they couldn't even do that.

As PD says they are a great example of why the plays offs suck a*s! both times they've sneaked in off the back of one big game. last time they brought nothing to the premiership and sadly it looks like they've done the same.

To be fair how much did you see last year of London Welsh and the players they let go? Lot of people in this thread have just seen that LW released a lot of players but not considered who are what was released.

The only players they should have looked to have kept was Lees, Edwards, L'Estrange and Quill. Ajuwa, Nimmo, Moss rarely cut it last year, Tonga'uiha was never truly fit, Parker, Denbee, ***terrell and Frost retired. I'm sure losing Cai Griffiths back to the Ospreys was the biggest blow

But agree with that their recruitment policy wasn't as good this time as it was last time. You look at the front row they brought in last time to this time and there is no comparison.

the championship was on SKy last year and plenty of people discussed it...

London Welsh didn't have much choice in recruitment to be fair. Getting in Premiership worthy (ish) players over a summer can't be easy. But then, as they never looked to set up a squad that could get up and stay up, that's still their fault.

Fundamentally, the sooner the other clubs sit them down and end their flirtation with the top level, the better for English rugby.

Every other club with premiership aspirations is assembling a quality squad the bulk of which you would back to give it a go in the premiership. they have done none of that and recruited late in the day.. they don't invest in their squad, and it showed last time and this time.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

London Welsh didn't have much choice in recruitment to be fair. Getting in Premiership worthy (ish) players over a summer can't be easy. But then, as they never looked to set up a squad that could get up and stay up, that's still their fault.

Fundamentally, the sooner the other clubs sit them down and end their flirtation with the top level, the better for English rugby.

Better for what? So the elitist ring fence the league. Only allow the big named clubs. Good call that.

it showed last time

Again you show no understanding. Last time they weren't given a fair crack of the whip. Given extremely late promotion acceptance they did amazingly well to recruit what they did. This time they haven't done well, there is no doubt about that. But I think they will come good eventually, but be to late in the day.

the championship was on SKy last year and plenty of people discussed it...

Hmmmm ... not many London Welsh games were televised to be fair, so I can't see where you are coming from.

 

[Draggs]

London Welsh didn't have much choice in recruitment to be fair. Getting in Premiership worthy (ish) players over a summer can't be easy. But then, as they never looked to set up a squad that could get up and stay up, that's still their fault.

Fundamentally, the sooner the other clubs sit them down and end their flirtation with the top level, the better for English rugby.

I can't recall now, but what did Exeter do? I am under the impression that most of their squad was home grown.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

I can't recall now, but what did Exeter do? I am under the impression that most of their squad was home grown.

Exactly that.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Better for the English game.

The geographical spread of clubs isn't great and having another London team isn't what it needs - particularly an exiles club, which either serves as a platform for players of the relevant country or has absolutely nothing to do with the country it purportedly represents.
Neither is ideal and one is completely inappropriate for an English league.

In what way where they not given a fair crack of the whip last time? They hadn't prepared to be promoted so were caught with their pants down, it's not their fault but it's hardly unfair.
As far as I am aware they were not obligated to accept promotion - which they were clearly not in any way ready for.

I'm pretty sure Quins, Northampton and Exeter all prepared thoroughly for the premiership and were not in a position where they had to drastically change their squads or find an appropriate ground.

 

[goodNumber10]

Last time they weren't given a fair crack of the whip. Given extremely late promotion acceptance they did amazingly well to recruit what they did. This time they haven't done well, there is no doubt about that. But I think they will come good eventually, but be to late in the day.

No once again you don't understand.

They are not a club who believe they should be premiership contenders, if so they would have been assembling a squad that can compete at the premiership level rather than just getting to the end of the season and then standing open mouthed in amazement that they've got promotion again.

They came up under difficult circumstance and went back down, they did not invest their parachute payment in either their squad or their facilities, everyone else who has gone down has done so with a definitive plan in place to try and get back into the premiership.

They don't deserve to be there, because they have not planned to be there and it showed on Sunday.

Hmmmm ... not many London Welsh games were televised to be fair, so I can't see where you are coming from.

*facepalm*

 

[Peat]

I can't recall now, but what did Exeter do? I am under the impression that most of their squad was home grown.

Some home-grown, some shrewd recruitment while in the Championship. Gareth Steenson was chucked out of Belfast as never make it and has been a very good player for them. They've also built up their facilities, their back room staff, done everything they could to be a Premiership club, until they became one in name.

Better for what? So the elitist ring fence the league. Only allow the big named clubs. Good call that.

Yes, that's totally what it's about. I propose the clubs of the Aviva New World Order all gather together for a port and steak party and then laugh into their waistcoats while suspending all involved with LW over a fire before expelling them from all reputable gentlemen's clubs everywhere. Well done.

Nothing to do with wanting a club with the infrastructure to sustain a Premiership club in order to create a stronger domestic game and international team, nope nope, not at all.

I hereby call this meeting of the Aviva New World Order to, well, order. First point on the agenda - officially changing their name to London Waste of Space.

Second point on the agenda - Banning the players from dating women with all their own teeth.

Third point on the agenda - Clearing the stadium so we may graze sheep there.

 

[goodNumber10]

well you get my vote!

 

[TRF_Cymro]

In what way where they not given a fair crack of the whip last time? They hadn't prepared to be promoted so were caught with their pants down, it's not their fault but it's hardly unfair.

I'm pretty sure Quins, Northampton all prepared thoroughly for the premiership and were not in a position where they had to drastically change their squads or find an appropriate ground.

See they weren't caught with their pants down. Just the old boys club pulling rank, when challenged in court was a different story, no?

Different with Quins and Northampton is the fact they were Premiership Clubs (pretty big ones to be fair) relegated and still able to hold on / attract players. Problem Welsh had was once they were down any decent players they had were taken by other clubs.

But I do apologise for treading the toes of the snobs and hierarchy in this thread. I will continue my duties elsewhere.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Oh yes... demanding proper infrastructure and trying to ensure the quality of our league is "snobbish".

The reason Quins and Northampton could hold on to their players is because they had the ambition to return to the premiership and met the criteria to fulfill it - LW's owner sold up and ****ed off.

 

[goodNumber10]

i'm presuming you're a london welsh fan?

They clearly didn't think they would get promoted last time and hadn't prepared, they hadn't invested in their team. then this year, even with their parachute payment they still didn't invest and now they've spent unwisely in a panic.

You can neg me a third time if you want. It won't change the result from the weekend..

 

[Peat]

Oh no, do continue, we've only just got the serving girl up here with the cold custard to pour down your trousers. We're snobs you see. We're full of playful pranks yet arrogant and proper with it!

London Welsh were in no way prepared to be a Premiership club when they went. It caught them by surprise. They'd not organised a stadium, they'd not get it cleared, they'd not been recruiting Premiership quality players. They got lucky, decided to take their chance despite a very curtailed amount of recruitment time, and were good value that season. Some of their players showed up really well and tbh, without the Keats thing, maybe they'd have done it. Nothing against them for that.

However, their failure to prepare for the Premiership again despite knowing what was coming, is just stupid. A weak club in the Premiership is bad for English rugby for really obvious reasons and it's crap for supporters to see.