RWC: Argentina - England (10-09-2011, 20:30)

[Darwin]

This is not the team of 2007 and altough i agree Argentina's forwards are potentialy very physical. However they are also largely older and largely less conditioned then their english counter parts and so argentina will not be able to match england into the second half IMO, Argentina also dont have the strength in depth that england have. (they cant match the bench quality of Shaw, Easter/Haskell, Stevens etc off the bench) (Argentina's poor conditioning/older players) will also mean they will be forced to use their weaker bench (you dont see 38 year old hookers playing 80 mins of international rugby very often) In Conclusion i agree Argentina probably will be able to match england physicality but for nothing like 80 mins

Yeah I think it will be interesting to see how the game goes when the teams start using their benches with 20-30 mins left. Argentina are likely to go with a 5/2 split on their bench (with three front-rowers) so will certainly have plenty of cover for their ageing front-row. Though their bench players are probably not as good as their starters, I don't think the Argentina bench is that weak - I agree England has an advantage here, but not by a huge amount in my opinion.

 

[Seaton]

Please let this be a draw, how great that would be...

Mon the Argies if a team were to win

 

[beerholder]

I really don't see any contest. England will want to gain confidence and momentum to get to the final so they'll try to be as convincing as possible.

 

[ExcaLiBuR]

England to beat Argentina by 7+ points, being a close game at start then England just take over and win

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

Argentina is used to the climate, only have to travel a couple of hours and they have enough quality players to beat the Poms. Lets hope they do

 

[InsaneAsylum]

I'm going with Argentina.. gut feeling

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Argentina is used to the climate, only have to travel a couple of hours and they have enough quality players to beat the Poms. Lets hope they do

Weather in Dunedin: Rain and 10deg high
Weather in London: Rain and 13deg
Weather in Buenos Aires: Sunshine and 20deg


I think England have the climate advantage

 

[Peat]

Think this will be nervy and ugly imo. Too many key players for England feeling their way back.

 

[McTallshort]

I expect the team to be:

1. Sheridan
2. Thompson
3. Cole
4. Lawes
5. Palmer
6. Croft
7. Moody (c)
8. Haskell (though I wouldn't be surprised to see Easter)
9. Wigglesworth*
10. Wilkinson
11. Cueto
12. Tindall
13. Tuilagi
14. Ashton
15. Foden

16. Hartley
17. Stevens
18. Shaw
19. Wood (Haskell if he doesn't start)
20. Youngs*
21. Flood
22. Armitage


*Not sure who will start out of Wigglesworth and Youngs - depends how fit they think Youngs will be after missing so much through recovering from his knee injury. He'll feature, but I don't know whether it'll be from the bench


You should be in for a good match - Ashton and Tuilagi will be looking to get some tries, and Wilko is bound to try a dropgoal or two, I can't remember a match where he hasn't

Second row will be Deacon or Shaw with Lawes. There is a need to have a meat head in the second row against Argentina and I think MJ will go with Deacon

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Deacon's considered a lineout guy though, isn't he?

I get the impression that Lawes/Shaw are interchangeable (in Johnson's eyes) and Deacon/Palmer are

 

[eot345]

Argentina is used to the climate, only have to travel a couple of hours and they have enough quality players to beat the Poms. Lets hope they do

How many of the argentina squad would make it into the england squad

 

[McTallshort]

My understanding is Deacon and Shaw meat heads (enforcer types) but both can function in the line well enough and Palmer and Lawes are the Athletic guys with the high tackle counts. Personally and I know I will get grief for this but I think Lawes is behind Palmer and I think he should start with Deacon.

 

[eot345]

WHAT, lawes is head and shoulders above the others followed by palmer. As far as being muscle in mauls, scrums, and taking slow ball i think shaw is the best... for 40 mins

 

[Seaton]

How many of the argentina squad would make it into the england squad

I know it's football, but it involves the English, a world cup and a perceives under dog (by the English of course)

"No player on this Germany team would make England's XI"- Some English commentator for the 2010 World Cup.

Germany played England, what was the score again? 4-1, you say?

No Scottish player would have started for SA, closest Richie Gray, yet Scotland beat SA last time round.

You get where I am going?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Eww, why are people discussing wendyball in a real sports thread?

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

How many of the argentina squad would make it into the england squad

The front row. Lobbe or Leguizamon, Felipe contipomi I'd still have him ahead of Flood and Fernandez ahead of Hape. To name but a few.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Would love Lobbe at 8!

 

[McTallshort]

WHAT, lawes is head and shoulders above the others followed by palmer. As far as being muscle in mauls, scrums, and taking slow ball i think shaw is the best... for 40 mins

Not on recent form he isnt, he was poor in my opinion against Ireland and I would go for Palmer and Deacon for the first game and get Laws back up to match fitness for Georgia and Romania ready for Scotland and hopefully the knockout stages

 

[ZeFrenchy]

Argentina is used to the climate, only have to travel a couple of hours and they have enough quality players to beat the Poms. Lets hope they do

The Buenos Aires-Auckland flight is about 14 hours, but I'm not sure I get what you mean...

On the physicallity, I don't think the Argentine pack will have any issues. The only position in which they may have problems is at hooker, because Ledesma will not last 80 min and Creevy is a huge step down. Albacete, Leguizamón, Ayerza, Fernández Lobbe, Galindo and Carizza are rather young (ish), and I don't think their conditioning is a problem (they've been training together for around two months now).
However, the lack of size in the Argentine centres will be too much of an advantage for England. Plus, Contepomi can't play 10 and can't kick. I'd say two phases of midfield ball and then out wide and Argentina won't be able to defend. The problem is that it is not often that we see England playing like this.

 

[gingergenius]

I would hope that Argentina have given us enough warnings in recent years for no England fan to take them lightly. The level they play at, considering their amateur domestic game and a 1st XV drawing players from around the world, is incredible. Given that it's a world cup, they will have more time to gel and should be stronger for it. Not to be underestimated.

That said, this England team should be able to beat them. England are neither a great side nor a bad side, but I think they have enough to win every pool game. Argentina, it must be remembered, will be without key players like Hernandez, while talismans like Pichot are yet to be properly replaced. I don't see Argentina setting this world cup alight as they did in 2007 - hopefully come 2015 after 4 years in the 3N, they'll be a permanently top-class team.