[2016 Rugby Championship] New Zealand v South Africa (17/09/2016)

[TheOvalBall]

Please don't remind me of that Slaughter. I was at the game. At Loftus Versfeld! My first SA vs NZ match live.

Mine as well.

 

[unrated]

South Africans are known for their optimism.

 

[TRF_heineken]

Who voted for a draw? Probably some aussie expat!

 

[The Jones Boy]

They did it before. Remember 52-16 in 2002 ?

19th of July, 2003.

 

[LeanTaladro]

Any clue on South Africa's lineup? I'm expecting to see at least 5 changes.

IMO NZ will win by 15 or 20 points, not more. 38-18

 

[Sker]

I think the only change we'll see in the starting XV is an injury enforced one with Lood de Jager being replaced by PSDT.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

All Blacks Team
1. Moody
2. Coles
3. Franks
4. Retallick
5. Whitelock
6. Kaino
7. Savea
8. Read (c)
9. Smith
10. Barrett
11. Savea
12. Crotty
13. Fekitoa
14. Dagg
15. Smith

16. Parsons
17. Crockett
18. Faumaina
19. Romano
20. Todd
21. Perenara
22. Sopoaga
23. Lienert-Brown

Standard starting XV (good to see Ardie get a run out) but there's a few talking points on the bench. Parsons over Taylor? Romano over Tuipulotu (again)? Todd over Squire or Dixon? Good to see Sopoaga on the bench over Cruden though, I think he'll offer significantly more impact.

 

[Larksea]

yeah again pretty boring 23 (no mckenzie AGAIN lol)

only surprise for me is Sopoaga, glad hes getting a go. Maybe with he and Parsons being selected it is a bit of rotation to give guys a run. also both maybe a bit more stocky and durable against the physical bocs.

Todd is clearly there to backup Savea in his first test start, though I personally would back Dixon to cover 7 if need be the AB selectors like specialist 7's.

I don't understand Romano all of a sudden being elevated to 3rd lock over Tiupulotu. IMO Tui is far superior, looks like hes playing well for Auckland as well. I think Romano is NZ's 6-8th best lock these days. Romono has been a solid yet unspectacular player. I think other players are more deserving of selection on form...

- - - Updated - - -

SOUTH AFRICA: Johan Goosen, Bryan Habana, Jesse Kriel, Juan de Jongh, Francois Hougaard, Elton Jantjies, Faf de Klerk, Warren Whiteley, Oupa Mohoje, Francois Louw, Pieter-Steph du Toit, Eben Etzebeth, Vincent Koch, Adriaan Strauss, Tendai Mtawarira. Reserves: Malcolm Marx, Steven Kitshoff, Lourens Adriaanse, Franco Mostert, Willem Alberts, Jaco Kriel, Morné Steyn, Damian de Allende.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Only two backs covering the bench for the Boks? So Hougaard to cover 9 if Faf gets injured?

 

[TheOvalBall]

SOUTH AFRICA: Johan Goosen, Bryan Habana, Jesse Kriel, Juan de Jongh, Francois Hougaard, Elton Jantjies, Faf de Klerk, Warren Whiteley, Oupa Mohoje, Francois Louw, Pieter-Steph du Toit, Eben Etzebeth, Vincent Koch, Adriaan Strauss, Tendai Mtawarira. Reserves: Malcolm Marx, Steven Kitshoff, Lourens Adriaanse, Franco Mostert, Willem Alberts, Jaco Kriel, Morné Steyn, Damian de Allende.

Another crazy 23 for another test match.

 

[LeanTaladro]

Why is still Jaco Kriel on the bench? He is an absolute beast.

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

Why did they drop rudy page before the last match? I though he did a good job at the end against Argentina and faf seems to be past his honeymoon period. I can't believe there are no changes to the back row. I do like the front row cover they brought in and the only other change I wanted to see was maybe a new halfback pair but I guess they are sticking with the Jekyll and Hyde brothers.

 

[TRF_heineken]

Why did they drop rudy page before the last match? I though he did a good job at the end against Argentina and faf seems to be past his honeymoon period. I can't believe there are no changes to the back row. I do like the front row cover they brought in and the only other change I wanted to see was maybe a new halfback pair but I guess they are sticking with the Jekyll and Hyde brothers.

They dropped Paige so that they can have an extra forward on the bench. With Hougaard starting, should there be an injury to Faf, then Hougaard would move to scrumhalf and another back will slot in to the wing role.

