A Political Thread

[ncurd]

Yeah sorry you lost me "Tory bootlicker"

There's a ducking reason people sing "Where's Jeremy Corbyn" at people's vote rallies.

 

[ncurd]

@Gavin please provide a source she said that.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Yeah sorry you lost me "Tory bootlicker"

Went against the party line the instant the tories dangled a bit of power in front of her.
If she's not a bootlicker then she, at the very least, shouldn't be trusted to lead the Lib Dems.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Corbyn went on holiday instead of campaigning:
https://twitter.com/joswinson/status/1145065759456018433?lang=en


Also, lol @ her voting more tory than hardline tories:
https://twitter.com/angryray66/status/1145142340555870208

 

[ncurd]

That's fair she said he went holiday. It was also 2 months ago during LD leadership campaign. She didn't say 2 weeks and didn't give dates of when during the campaign. So Gavin's post definitely put words in her mouth.

Went against the party line the instant the tories dangled a bit of power in front of her.

Also, lol @ her voting more tory than hardline tories:
https://twitter.com/angryray66/status/1145142340555870208

Ummm when? If your talking about entering the coalition goverment I haven't got time to enter a 9 year old argument. I mean FFS your arguing against someone voting in line with a government of which they were a minister within.

 

[ncurd]

I mean listen to yourself "Why won't Swinson immediately back Corbyn? She should be conciliatory", *immediately starts quoting Labour propaganda designed to discredit Swinson*

 

[Gavin]

That's fair she said he went holiday. It was also 2 months ago during LD leadership campaign. She didn't say 2 weeks and didn't give dates of when during the campaign. So Gavin's post definitely put words in her mouth.

https://amp-theguardian-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jul/23/jo-swinson-rules-out-lib-dem-pact-with-labour-under-jeremy-corbyn?amp_js_v=a2&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQEKAFwAQ==#referrer=https://www.google.com&amp_tf=From %1$s&ampshare=https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jul/23/jo-swinson-rules-out-lib-dem-pact-with-labour-under-jeremy-corbyn

Speaking on BBC Radio 4's Today programme, Swinson was scathing about Labour's Brexit approach, even though the party has now said it would support a referendum on any deal put forward.

"There is nothing to suggest Jeremy Corbyn can be trusted on Brexit or that he will campaign to remain. Let's remember in the last referendum he went on holiday for two weeks in the middle of it. Forgive me for not believing Jeremy Corbyn's mealy-mouthed words on Brexit. He can barely bring himself to say the words 'people's vote'," she said.

Definitely didn't put words in her mouth as it was recorded on the radio, as per the Guardian news article...

My lack of being able to post from my mobile on the forum was a cause for a lack of links to the relevant article

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Leopards don't change their spots, she'll do what is good for her career, not the lib dems and not the country.

I don't vote labour, and wouldn't under Corbyn (now) - I just think she's a hypocrite and it's a shame that the Lib Dems voted someone like her as their leader.

 

[ncurd]

https://amp-theguardian-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jul/23/jo-swinson-rules-out-lib-dem-pact-with-labour-under-jeremy-corbyn?amp_js_v=a2&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQEKAFwAQ==#referrer=https://www.google.com&amp_tf=From %1$s&ampshare=https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jul/23/jo-swinson-rules-out-lib-dem-pact-with-labour-under-jeremy-corbyn



Definitely didn't put words in her mouth as it was recorded on the radio, as per the Guardian news article...

My lack of being able to post from my mobile on the forum was a cause for a lack of links to the relevant article

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/jeremy-corbyn-denies-went-holiday-8456594

So not a holiday book took a 'long weekend' which to me is a holiday....

EDIT: Also fair play for finding the real quote, I hate ducking meme wars which usually leads to people finding passing around half truths and lies.

 

[Amiga500]

Leopards don't change their spots, she'll do what is good for her career, not the lib dems and not the country.
I don't vote labour, and wouldn't under Corbyn (now) - I just think she's a hypocrite and it's a shame that the Lib Dems voted someone like her as their leader.

I don't mind someone changing their opinion in the face of new evidence.

I do dislike someone changing their opinion to best make political hay out of shifting landscapes.

Two very different things IMO. Jo Swinson doesn't appeal to me. In general I simply cannot gather much enthusiasm for folks that have entered professional politics by the time they are 21.

