(Very) early thoughts on the 2017 Lions

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Halfpenny should be lucky to make the tour IMO.

 

[AzaMatt]

Halfpenny should be lucky to make the tour IMO.

to be fair he is the arguably the best kicker we have in the NH. i would much prefer an attacking fullback but he is solid in defence and can kick the points from mostly anywhere (im sure the last game for toulon was a blip).

 

[ALJ]

to be fair he is the arguably the best kicker we have in the NH. i would much prefer an attacking fullback but he is solid in defence and can kick the points from mostly anywhere (im sure the last game for toulon was a blip).

I know there's precedent with Jenkins back in '97 but given the options available, do we need to lose the potential that someone like Hogg provides in attack for the sake of Halfpenny's kicking?

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

to be fair he is the arguably the best kicker we have in the NH. i would much prefer an attacking fullback but he is solid in defence and can kick the points from mostly anywhere (im sure the last game for toulon was a blip).

Is that true anymore? He's had a few games since returning where his kicking's been pretty iffy. It's certainly not the weapon it used to be and I don't think warrants his selection over Hogg or Williams. I thought the best kicker in the world ATM was decidedly Faz. What's Russell's kicking like?

 

[AzaMatt]

Is that true anymore? He's had a few games since returning where his kicking's been pretty iffy. It's certainly not the weapon it used to be and I don't think warrants his selection over Hogg or Williams. I thought the best kicker in the world ATM was decidedly Faz. What's Russell's kicking like?

he did miss a couple in the autumn which is not like him, although im sure he'll regain his kicking prowess over the next few months. faz has 23 out of 30 kicks this year for england and halfpenny has 18 out of 22 for wales, so not alot of difference to be honest. even if we take kicking out of the equation i think for his defencive work halfpenny will get the nod, cant think of anyone else id rather have as the last line of defence (maybe slight bias but still haha)

for the record i do prefer williams at full back attacking wise but a lions backline is not going to be lacking in attack anyways

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

We're not going to beat new zealand by sacrificing our ability to counter from the back three in exchange for the most marginal, possibility non-existent gains in kicking percentage you would get from selecting Halfpenny over someone like Farrell for the kicking. Halfpennys form hasn't been good enough to merit a start, and he ain't a squad player so no way is he on the bench.

When you bear in mind Gatlands preferences, if current form continues I think it extremely likely Farrell will play 12. I'm not saying it's what I'd do, but right now I think it's happening. In that case, zero need for 1/2p

Currently think we're looking at a straight shoot out between Williams and Hogg at 15 bearing in mind the indifferent form of everyone else in the world. But with Williams able to play wing you may just find Gatland going for Hogg.

9) Murray
10) Sexton
11) Watson
12) Farrell
13) Joseph
14) Williams
15) Hogg

Only change I'd make would be Henshaw in. I'd love to see Daly make it as a bench option. Given more experience and caps, I'd be inclined to pick Daly over Williams but I'd br going with Williams' slightly greater experience out of position for the moment.

Bear in mind the script will be entirely torn up when Wales magically win the six nations and suddenly Gatland has a reason to pick Roberts, Halfpenny and co.

 

[Peat]

Can't say I've seen Gatland play a 12 like Farrell in a long, long time...

Also, Halfpenny's extra 10 yards of range is a pretty huge boost over Farrell for me. Would need to find his best form again but in it, he's the best goal kicker in the world with no question.

But I'd probably rather just trust Sexton and play neither.

 

[ALJ]

I wouldn't complain if Williams as at FB but we have better options for the wings imho.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Can't say I've seen Gatland play a 12 like Farrell in a long, long time...

Also, Halfpenny's extra 10 yards of range is a pretty huge boost over Farrell for me. Would need to find his best form again but in it, he's the best goal kicker in the world with no question.

But I'd probably rather just trust Sexton and play neither.

9) Murray
10) Sexton
11) Watson
12) Henshaw (best 12 in NH prob in top 2 12's in the world IMO)
13) JJ
14) Williams
15) Hogg

21) Youngs
22) Farrell
23) Huw Jones

To me that could do the job IMO.

 

[munstermuffin]

Interesting debate on Sexton having to prove he has fitness and form for Lions.
Yes he has talent and is proven but the injury lingers and is it a risk putting hopes on him if cloud still over his condition.

 

[anderton46]

I don't see how anyone (especially Welsh fans) could think Halfpenny deserves to start over Liam Williams.

Liam has been one of best attacking performers for a long time now and has no real defensive issues either. Better under the high ball as well.

Hogg is a dilemma, as he's also very good attacking but perhaps not as sound defensively.

 

[Saint4805]

Can't say I've seen Gatland play a 12 like Farrell in a long, long time...