With Hougaard, Kriel and Goosen's versatility to play more than one position, we have the luxury to add more forwards on the bench. Which is in my opinion a good idea.

I still don't know why Elton is starting though. He has been our biggest liability week in and week out.

Happy for Marx to get a chance (that is if he even gets a chance). Interesting to see Koch starting. Either AC has a trick up his sleeve, and rested Koch for this match specifically, or he just has some sort of rotation policy for the tighthead props. It's our third tighthead prop starting in 4 matches...

 

[SomeOke]

I'm happy with Elton starting, if only because if he keeps delivering kak performances like he's delivered thus far, the Lions supporters will finally shut up and we can move on to someone more reliable.
I'm still happy with Faf, the only game where he really looked bad was against Aus and to be fair they are specialists at slowing down quick ball.

As for the team I am happy to see PtsD starting but it isn't enough, Strauss, Flouw and Mohoje all need to go.

In the end I will try to stay positive, it is still an extremely young side after all, after Straeuli got sacked in 2003, we won the next World Cup!
2023 anyone?

 

[TRF_heineken]

I'm happy with Elton starting, if only because if he keeps delivering kak performances like he's delivered thus far, the Lions supporters will finally shut up and we can move on to someone more reliable.
I'm still happy with Faf, the only game where he really looked bad was against Aus and to be fair they are specialists at slowing down quick ball.

As for the team I am happy to see PtsD starting but it isn't enough, Strauss, Flouw and Mohoje all need to go.

In the end I will try to stay positive, it is still an extremely young side after all, after Straeuli got sacked in 2003, we won the next World Cup!
2023 anyone?

Haha, I think everyone agrees about Elton, hell even the NZ writers do:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/opinion/84197916/Mark-Reason-Springboks-backline-is-a-shambles-and-their-defence-is-bankrupt

I agree on Strauss, Flouw and Mohoje. But perhaps the inclusion of Marx, Kriel and Alberts on the bench is precisely why they are there. To phase out the dead weight we seem to have in our forwards. I'm just glad that PSDT will not be used as a flanker. He's just too slow to play in the loosies.

 

[Every Time Ref]

Re: Elton, is there not an argument for sticking by him because he is seen as the future? Ie his place in the side is not based on what he does this week as much as what he will be doing week in week out in two years time. In which case, the question is - is he worth the investment?

Shame for me to see Louw struggling ... hope he still keeps his club form when he returns to Bath

 

[TRF_heineken]

Re: Elton, is there not an argument for sticking by him because he is seen as the future? Ie his place in the side is not based on what he does this week as much as what he will be doing week in week out in two years time. In which case, the question is - is he worth the investment?

Shame for me to see Louw struggling ... hope he still keeps his club form when he returns to Bath

Is he the future though?? He's older than Lambie and Pollard. And there's a lot of young exciting fly halves coming through. He's basically a placeholder while the others recover from injury. He was the in-form injury-free fly half from Super Rugby, so his appointment was pretty much the right idea, especially with combining with De Klerk. But Since the Irish series his form in a bok jersey has been abysmal.

 

[saulan]

Re: Elton, is there not an argument for sticking by him because he is seen as the future?

That thinking is actually the reason we have the problem at flyhalf at the moment. Almost every year a new flyhalf comes up that is 'the flyhalf of the future'. We have had Lambie, Goosen, Pollard and Jantjies in this role of future flyhalf (even Boshoff for a match). Then we get to the next year, someone else performs well and they become the flyhalf of the future. What it results in really is Morne Steyn has stayed in the team 5 years longer than required because there is no other experienced option.

Granted, Pollard was probably the answer as he has shown leadership and skill in U20 tournaments, captaining the team and also winning the tournament while still in high school. I think the plan was to keep him going this year, but then he got injured (another problem with our flyhalves). I think the present and future flyhalf is Pollard, because he is good enough now and will grow in the future. Jantjies has shown he is a confidence player, and he hasn't had any since the Super Rugby final loss.

 

[Every Time Ref]

Is he the future though?? He's older than Lambie and Pollard. And there's a lot of young exciting fly halves coming through. He's basically a placeholder while the others recover from injury. He was the in-form injury-free fly half from Super Rugby, so his appointment was pretty much the right idea, especially with combining with De Klerk. But Since the Irish series his form in a bok jersey has been abysmal.

I thought he was a long-term choice not an injury replacement, clearly not

 

[saulan]

I thought he was a long-term choice not an injury replacement, clearly not

Unfortunately they were all meant to be long term choices.