 

[ncurd]

Leopards don't change their spots, she'll do what is good for her career, not the lib dems and not the country.

I don't vote labour, and wouldn't under Corbyn (now) - I just think she's a hypocrite and it's a shame that the Lib Dems voted someone like her as their leader.

Every potential LD leader we currently have is 'tainted' by the coalition and Ed Davey had the exact same problems. We tried the guy who wasn't associated with the coalition and had a record against it, he turned out to be a raging homophobe.

But I could equally taint Labour with Iraq, I think focusing on the past in that regard is waste of bloody time and you end up voting for nobody.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

That's fair.
This generation of politicians is a **** show - everyone has a stain on them. Then again I imagine you go back a thousand years and forward a thousand years and you'll find people saying the same.

 

[ncurd]

I don't mind someone changing their opinion in the face of new evidence.

I do dislike someone changing their opinion to best make political hay out of shifting landscapes.

Two very different things IMO. Jo Swinson doesn't appeal to me.

I agree I just wonder why you think Swinson did either. As far I can tell she and LD opinion and line of the coalition is "we held back the true excesses of Tory party" they said sorry about tuition fees. The only other thing is with hynesight they (and I'm refering to the leadership) should of played hard ball when the Tories renegged on their promises for house of lords reform. I don't think her actual opinion has changed.

 

[Amiga500]

I agree I just wonder why you think Swinson did either.

So what of the LibDem manifesto of that election did they deliver?

If they had come out and said "look folks, we didn't realise public finances are sooo f*kked - the country really is up shít creek without a paddle, we have to introduce higher fees now - but will look to pull them down again ASAP" then you might have a measure of respect for them.

But they didn't acknowledge the depth of the problem, and they haven't campaigned on reducing them since.

As far I can tell she and LD opinion and line of the coalition is "we held back the true excesses of Tory party" they said sorry about tuition fees.

Oh, they said sorry. That makes it all right then.

If Nick Clegg had grown a set and ordered them to walk out - chances are in the general election that would have followed the LibDems would have got even more of the vote.


Have they a list of the "true excesses of the Tory Party" that they managed to hold back? Or is that them just polishing a turd as best they can?

 

[ncurd]

Look let me be absolutely clear if the LD's allow 'no deal' Brexit to happen I'll resign from the party as I could never forgive them for that.

ATM I don't believe Corbyn's plan will work and there is no evidence it will. He has shifted to opening up to the idea of unityTM candidate though.

I don't think Swinson is being helpful but I also think the constant attacks on her (which started the second she became leader) are helping her enter a more conciliatory tone.

 

[Amiga500]

Agreed.

Corbyn and Swinson are doing more harm than good right now.

 

[ncurd]

So what of the LibDem manifesto of that election did they deliver?

Oh, they said sorry. That makes it all right then.

If Nick Clegg had grown a set and ordered them to walk out - chances are in the general election that would have followed the LibDems would have got even more of the vote.

https://3859gp38qzh51h504x6gvv0o-wp...crat-achievements-in-coalition-government.png

Have they a list of the "true excesses of the Tory Party" that they managed to hold back? Or is that them just polishing a turd as best they can?

Umm did you fall asleep for the past 4 years?

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Pretty standard, any time someone on the left had weapons and ammo, their primary target becomes others on the left.

It's the bloody Judean people's front scenario. The constant splitting of the left vote is what creates these situations...

 

[Which Tyler]

So Johnson is meeting Macron today, the most dubious EU leader when it comes to extending deadlines.

Do we think his strategy might be tomoiss off Macron so much that even if a GNU is out together, Macron will still refuse to extend the deadline whilst we have an election?

 

[General Melchett]

So Johnson is meeting Macron today, the most dubious EU leader when it comes to extending deadlines.

Do we think his strategy might be tomoiss off Macron so much that even if a GNU is out together, Macron will still refuse to extend the deadline whilst we have an election?

I think the only way there will be an extension is if the Government is brought down via a confidence vote. Macron would only probably give way in this scenario. BoJo won't seek an extension otherwise he'll be going back on his 'we're out on 31 Oct come what may' claim.

The EU just need to stick to their guns and put the onus on the UK to come up with a concrete alternative solution to the backstop, something the Tories have failed to do.

I think these visits by BoJo are just token so that he can claim that he at least tried to get a new deal but the nasty stubborn EU wouldn't budge.