[2014 Mid-Year Tests] England

[j'nuh]

Taking Armitage out of the equation, whole different thread about the Armitage debate, England have a lot of good players. I personally would have called fearns in and had a Fearns-Morgan-Robshaw/Haskell trio, I do agree that we don't have a fully fit in form Croft; who is world class. I don't think it is as much of a problem as fly-half.

Meh, we still don't quite have a Parisse/Read/Faletau/SO'B/Pocock/Picamoles etc. As good as all the English players are, only Armitage is on that next level really. Back row is certainly the least inspiring part of our squad.

Mind you, Vunipola could get there before long.

If only Braid and Burger were English. 6. Braid 7. Burger 8. Armitage 20. Vunipola. Just imagine it.

 

[ratsapprentice]

I know I'm probably sounding like a broken record at this point - but I think Kvesic has the potential to be up there with those guys if we give him game time.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

I still think potentially Wallace has a higher ceiling than Kvesic.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Seymour is a better player (not leader) than Braid, both stats-wise and watching-the-game-with-your-own-eyes-wise.

 

[j'nuh]

Is Hask-cam coming back?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Ah, man, I really hope so - Inside Line has really been lacking since Healy and Haskell have been missing.

 

[ratsapprentice]

The trouble is that it's guilty by association with 2011.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Aye, was just thinking that.

Was also thinking: I hope Lancaster assigns somebody to specifically keep Haskell and Cipriani apart at all cost, as I imagine they raised some hell back in Danny's Wasps days.

 

[TheSaffycen]

I know I'm probably sounding like a broken record at this point - but I think Kvesic has the potential to be up there with those guys if we give him game time.

He definitely does have the potential to be world class; with the new glos pack he has the perfect platform to work on next year. I know i'm biased but every time he gets a run of games without injury Fraser manages to get past Burger. I think a few of the young English Sarries guys could make an impact at international level, George, Itoje, Kruis, Hankin, Fraser, Wray(less likely but has played well this year).

Seymour is a better player (not leader) than Braid, both stats-wise and watching-the-game-with-your-own-eyes-wise.

That ship has sailed, I don't know why but it has. I read a load about how Armitage is so good because he is only 5ft 9 which makes him almost impossible to get off the ball. He is the perfect 7 and blah blah blah. Seymour is only 5ft 11 is fit as hell !! I don't think his size would be a problem at international level as well as his tackling technique is perfect and again he is so hard to get off the ball.

 

[The Jones Boy]

It's staggering from an external perspective, just how many props, hookers and locks England has call on. Sooo many quality players in the tight five. Bodes very well for the future for a good long while.

 

[Galliers]

Traveling to Hamilton from Auckland

Hey all

Is anyone traveling from Auckland to Hamilton for the game in June?
There are 7 or 8 of us going down and were looking at booking a minibus to drive us down there and back. Does anyone know of any good companies to do so?

Cheers
Galliers

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Meh, we still don't quite have a Parisse/Read/Faletau/SO'B/Pocock/Picamoles etc. As good as all the English players are, only Armitage is on that next level really. Back row is certainly the least inspiring part of our squad.

Mind you, Vunipola could get there before long.

If only Braid and Burger were English. 6. Braid 7. Burger 8. Armitage 20. Vunipola. Just imagine it.

Faletau and Picamoles aren't as good as the others imo, and not entirely sure why you think Burger is the best back-rower in the prem! The guy's a monster for sure but there are more complete back-rowers in the premiership.

 

[TheSaffycen]

Faletau and Picamoles aren't as good as the others imo, and not entirely sure why you think Burger is the best back-rower in the prem! The guy's a monster for sure but there are more complete back-rowers in the premiership.

I'm not entirely sold on Faletau, to me he is a steady player who can make his tackles but isn't top class. Picamoles to me is one of the best carriers around and is an absolute monster, I think he is in the top 5 number 8's in the world. Burger is a scary mother ****er and I wish he was English, but if I could choose one player from the prem to be English I would pick Goneva.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Jaques very similar to Tom Croft in that, yes - he is ridiculously good at one skill... but the rest of his game is decidedly not international class.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Agree about Faletau...
...and agree with rats about Burger; however, in terms of impact at premiership level this would be my top list of back-rowers in the prem, with Burger included)

(no particular order and because I'm bored)

1) Francois Louw
2) Julian Salvi
3) Ashley Johnson
4) David Seymour
5) Chris Robshaw
6) Jacques Burger
7) Billy Vunipola
8) Daniel Braid
9) Nick Easter (Yes, I know..)
10) James Haskell

..Why did I do that!? I feel dirty now.

6. Johnson 7. Louw 8. Vunipola : Job's a good 'un!

*Prepares for the inevitable spectacle of Olyy running entering the room clutching a 'well-used' picture of Dave Seymour in his underpants. *

 

[ratsapprentice]

https://twitter.com/NeilBack/status/470668887114391552

Interesting.

 

[Patchey]

Lets hope Freddie listens eh?

BT just posted their Aviva team of the year, not many surprised except that Stephen Myer was names at 10. What does anyone see in him other than an older, less boshy version of Farrell?

 

[TheSaffycen]

in terms of impact at premiership level this would be my top list of back-rowers in the prem, with Burger included)

1. Manoa (even though he plays a lot of lock)
2. Haskell
3. Vunipola
4. Braid
5. Louw
6. Robshaw
7. Burger
8. Seymour
9. Johnson
10.Fearns
Players like Ewers, Wood etc. could be in there just not too sure.

Jaques very similar to Tom Croft in that, yes - he is ridiculously good at one skill... but the rest of his game is decidedly not international class.

Definitely, but I do think that his skill would be perfect for England, even more so than Armitage. Personally if I was McCall I would play Fraser at 7 with Burger at 6 as I see him as more of an blindside not really a fetcher type. Back to England though, will Croft actually get back in ? When he came back against Wales he really didn't step up and too me it showed why Robshaw is so highly regarded by England, he kept tackling and trying to get over the ball. I still believe that Fearns should have been given a shot, I think he is the best 6 England have and combined with Louw he looks really effective. I want England to try a more traditional back row with Fearns-Kveisc/Haskell-Vunipola

 

[ratsapprentice]

I do like Croft. I think he's a player who, strangely, is actually better in a Lions environment than an England one.

I wouldn't figure him in England's future, but it's obvious that Lancaster does.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

1. Manoa (even though he plays a lot of lock)
2. Haskell
3. Vunipola
4. Braid
5. Louw
6. Robshaw
7. Burger
8. Seymour
9. Johnson
10.Fearns
Players like Ewers, Wood etc. could be in there just not too sure.

Would have Salvi @ 6 imo Leicester back row is never as dangerous without him, he is the top tackler in the league and has constantly been one of the top 2 breakdown stealers in the league.