[2015 Six Nations] Ireland vs England (Round 3)

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

It was the linesman who called it which probably gave Joubert the reassurance he needed not to go back and check, but yes, foolish to the point of stupid not to go back and at least check it. God knows we do the rest of the time! My feeling is had it been a 7 point game rather than 10 points, he might have gone back for a look - which is disappointing and could be costly.

Ultimately though, I've no clue whether it was forward or not, as the camera angle wasn't great in the first place.

 

[lucky number 7]

you're right, his size doesn't make him less of a traditional 7.

the fact he doesn't play like one does




None of which makes him a traditional 7.

*

You've not watched much of his play from 7 in the last two years have you?
Again just because he performs more than his functional role at 7 ie, big carries and running tighter lines for hard yards. Doesn't make him any less capable as a 7 than a seven who goes out to fetch ball tackle and link up. All of which he does with the competency of any 7 in world rugby. Aside from Hooper who's fetching and link play is of the highest quality.

He does all the work of a traditional 7 and more , So perhaps you're correct.
He's just better.

 

[goodNumber10]

And you also suggest that England lived off Wales' mistakes...as if England didn't make such mistakes for Sexton to punish yesterday?

Also I'm not sure 11 phases leading into a try can be deemed "living off other peoples mistakes".

All teams do that anyway, as i mentioned before the most efficient way to score tries is from turnover ball, which inevitably comes from a....mistake, and mistakes tend to come form pressure - also why are we discussing the welsh in an England Ireland thread......

This thread is so going into melt down.

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You've not watched much of his play from 7 in the last two years have you?
Again just because he performs more than his functional role at 7 ie, big carries and running tighter lines for hard yards. Doesn't make him any less capable as a 7 than a seven who goes out to fetch ball tackle and link up. All of which he does with the competency of any 7 in world rugby. Aside from Hooper who's fetching and link play is of the highest quality.

He does all the work of a traditional 7 and more , So perhaps you're correct.
He's just better.

Hooper isn't a fetcher.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Also I'm not sure 11 phases leading into a try can be deemed "living off other peoples mistakes".

This.

 

[Jbobo]

It was the linesman who called it which probably gave Joubert the reassurance he needed not to go back and check, but yes, foolish to the point of stupid not to go back and at least check it. God knows we do the rest of the time! My feeling is had it been a 7 point game rather than 10 points, he might have gone back for a look - which is disappointing and could be costly.

Ultimately though, I've no clue whether it was forward or not, as the camera angle wasn't great in the first place.

Question in regards to points difference: Has anyone looked at England's 'try' at the end of the game? I was watching the game about 3 hours after the fact so didn't see any replays, it didn't look particularly forward to me and I wasn't too sure about the grounding however I was quite shocked the ref didn't bother checking with the TMO. That's potential 14 point swing at the end of the day.

Not saying that it deffo a try just it probably should of been looked at, and what do people think if it had was it a try?

It looked pretty obvious to me. Twelvetrees wasn't going forward at great pace, he was quite lateral and the ball went forwards roughly a metre. No try

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

It looked pretty obvious to me. Twelvetrees wasn't going forward at great pace, he was quite lateral and the ball went forwards roughly a metre. No try

In the same way as you 'Saw' Billy V's foot in touch?

 

[lucky number 7]

Hooper isn't a fetcher.

You're correct. Only saw him twice recently and he had looked sharp at turning ball. I remember two beautiful clean poaches against Ireland.
But looking at stats he isn't much of a groundhog either. But he's still the closest thing to a traditional 7 of which people go on about in my opinion.

 

[goodNumber10]

You're correct. Only saw him twice recently and he had looked sharp at turning ball. I remember two beautiful clean poaches against Ireland.
But looking at stats he isn't much of a groundhog either. But he's still the closest thing to a traditional 7 of which people go on about in my opinion.

He's anything but - he's a ball carrying defensive 7. Pockcok & Gill are more like your Richie M, Brussouw, Martyn Williams.

Hooper is more like your Louw, SOB does a bit of everything well when his pack is on top.

 

[Jbobo]

In the same way as you 'Saw' Billy V's foot in touch?

Probably more like it was clear to me that Billy did not have control of the ball on the floor...

 

[msf]

Got to second whoever repped Yabojj's posts. Hughes-Kvesic-Ewers looks scary, but I don't think I've seen any of them jumping much at the lineout, so I would probably go for Vunipola-Wood-Kvesic instead.

 

[yaboyjj]

Got to second whoever repped Yabojj's posts. Hughes-Kvesic-Ewers looks scary, but I don't think I've seen any of them jumping much at the lineout, so I would probably go for Vunipola-Wood-Kvesic instead.

