What are you listening to?

[Peat]

 

[Big Ewis]

good one. They've got way better though. Gotta love that tone they've got on those tremolo-picked riffs. Even live, that's insane. So fkn death metal (even if melodic).

 

[Big Ewis]

D'you guys remember when Linkin Park was the sound of the future ? They weren't metal, they weren't "electronic rock" (didn't really exist yet), they weren't exactly nu-metal or typical alt.rock...just such a fresh, fresh bit of sound. I remember listening to this song on loop, it was my own little place when I was a young teen
And just wtffff, where the hell did they find that chick ??!!

 

[Peat]

D'you guys remember when Linkin Park was the sound of the future ? They weren't metal, they weren't "electronic rock" (didn't really exist yet), they weren't exactly nu-metal or typical alt.rock...just such a fresh, fresh bit of sound. I remember listening to this song on loop, it was my own little place when I was a young teen
And just wtffff, where the hell did they find that chick ??!!

Hybrid Theory was one hell of an album.

good one. They've got way better though. Gotta love that tone they've got on those tremolo-picked riffs. Even live, that's insane. So fkn death metal (even if melodic).

Better? Bah. That song is money.

Anyway, something non-metal for once...

 

[Rich Taff]

Love the song, and the video is just damn freaky!
[video=youtube_share;ktvTqknDobU]http://youtu.be/ktvTqknDobU[/video]

 

[Big Ewis]

Hybrid Theory was one hell of an album.



Better? Bah. That song is money.

Once played this song twice at the same concert with my band back in the day, under request from the crowd
I don't know how they thought of that melody (main riff). Crazy simple, but so unique and powerful.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Dunno how Scandinavians do it to be honest - they have a ridiculous knack for writing melodies.

 

[Big Ewis]

Dunno how Scandinavians do it to be honest - they have a ridiculous knack for writing melodies.

I once got called Hitler on YT for making that comment. It's just in the genes, they've simply got the ability to write melodies. They suck at death metal, or anything brutal, but they've got the melodies in check better than any other one people. Like the English have produced good/great rock bands, Americans good/great rock and metal bands, but it's more song-writing in general...with the Swedes it's pure melody. When Americans try to write emotional doom metal for e.g., it sounds all Hollywood and fake as shiit. (well, shiit isn't actually a fake thing but..). And when they take Swedish influences and incorporate it into their stuff, i.e. metalcore, it sounds like melodies and music for teenagers. Compare K.S.Engage and early InFlames/ At the Gates.
So yes, it's obviously just genetic. The vikings must've been a very music-oriented people. They have a true sense of melody.

 

[Peat]

Dude, this isn't genetics. Iceland and Denmark are not great at melody. Finland, who are a whole 'nother ball game genetically, are fantastic. It's not like British and Scandinavian genetics are massively different, and between Britain (and Ireland), Scandinavia and Germany (also similar) that's a lot of white America's genetic inheritance. It just doesn't make sense.

One part of it is, I think, education. I remember reading that a lot of Norwegians go to music school very early and are in bands from 13-14. Not sure that's true, but it wouldn't surprise me.

A larger part is cultural identity. The death metal bands that made it big in Sweden and Finland had a great sense of melody (and obvious huge Iron Maiden influences). People copy local success, it's just a thing. American metalheads looked at their big local bands and they got guys like Slayer and Morbid Angel. Britain, we had Black Sabbath, which helps account for the large amount of doomy sludge we've put out them. And so on. Lets not forget there were a lot of Scandinavian bands in the early Death Metal scene... guys like Entombed, Dismember, Convulse. Just it never made as much of an impact as AtG, DT, Amorphis... I'm rabbiting on now. But I feel very sure its cultural and not genetic.

And while Death in Flames may have a catchier main melody, it's still not as good a song. Last with Pagan Blood builds to an amazing climax, Death in Flames is cool but... give me Where Silent Gods Stand Guard or Thousand Years of Oppression off that album.

I'd also like to credit Sweden for putting out some of the most psychologically damaged stuff out there. Shining and Silencer, I'm looking at you. Brutal... I don't think you'd call it that... but there's more of a darkness to it. That's what I look for.

... maybe we should set up our own thread for the metalheads and stop taking over this one...

