Lions Squad: 2009

[An Tarbh]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Count of Devonshire @ Apr 21 2009, 05:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Shaw and Vickery provide almost as much natural strength and beef as the rest of the team put together, plus have all the experience of regularly playing (and beating!) the Boks. I expect at least one of them to be a midweeker and the other to be a sub/subbed, but both chaps are in there because they offer attributes no other player available has.[/b]

yeah both are over the hill penalty machines, priceless attributes for a Lions tour!

 

[tomrugbyking10]

Yeah i do see what your saying, i was at the Cardiff v Gloucester game at the weekend and he was a joy to behold. The only thing i am skeptical about is inexperience but i do think he should start in one of the tests if he plays well in a few midweek games.

As for Simon Shaw and Phil Vickery............MCGEECHAN WHAT HAVE YOU BEEN SMOKING?!?!?

Personally i would not have taken Harry Ellis, maybe Paul Hodgson instead?

One omission that truly shocked me was that of Ryan Jones. I am speechless.

> 2009 Lions tour to South Africa

 

[Count of Devonshire]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thingimubob @ Apr 21 2009, 04:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Ah yeah I forgot about Armitage and Kennedy. I would have picked Kennedy ahead of Shaw anyday, and I'd have prefered Armitage to Monye, because he showed more consistent form for me, and is a goal kicking option.[/b]

Kennedy vs Shaw is an interesting debate because they're not really comparable. They'd probably work in a partnership together, but I wouldn't see them as direct competition to one another. One's a excellent jumper, the other is an absolute brute. I'd personally have picked them both ahead of AW Jones, who doesn't really seem to specialise in either role that well (much like Borthwick).

The chap Armitage ought to have made the squad ahead of the Irish fullback, who didn't perform well all 6N-regardless of instruction.

 

[monkeypigeon]

In relation to the lack of a Croft, I thought he was certain to travel. But he's quite similar to Ferris. They're both lineout options. They're both quick and strong. They do great work taking people out of a ruck.

Whereas Quinlan is a dirty f***er who steals things on thr ground and annoys the **** out of everyone! He's different!

 

[tomrugbyking10]

I agree that yes Shaw is a brute, one who gave away so so many penalties during the 6N. In a way it is competition between the two as the would both ultimately be back up to POC and DOC who will always start ahead of either Shaw or Kennedy in the test squad.
I just really cant believe Armitage wasnt picked, he's been immense for LI and Eng. Ah well, their loss

 

[Thingimubob]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Count of Devonshire @ Apr 21 2009, 05:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thingimubob @ Apr 21 2009, 04:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ah yeah I forgot about Armitage and Kennedy. I would have picked Kennedy ahead of Shaw anyday, and I'd have prefered Armitage to Monye, because he showed more consistent form for me, and is a goal kicking option.[/b]

Kennedy vs Shaw is an interesting debate because they're not really comparable. They'd probably work in a partnership together, but I wouldn't see them as direct competition to one another. One's a excellent jumper, the other is an absolute brute. I'd personally have picked them both ahead of AW Jones, who doesn't really seem to specialise in either role that well (much like Borthwick).

The chap Armitage ought to have made the squad ahead of the Irish fullback, who didn't perform well all 6N-regardless of instruction.
[/b][/quote]

So AWJ goes backwards 8/10 he goes into contact, adn can't catch the ball in the line-out? :huh: Ok, are we talking about the same player here? AWJ great in the line out, and he should excel with a decent hooker (something Wales are short of) and isn't exactly weak in the tackle (he is one of those players, very much like Gethin Jenkins and Thierry Dusatoir, who's always there in defence). No way should he be left out behind Shaw, who's over the hilla nd gives away too many penalties. For that matter, Kennedy is the same too.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Monkeypigeon @ Apr 21 2009, 05:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

In relation to the lack of a Croft, I thought he was certain to travel. But he's quite similar to Ferris. They're both lineout options. They're both quick and strong. They do great work taking people out of a ruck.

Whereas Quinlan is a dirty f***er who steals things on thr ground and annoys the **** out of everyone! He's different![/b]

That's the reason I'm very glad that Quinlan is going, we have at least 2 of those types of players (Martyn Williams is superb at the dirty stuff too), so I'm really looking forward to seeing them go head to head with South African back rowers (maybe an American too if Clever plays )

and tomrugbyking, I wouldn;t worry too much, if Armitage keeps improving at this rate, he should have plenty of future tours ahead of him.

 

[Sir Speedy]

Canada? Oh come on now... Has he been tested properly outside the depth of brilliance that is Munster or against a good international side?

He has the warm-ups to prove me wrong I suppose.

And what the **** is so shocking about Ryan Jones' omission? He's been **** at all levels all year, simple as that. As for suggesting Paul Hodgson at nine... Please don't let club bias delude you.

 

[shazbooger]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Meh @ Apr 21 2009, 05:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Quinlan? Come on...[/b]

The very same Quinlan that had R Jones in his pocket a week or so ago. The same Quinlan that is keeping Leamy on the bench while playing for argueably the best club side in Europe (the world maybe?).

I agree it was an eyebrow raiser for me, but he's an animal on the pitch and in top form.

Same goes for Earls

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Sir. Speedy @ Apr 21 2009, 05:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Has he been tested properly outside the depth of brilliance that is Munster or against a good international side? He has the warm-ups to prove me wrong I suppose.[/b]

Your right there is definately a question mark, but no more so then there is over Halfpenny. Both young, both exciting, both being given a chance to play their way into the side and prove their worth. You just dont know how it will all work out but it'll be exciting viewing.