Hughes is really developing in the line-out actually and will soon be a very proficient jumper imo- He's also a lot less bulky than Morgan/Vunipola so easier to lift- a real prospect (don't condone poaching, but it'll happen anyway), an 8 offering more than ball carrying would offer a whole new dynamic.

 

[goodNumber10]

Hughes is really developing in the line-out actually and will soon be a very proficient jumper imo- He's also a lot less bulky than Morgan/Vunipola so easier to lift- a real prospect (don't condone poaching, but it'll happen anyway), an 8 offering more than ball carrying would offer a whole new dynamic.

as a wasps fan, i'm a big fan of Hughes.

 

[LiRFCMatt]

as a wasps fan, i'm a big fan of Hughes.

As an Irish fan, I'm a big fan of Hughes. How can you not be!?

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Question in regards to points difference: Has anyone looked at England's 'try' at the end of the game? I was watching the game about 3 hours after the fact so didn't see any replays, it didn't look particularly forward to me and I wasn't too sure about the grounding however I was quite shocked the ref didn't bother checking with the TMO. That's potential 14 point swing at the end of the day.

Not saying that it deffo a try just it probably should of been looked at, and what do people think if it had was it a try?

I'm pretty sure he stuck his foot in touch afterward anyway, I only saw it one and was very excited though.

 

[Lomu]

Great game, and one which England will take more from. They can afford to lose now but it will stand them in good stead for wc. And they will be in prob 2nd or 3rd favourites. I'll let you pick the other top 2.plus Brian moores commentary is great, he can't contain himself at times... That's what you want, passion, and somehow he remains unbiased

 

[LiRFCMatt]

Great game, and one which England will take more from. They can afford to lose now but it will stand them in good stead for wc. And they will be in prob 2nd or 3rd favourites. I'll let you pick the other top 2.plus Brian moores commentary is great, he can't contain himself at times... That's what you want, passion, and somehow he remains unbiased

I really found it tough and frustrating to watch as an Englishman, but England now know the quality of the Irish, their strengths and what to prepare for. It was difficult coming in because we beat them last year in a tough game, and they have only improved this past year, so it was always going to be tough.

 

[Every Time Ref]

Got to second whoever repped Yabojj's posts. Hughes-Kvesic-Ewers looks scary, but I don't think I've seen any of them jumping much at the lineout, so I would probably go for Vunipola-Wood-Kvesic instead.

Hughes jumps a fair bit for Wasps doesn't he? He's also pretty good over the ball. For my money the best eight in the premiership this season, whatever your views on poaching, speaking pragmatically the day he qualifies will be a very good day fro English rugby.

 

[munstermuffin]

Lads regards *****ing and moaning there about SOB as a traditional 7 etc. what is that these days? Every team uses it differently?

People also say Ireland haven't got that 'extra gear' and have a 1 way game plan. But New Zealand creeped a win in Aviva and a loss to England in which there were a lot of errors are the only 2 losses. I admit standard overall of international rugby has dropped but Ireland have a variety of game plans. They can kick but if they need to they can run it through backs and well while Schmidts plan now is very safe and no we will never score buckets of tries but look if he won every game 6-5 he wouldn't care. It's a results business.

 

[ncurd]

People also say Ireland haven't got that 'extra gear' and have a 1 way game plan. But New Zealand creeped a win in Aviva and a loss to England in which there were a lot of errors are the only 2 losses. I admit standard overall of international rugby has dropped but Ireland have a variety of game plans. They can kick but if they need to they can run it through backs and well while Schmidts plan now is very safe and no we will never score buckets of tries but look if he won every game 6-5 he wouldn't care. It's a results business.

I wouldn't say Ireland are one dimensional they clearly vary what they do each attack and are good in defense. The extra gear is closing out a game this is a little unfair as very few sides would but did Ireland play in a way that a team say of NZ's quality couldn't get back into that game at 19-3 up? I'm not entirely sure they did and an England that played better may have done.

As I said earlier they haven't needed that extra gear yet but they haven't shown signs that it exists.

 

[munstermuffin]

I wouldn't say Ireland are one dimensional they clearly vary what they do each attack and are good in defense. The extra gear is closing out a game this is a little unfair as very few sides would but did Ireland play in a way that a team say of NZ's quality couldn't get back into that game at 19-3 up? I'm not entirely sure they did and an England that played better may have done.

As I said earlier they haven't needed that extra gear yet but they haven't shown signs that it exists.

But Ireland's way is simply to go through process and build score. I think as you say they've never had to use that extra gear and well part of reason England played poor was Ireland didn't let them play. Like it's easy say a team didn't play well but we forget that Irelsnd stopped England playing well.