Also, Halfpenny's extra 10 yards of range is a pretty huge boost over Farrell for me. Would need to find his best form again but in it, he's the best goal kicker in the world with no question.

But I'd probably rather just trust Sexton and play neither.

I'm sure Hogg was taking kicks when he played 10 in the last Lions tour. Not quite as accurate Faz or 1/2P but he has a monster boot and is an option for those longer kicks outside Sexton's range.

With Farrell's Dad on the coaching team I think JJ might be the one to lose out. They could go for Faz at 12 and Henshaw at 13.

 

[Peat]

I'm sure Hogg was taking kicks when he played 10 in the last Lions tour. Not quite as accurate Faz or 1/2P but he has a monster boot and is an option for those longer kicks outside Sexton's range.

With Farrell's Dad on the coaching team I think JJ might be the one to lose out. They could go for Faz at 12 and Henshaw at 13.

They could but that would be a mistake.

And Hogg can take those kicks but he doesn't inspire quite the same respect as Halfpenny. Hogg may punish you from range. Halfpenny will punish you.

 

[AzaMatt]

the counter attack would be glorious with hogg and williams in he back line

 

[Lé Ddanno]

Leaving JJ would sum up every fear I have about the selection/coaching setup. I'd find it darkly humorous, however.

 

[corny]

It begs the question...Does anyone think Gatland will actually pick a decent team mostly free of bias? I mean there's broad consensus with most people here on selection. We have our national favourites of course but there's nothing egregious in making a call either way on Farrell/Henshaw, Nel/Cole/Furlong, Williams/Hogg etc. On a given day they can as good as the alternative. Picking say Lydiate at 6 or Davies at 13 is just not on by contrast.

FWIW i think Wales are gonna do alright in the 6N's. They'll beat one of England or Ireland at home and they won't lose badly in any game. On the back of decent form (not stellar) i think Gatland is gonna load up the team with lads he's familiar with.

 

[Peat]

It begs the question...Does anyone think Gatland will actually pick a decent team mostly free of bias? I mean there's broad consensus with most people here on selection. We have our national favourites of course but there's nothing egregious in making a call either way on Farrell/Henshaw, Nel/Cole/Furlong, Williams/Hogg etc. On a given day they can as good as the alternative. Picking say Lydiate at 6 or Davies at 13 is just not on by contrast.

FWIW i think Wales are gonna do alright in the 6N's. They'll beat one of England or Ireland at home and they won't lose badly in any game. On the back of decent form (not stellar) i think Gatland is gonna load up the team with lads he's familiar with.

Yes. He did last time. It was a decent team and while there was probably some bias, there weren't huge amounts. Not like all the bias was pro-Welsh either, a different scrum coach than Rowntree and Vunipola and Stevens possibly and probably don't tour that time round.

Whether he can do the same when ability dictates such a scant amount of Welshmen (also form, but that can change) is another question. Although I'm not opposed to Jiffy jnr at 13 if he finds his form. Certainly I'm less opposed to that than I am anyone but Henshaw and Furlong at 12 and 3 respectively. At least Davies has shown he can be around Joseph's level. I guess the case for Farrell vs Henshaw depends on what you want most from your 12 but ever since Furlong proved he could scrum at this level, that's been a no-brainer.

If he starts considering Lydiate I'll lose a bit of that trust mind.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Lydiate more than likely out of Lions tour with ACL.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Yes. He did last time. It was a decent team and while there was probably some bias, there weren't huge amounts. Not like all the bias was pro-Welsh either, a different scrum coach than Rowntree and Vunipola and Stevens possibly and probably don't tour that time round.

Whether he can do the same when ability dictates such a scant amount of Welshmen (also form, but that can change) is another question. Although I'm not opposed to Jiffy jnr at 13 if he finds his form. Certainly I'm less opposed to that than I am anyone but Henshaw and Furlong at 12 and 3 respectively. At least Davies has shown he can be around Joseph's level. I guess the case for Farrell vs Henshaw depends on what you want most from your 12 but ever since Furlong proved he could scrum at this level, that's been a no-brainer.

If he starts considering Lydiate I'll lose a bit of that trust mind.

Not to pick at this but I don't think Davies has ever been at JJs level. He just doesn't have half the skill set that JJ does.

I genuinely think JJ is the best 13 in the NH, he reads a game so well, has great all round footballing skills and is a brilliant defensive leader and tackler.

Yours sincerely

Papa JJ

 

[welshglory]

I'd like to see JJ run some more direct lines. He tends to devour the outside ark but usually can't find space at international level unless there's an overlap or he's chasing a chip/grubber. I reckon he could be lethal like Fofana with his pace and step if he varied his approach. I'd definitely be in favour of a Henshaw/JJ pairing then