 

[tomrugbyking10]

it was a joke my friend, although he is a good 9.

 

[An Tarbh]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Sir. Speedy @ Apr 21 2009, 05:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Canada? Oh come on now... Has he been tested properly outside the depth of brilliance that is Munster or against a good international side?

He has the warm-ups to prove me wrong I suppose.

And what the **** is so shocking about Ryan Jones' omission? He's been **** at all levels all year, simple as that. As for suggesting Paul Hodgson at nine... Please don't let club bias delude you.[/b]

so has Powell and Jones is less of a one trick pony than he is, that would be my issue which is why I'd have gone for Leamy ahead of both of them.

 

[Sir Speedy]

Powell has performed at club level this year though.

Jones has been generally rubbish.

And I think it's unfair to label Powell a 'one-trick pony'. I'd call it Gatland overusing him and Roberts in the 6N's. Saying this, shouldn't Roberts be a one-trick pony also, given how ineffective he was towards the end of the tournament?

No, I think Powell can be a useful player if used correctly, rather than all the time; same goes for Roberts.

 

[Prestwick]

To be brutally honest, Roberts was officially ineffective after 70 minutes against Scotland...

 

[An Tarbh]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Sir. Speedy @ Apr 21 2009, 06:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Powell has performed at club level this year though.

Jones has been generally rubbish.

And I think it's unfair to label Powell a 'one-trick pony'. I'd call it Gatland overusing him and Roberts in the 6N's. Saying this, shouldn't Roberts be a one-trick pony also, given how ineffective he was towards the end of the tournament?

No, I think Powell can be a useful player if used correctly, rather than all the time; same goes for Roberts.[/b]

well he is a bit which is why Flutey has the edge for inside centre at the moment, don't think picking the 2 best centres out of 5 is the way forward. It'll be interesting to see how Earls is used on tour.

 

[monkeypigeon]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Sir. Speedy @ Apr 21 2009, 06:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Powell has performed at club level this year though.

Jones has been generally rubbish.

And I think it's unfair to label Powell a 'one-trick pony'. I'd call it Gatland overusing him and Roberts in the 6N's. Saying this, shouldn't Roberts be a one-trick pony also, given how ineffective he was towards the end of the tournament?

No, I think Powell can be a useful player if used correctly, rather than all the time; same goes for Roberts.[/b]

So what are you saying? Powell's one trick should be used less often so it's more of a surprise? Heaslip can crash ball too....but he does other stuff, Powell doesn't.

Therefore Powell = One trick Pony!


Roberts has more to his game though, I think he was just used wrongly. same goes for Kearney, never got the chance to show his full game during the 6 Nations.

 

[MunsterMan]

Earls played 15 minutes or so against the All Blacks, and as far as I remember himself and David Wallace were the only players to make a line break that day (even if the cnuts won a turn over at the next breakdown). He had terrible timing with his pre-six nations injury, but he undoubtedly has the talent and skills to excel in SA. One of the fastest players in the squad, will take to the hard surfaces like a duck to water.

Delighted to see Quinlan there is well, to use a local expression, he is one of the cutest hoors ever to take to a rugby pitch in the last decade. he is the type of player who likes to outsmart the opposition and force them in to giving away penalties, whether by winding them up or by reacting quicker than anybody else when an opportunity presents itself. using the rules to his advantage, like the quick 22 drop out in the HEC final last year that bought Munster a penalty and allowed them to have possession in the Toulouse half.

Delon Armitage, Thom Evans, Mike Blair, Denis Leamy, Tom Croft, Ryan Jones, Rory Best and Marcus Horan are all unlucky IMO.

 

[Sir Speedy]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Prestwick @ Apr 21 2009, 06:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

To be brutally honest, Roberts was officially ineffective after 70 minutes against Scotland...[/b]

Are there any openings for jobs at the 'Official Police' headquarters? I'm in grave need of some dough.

 

[shazbooger]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MunsterMan @ Apr 21 2009, 06:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

(Quinlan) he is one of the cutest hoors ever to take to a rugby pitch in the last decade. he is the type of player who likes to outsmart the opposition and force them in to giving away penalties, whether by winding them up or by reacting quicker than anybody else when an opportunity presents itself.[/b]

Or throw a punch, stamp or something else that gets him a yellow card in between getting repeatedly pinged for mickey mouse offenses. Thats the beauty with Quinlan, you never know how its going to go

 

[An Tarbh]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Logorrhea @ Apr 21 2009, 06:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MunsterMan @ Apr 21 2009, 06:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

(Quinlan) he is one of the cutest hoors ever to take to a rugby pitch in the last decade. he is the type of player who likes to outsmart the opposition and force them in to giving away penalties, whether by winding them up or by reacting quicker than anybody else when an opportunity presents itself.[/b]

Or throw a punch, stamp or something else that gets him a yellow card in between getting repeatedly pinged for mickey mouse offenses. Thats the beauty with Quinlan, you never know how its going to go
[/b][/quote]

gets away with murder for Munster but refs keep more of an eye on him at international level which is why he'll probably feature in the midweek side where he can get up to his usual shenanigans.

 

[mohamed_ali12]

im pretty happy with the squad all round. surprised that powell was included, and croft, armitage and jones excluded, but all in all looks like a very decent sqaud.

 

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I dont get why theyve only picked 2 fly halves. I think it was during one of the matches between England and NZ where england only had 2 fly halves (Flood and Hodgson) and both got injured in one match !!!! so it seems to me that picking only 2 fly halves for an entire tour is a bit hmmm