RWC Quarter Final: England - France (08-10-2011, 20:30)

[j'nuh]

To add something else: England fans are going to feel really dejected by this. There are a lot of things that the general fan would have done, which MJ didn't do, which led partially to England's downfall. I started losing faith in MJ a while ago, then he brought Ashton, Foden, Youngs, Lawes etc. into the squad, rejecting those he was faithful to and I thought he was improving as a coach - both in his selections and in his management of tactics.

More worryingly though, not only are the selections wrong, but it seems as if the players that originally came into the England squad have had a lot of their talent coached out of them. What happened to the marauding Foden, who'd counterattack in an instant? The Ashton that, when there was no work, would come in-field and make himself important? The Lawes who was described as a "workhorse"? Even before that, Armitage was one of our best players ~2009. Youngs who was brought in to speed up delivery? Croft? Geraghty? Monye? Flutey? After being dropped from England some players eg, Armitage, Care, Haskell etc. would go to their clubs and improve, but what happened to their international counterparts?

I'm finding it hard to trust MJ with the next generation, to be honest.

Aside: A Robshaw/Haskell/Wood with Ben Morgan (if you're reading, please choose us?) on the bench would be something to get excited about for the six nations.

 

[dullonien]

Aside: A Robshaw/Haskell/Wood with Ben Morgan (if you're reading, please choose us?) on the bench would be something to get excited about for the six nations.

Unless he feels a true allegience to England, I think he may well pick Wales. He's more likely to get genuine gametime for Wales (even though Faletau has emerged), as Gatland has already come out to say how good a player he thinks he is. Morgan also turned down the Saxons, and I think that may well say quite alot about which way he may go. Finally, he could become part of something special with Wales over the next decade or so, possibly not so much with England.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Aye, I'd be incredibly surprised if Morgan didn't go for Wales now

We've got Fearns anyway, and they're similar players, so it's all good

 

[j-dawg]

New plan. We bring in Worsley and Borthwick.

 

[SelimNiai]

New plan. We bring in Worsley and Borthwick.

5 quid says Johnson has already considered that one

 

[j'nuh]

Unless he feels a true allegience to England, I think he may well pick Wales. He's more likely to get genuine gametime for Wales (even though Faletau has emerged), as Gatland has already come out to say how good a player he thinks he is. Morgan also turned down the Saxons, and I think that may well say quite alot about which way he may go. Finally, he could become part of something special with Wales over the next decade or so, possibly not so much with England.

No. 8 is quite a problem position for England really, from what I can tell. Easter too old/not good enough, Waldrom relatively old and not a long-term solution, Crane injured for the next season and will have to play a lot more rugby when he gets back, and we're left with Haskell and Narraway, as far as I'm aware? (And Fearns, thanks Olyy.) Haskell can play anywhere across the backrow so might end up filling out 6/7 (especially if Wood doesn't claim the 7 spot for himself). Anyway, I'm certain Ben Morgan would get time with England. But I know - somehow I can tell he's going to pick Wales. God, a Lydiate-Faletau-Warburton-Morgan-Jones-Tipuric-etc. backrow... has a lot of depth. Haha. Credit, I guess.

New plan. We bring in Worsley and Borthwick.

Everyone dreams of reuniting 11. Vainikolo 15. Balshaw 14. Sackey

 

[j-dawg]

Now here me out here; 6. Haskell 7. Wood 8. Me

Sounds reasonable?

 

[JW.]

6. Tim Payne? Saw u liked him before ;p

 

[j-dawg]

Tim 'the power' Payne will take up his throne at the seat of flyhalf for now

 

[JW.]

Tim 'the power' Payne will take up his throne at the seat of flyhalf for now

Makes sense.

 

[j-dawg]

Makes sense.

Who needs sense when you have Payne and Borthwick?

 

[SelimNiai]

Are you two drunk?

 

[JW.]

Who needs sense when you have Payne and Borthwick?

Don't forget Worsley!

Are you two drunk?

Just high on this mornings victory?

 

[j-dawg]

yeah im high...on 'victory' as the kids call it nowadays

 

[j'nuh]

Just high on this mornings victory?

I genuinely find it hilarious. That what we saw this morning was 4 years of development of some quite talented players. What I find the best is that Banahan started out as a lock, then he was a winger, then an outside center, and after all that, he gets put at 12 because the only other 12 left in the squad was dropped for having one of his better games in an England shirt in the pools.

 

[smartcooky]

Well...I warned my flatmate that this was likely to happen... his exact words were 'ah France wont be too much trouble for us, they lost to Tonga!' Nothing is more dangerous that a French side that is has been and is expected to be **** imo, can never predict which France will turn up! Didn't manage to get up for this match (or the Wales v Ireland one either) so gonna reserve any proper judgement and predictions for the semis till I've watched both!
Well done France anyway!

The standard answer for that type of comment is

Twickenham, 31 October 1999
Cardiff, 6 October 2007

and you could probably add

Concord Oval, 13 June 1987

for the Aussies

 

[GreenMask]

Congratulations France!


... you're going to get destroyed by Wales.

Are you sure ?
Pray for it little kiwi. If not, you're surely cry... We beat you only when it's really important
Bouhaha...

 

[Shaggy]

Are you sure ?
Pray for it little kiwi. If not, you're surely cry... We beat you only when it's really important
Bouhaha...

Well done France, but they will have to step up again in intensity to beat Wales ... Wales are in awesome form at the moment.

 

[gingergenius]

Agree with the people saying the national team structure is rotten to the core.

It starts with the RFU, who seem to be the same corrupt old boys' club they've always been. But its their appointment of personnel that's been shocking.

Martin Johnson, you are the finest lock forward this country's ever produced. You are not the finest manager. 3 years is more than enough to build a team, but it wasn't until last year's summer tour that the stars of England's future were coming into place. As I and others highlighted when the EPS was announced, and later when the final 30 was announced, they were imbalanced squads with some glaring omissions. And even into this world cup your selections have been conservative to say the least.

Coaching has not helped. I don't know what Brian Smith thinks he's being paid for, seeing as England never ever look like a side who can score a try at will when the pressure's on. Defensively there is room for improvement, as does England's kicking game. But most importantly is lineouts, which as set piece plays are fundamental to England's game plan. We cannot keep losing them. Rowntree's doing a decent job with the scrum.

And someone, somewhere, including the players has to explain why the French looked like they wanted it more than we did. That is embarrassing. In fact, of today's performances I thought Easter, Flood and Tuilagi were working their ******** off for the team, but where was everyone else?

Player wise, it's simple. Thanks for your services, but the old guard can be put out to pasture NOW. The England setup has a lot off classy players left around whom to build a squad, and can we please start picking people based on how well they play in the Premiership!!! Most urgent seem to me to be an openside, 8, another 10 and a 12. But whoever sticks their hands up should be quickly integrated.

One more thing - to the guys like Youngs, Lawes and Croft, they need to realise that the RWC is the biggest stage and there is no excuse for going missing there. We've got plenty of young talent, but why is it that the Welsh, Kiwis and Aussies continually pick people just out of school who look like class players every time, and the English produce inconsistency of the highest degree. Again, coaching is probably a major factor.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

BBC Reporting:
[h=4]RUGBY UNION:[/h]
England head coach Martin Johnson to hold press conference in Auckland at 2300 BST