[2018 Rugby Championship] Round 2: New Zealand v Australia (25/08/2018)

Discussion in 'The Rugby Championship 2019' started by TRF_heineken, Aug 20, 2018.

  1. All Black

    All Black Bench Player

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    People often overlook the fact that the SH is trying to help the NH with their rugby.

    The Tongan Thor is a mercenary. He got told by the All Blacks that he wasn't ready yet and so he took off to Aus. He wanted the big bucks straight away and fair enough I guess.

    If the US really took to rugby, they would be as you say - rapidly developing. They'd be a force in no time and would probably rise over some of the tier one nations that have been playing longer.
     
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  3. Derpus

    Derpus Bench Player

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    They all are. If they could make big dollars in Fiji or Tonga they would stay with their families. They leave to make money to send back. All of the Islanders who leave as teens or adults to wherever are leaving for cash.

    Also the US are developing. They just started a new domestic competition and invested pretty large sums. They are also reporting quite a lot of interest in the sport in general.
     
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    Last edited: Aug 30, 2018
  4. Jabby

    Jabby First XV

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    id love to see the NZRU help world rugby...but they just don't have the cash, we're already seeing the rot in NZ rugby starting at the bottom, with unions going broke and having to be rescued. as much as we love to think about the AB's as this untouchable icon....if the domestic unions keep struggling then then the AB's will suffer in the long run
     
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  5. mania

    mania First XV

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    nah. US wont be a rugby power for at least a few decades at least.
    my niece plays rugby in missouri on scholarship and they dont get it.
    they run rugby like they run gridiron with the coach controlling every single play from the sideline. players like my niece are encouraged not to look at whats in front of her but to check with the coach as to what the next play is.
    she gets very frustrated
     
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  6. smartcooky

    smartcooky Referee Coach and Advisor

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    That has sod all to do with rugby

    It would be good if you actually knew what strawman is

    Of course, I understand Madagascar is an outlier case, that was my point. You can't simply statements like a sport being No. 1 and with high player numbers is an automatic ticket to world domination. It simple does not work like that. The Kangaroos dominate the world in RL, they have high player numbers too, but RL is a long, long war from being the No. 1 sport in Australia; its 3rd in attendance and not even in the top 10 for participation.
     
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  7. Jack Reacher

    Jack Reacher Academy Player

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    One game? He's been doing it for 3 seasons now....
     
  8. All Black

    All Black Bench Player

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    I agree. It is what it is. NZ have less playing numbers than some other countries. Thats it!

    Who cares about per capita? it's just simply some countries have more playing numbers and thats the truth. No excuses.
     
  9. The_Blindside

    The_Blindside International

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    I have my doubts that the US Eagles will ever be a “rugby power” - by that I mean in the 15s men’s game and US Eagles ever competing with the top tier teams on a consistent basis regardless of how good a one off win v Scotland was recently. First and foremost Sports market is just too saturated in the US to attract the very best athletes to the sport - they will always go where the best money is paid, which will be a big hindrance in getting, keeping and developing players good enough to compete at the elite end of the sport.

    Sevens has a better chance.
     
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  10. The Alpha Bro

    The Alpha Bro Fat Boi

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    Lol, yes it does. It's a clear indication that there isn't the money in Madagascar to pump into the infrastructure schools, clubs and the NZRU have to produce the players it does. It shows that many people in Madagascar will struggle to provide themselves with adequate nutrition, let alone the nutrition required to build a World Class rugby player.


    I do, and you've just presented another one...

    This would prove your point if any country had league as it's national sport, inb4 Papua New Guinea with their tiny GDP and dispersed population, but no country with the capabilities of consistently producing top class athletes has league as their national sport. Australia is also a bloody large country with areas as populous as New Zealand that are league strongholds.

    Sooo, in conclusion, you appear to be refuting ncurd's point but your use of countries where the majority of the population live in poverty and sports that have a fraction of the popularity rugby boasts are fallacies.