 

[Big Ewis]

I completely disagree with all of that. Saying something like "It's not like British and Scandinavian genetics are massively different" is such a strange, unserious statement...you can't start talking genetics with such an oddly approximate notion...but this isn't the place for this discussion. I say it's genetics, and it's very obvious to me. Anyways, Amon Amarth have put out a TON of really original melodies throughout the years. Not interested in anything past "Fate of Norns" personally, but here's a brilliant oldie:



Main riff (0:29) is unbelievable. Could not think of anything more grande/epic and mature musically.

 

[ratsapprentice]

I completely disagree with all of that. Saying something like "It's not like British and Scandinavian genetics are massively different" is such a strange, unserious statement...

Are you unaware of historic immigration to/from the British Isles?

Also... it's definitely not genetic.
It's definitely cultural.

 

[Big Ewis]

Are you unaware of historic immigration to/from the British Isles?

Also... it's definitely not genetic.
It's definitely cultural.

fully aware. But that's genetic information blended with another. Romans and Gallo-Romans or Gallo-Romans mixed with Frankish or French people today aren't all the same and have all displayed very different cultural traits. And I make the argument genes are the basis of everything, and a great deal of culture comes from genes. But anyways, you like the song Amon Amarth ?

 

[ratsapprentice]

Music is cultural - if I (as an English person) was born and raised in India, I would not have any inherent skill or understanding of music from a western point of view.
You could not be any more wrong about this - it's not subjective - it's pseudoscience.

But yes - I like Amon Amarth... even if I don't listen to them much.

 

[Big Ewis]

alright so I guess we are talking about this but briefly. There's tons to be said, so let's really make an effort to get to a point of agreement quickly. Where do you feel culture comes from, though ? If you say *just environment* like many ppl have, then I'm calling this a day. But if you have more to offer, I'm all ears (well, eyes...). Where does culture come from, if not from genetics in majority + environment a little bit ?

 

[Draggs]

A larger part is cultural identity. The death metal bands that made it big in Sweden and Finland had a great sense of melody (and obvious huge Iron Maiden influences). People copy local success, it's just a thing. American metalheads looked at their big local bands and they got guys like Slayer and Morbid Angel. Britain, we had Black Sabbath, which helps account for the large amount of doomy sludge we've put out them. And so on. Lets not forget there were a lot of Scandinavian bands in the early Death Metal scene... guys like Entombed, Dismember, Convulse. Just it never made as much of an impact as AtG, DT, Amorphis... I'm rabbiting on now. But I feel very sure its cultural and not genetic.

The notion that it is any except cultural is bizarre. Being able to write metal melodies for only some genres is no where near genetic. Europeans (and humans in general) are very very very close genetically, there aren't huge differences. Anything more and it would be a different species. Everything come down to culture.

Let's drop the Hitler hyperbole, as soon as it is brought up, every bit of sense drops from the discussion.

 

[ratsapprentice]

alright so I guess we are talking about this but briefly. There's tons to be said, so let's really make an effort to get to a point of agreement quickly. Where do you feel culture comes from, though ? If you say *just environment* like many ppl have, then I'm calling this a day. But if you have more to offer, I'm all ears (well, eyes...). Where does culture come from, if not from genetics in majority + environment a little bit ?

Frankly, your understanding of genetics is almost as worryingly poor as Hitler's.
Culture is inherently totally environmental.
By your logic I am born with the ability to speak English.

It's honestly a little embarrassing that you're taking such a firm stance on this!

 

[Big Ewis]

ah, I see, it's going to be this kind of debate. Your replies procure the same reaction out of me, but this isn't going anywhere so I'm not going to start insulting your stance on this myself. Back to talking music.

 

[ratsapprentice]

What sort of debate...?
The one where someone makes a totally outlandish and erroneous statement regarding the fundamentals of a particular science without any grounding in fact and is dismissive when they are challenged?

Yes - that's exactly what it is.

Sorry dude, you can't make such wild statements and expect no-one to call you out on it!

What you've said is about as stupid as the old "if evolution exists: how come there are still apes?" question.

 

[goodNumber10]

Well, baw sacks to this Death Metal stuff, i've been blasting this for the last hour:

[video=youtube_share;WwcqRVpsvd0]http://youtu.be/WwcqRVpsvd0[/video]

 

[goodNumber10]

and this:

[video=youtube_share;aynV4UOU-As]http://youtu.be/aynV4UOU-As[/video]