    Now, it may just have been you wanting to show how knowledgeable you are knowing about Madagascar's rugby culture but it was presented in such a way that it was rebutting the original point while any reasonable person knows that it doesn't come close to that.

    And as to the bolded you are correct, you can't. However in this case it's pretty damn obvious that it does considering the one country where people can adequately feed themselves and that has rugby as their main sport with no political interference dominates the thing. I don't know why you'd bother disputing this, it doesn't make NZ any more or less impressive in rugby terms, they have their advantages and are exploiting them. I readily accept that the IRFU's control over their players and the high concentration of rich fee paying, rugby focused schools is the reason Ireland and Leinster punch above their weight. The popularity of rugby, and all the advantages that come with that is where NZ get and exploit their advantages, there's no magic to it...
     
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  11. ncurd

    ncurd International

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    Its the infrastructure supported through popularity stupid.

    I wrote a long post but I couldn't be arsed when people don't realise factors like GDP I generally give up.

    Afterall I'm trying to point out is participation numbers on their own are utterly rubbish.

    Which is evidently so otherwise NZ would get thrashed unless you believe in divine right to win....
     
  12. mania

    mania First XV

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    also rugby will make them better gridiron players. so they may dabble in rugby but once the big money gets offered for someone who knows how to smash people without pads and a helmet. then theyre off to the NFL
     
  13. All Black

    All Black Bench Player

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    Numbers don't lie. It's simple unless you look for excuses and then you present hypotheticals whilst the facts are, theres more playing numbers in other countries than there are others. 10 thousand is a lot of people but 100 thousand...wow thats a big orchid with a whole lot of apples to choose from. No excuses, no unsupported hypotheticals, numbers don't lie, now whos about to cry HAHAHA.

    Getting sick of the excuses really. Especially from countries that NZ helps to improve their game.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2018
  14. Jabby

    Jabby First XV

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    they are very well supported ideas though, not unsupported hypothetical...

    If rugby is the fourth or fifth most popular sport then its quite likely the people the the skills to match the AB's are already playing other sports....you could have a million registered players but if its a million duds then they're not going to get anywhere, the other side of the coin being if the savea's, barrett's and whitelocks kept spitting out kids we'd only need 15 registered players

    and of course the GDP plays a role...if people dont have money to spend on watching rugby then thats income not being injected into the sport...and if people are that poor then they're not going to be spending as much time practicing, they'll be out working

    accepting factors that lead to nz being good at rugby doesn't stop us being good at rugby....this is baffling
     
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  15. All Black

    All Black Bench Player

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    Disagree with some of that unless you can sway me. You say it is not unsupported hypothetical. Cool. That means you have proof. Can you please share the proof on here? A research to show that it is supported and not just a 'you should know'.
     
  16. ncurd

    ncurd International

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    I'm trying to decide whether All Black is trolling, taking the **** or just general sarcasm.

    But sure here we go, goggle-fu activate!

    http://re-design.dimiter.eu/?p=868
    Boo yah
     
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  17. All Black

    All Black Bench Player

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    What you provided is not specific to what we're talking about and what you're saying. The source I provided was about rugby.

    If its about money well you get paid more money in europe to play pro rugby than you do in NZ.

    As long as the All Blacks are the best. I'm all good lol. I just hate the excuses.

    Heaps of players in England, thats for sure ;)

    Boo yah lol
     
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    Last edited: Aug 31, 2018
  18. ncurd

    ncurd International

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    Yeah you're being a dick now absolutely no critical thinking on your part just utter drivel.
     
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  19. All Black

    All Black Bench Player

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    Hey hey, no need for the insults Mr Angry lol. I just disagree with you thats all.
     
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  20. El_Matador

    El_Matador Academy Player

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    It's quite amusing how oblivious this ncurd guy is to how bitter and envious he sounds of the All Blacks success and the lengths at which he's attempting to discredit their success is laughable and pathetic.
     
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  21. ncurd

    ncurd International

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    Yeah in giving reasons and looking at the root causes for their success I'm totally trying to discredit them...
     
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