Lions Squad: 2009

[Cymro]

AWJ will start with POC most likely DOC for me is an impact sub off the bench

And no Shaw has preformed and not always got the praise because he is seen as a penalty machine!

 

[An Tarbh]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Cymro @ Apr 21 2009, 03:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

AWJ will start with POC most likely DOC for me is an impact sub off the bench

And no Shaw has preformed and not always got the praise because he is seen as a penalty machine![/b]

no it's about partnerships, Wyn Jones is an O'Connell style player so it's unlikely that McGeechan is going to go with 2 of the same, O'Callaghan will be there to do the dirty work, Wyn Jones turn will come in Australia to lead the test side.

 

[weilo]

Lions Team 2009
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9dGKXvt5dU

 

[Cymro]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (An Tarbh @ Apr 21 2009, 04:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Cymro @ Apr 21 2009, 03:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

AWJ will start with POC most likely DOC for me is an impact sub off the bench

And no Shaw has preformed and not always got the praise because he is seen as a penalty machine![/b]

no it's about partnerships, Wyn Jones is an O'Connell style player so it's unlikely that McGeechan is going to go with 2 of the same, O'Callaghan will be there to do the dirty work, Wyn Jones turn will come in Australia to lead the test side.
[/b][/quote]

No because everyone goes on the Lions Tour with a clean slate, AWJ does the dirty work, don't see where that statement of 'O'Callaghan will be there to do the dirty work, Wyn Jones turn will come in Australia to lead the test side' comes in. So you are telling me that AWJ has no chance of starting the test team? If so thats quite a limited view because as Geech has stated everyone goes on tour with a clean slate and can easily put themselves into contention during training and tour matches.

 

[SmokeyMonkey]

Is O'Driscoll the first Lion in history to tour as a regular player after previously being tour captain?

Also number of Lions in England

1st in GP Leicester - 1
2nd Harlequins - 1
3rd Bath - 1
4th London Irish - 0
5th Sale - 1
6th Gloucester - 0
7th Northampton - 1
8th Wasps - 4
9th Saracens - 0
10th Newcastle - 0
11th Worcester - 0
12th Bristol - 0

Wasps biased much?

 

[aligmacd123]

Wheres Mike Blair???

I would of taken Thom Evans as he already burned Bryan Habana in the autumn and he is the magners league top try scorer...

 

[An Tarbh]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Cymro @ Apr 21 2009, 04:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (An Tarbh @ Apr 21 2009, 04:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Cymro @ Apr 21 2009, 03:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

AWJ will start with POC most likely DOC for me is an impact sub off the bench

And no Shaw has preformed and not always got the praise because he is seen as a penalty machine![/b]

no it's about partnerships, Wyn Jones is an O'Connell style player so it's unlikely that McGeechan is going to go with 2 of the same, O'Callaghan will be there to do the dirty work, Wyn Jones turn will come in Australia to lead the test side.
[/b][/quote]

No because everyone goes on the Lions Tour with a clean slate, AWJ does the dirty work, don't see where that statement of 'O'Callaghan will be there to do the dirty work, Wyn Jones turn will come in Australia to lead the test side' comes in. So you are telling me that AWJ has no chance of starting the test team? If so thats quite a limited view because as Geech has stated everyone goes on tour with a clean slate and can easily put themselves into contention during training and tour matches.
[/b][/quote]

there's not enough time on this tour for everyone to start on a clean slate therefore the importance of existing partnerships is relevant, O'Callaghan and O'Connell know each others game inside out and as skipper he'll more than likely have a say on who he wants partnering him.

 

[Bumbadum]

Evans could be a seriously dangerous attacking threat outside a decent backline, no question...I just think his overall game is too weak. He's not better than any of those who made the squad.

Would probably have taken Care before Blair, but would definitely have had Blair over Ellis.

 

[An Tarbh]

Ellis is the major clanger, he's not even the best scrum half at his club yet he's good enough for the Lions, the worst thing that could have happened this year was Care picking up that feckin' injury before the Italy match, we wouldn't have had any of this nonsense if it hadn't.

 

[Prestwick]

The likes of Monye and Williams already provide the searing pace we're going to need to get by Pietersen and Habana.

I do agree though about Shaw. I don't quite see him slotting in with POC like I'd see DOC and AWJ would.

Shaw there for the mid-week games/bodyguard for SJ & ROG me'thinks!

 

[Steve-o]

Imagine picking that squad...

We need a bit of Byrne here, a little of Murray there, and a pinch of O'Driscoll to finish it off.
Brilliant!
I think this tour is gonna be immense, that is some squad. I won't go as far as saying it is a star studded squad, but it definitely has a lot of potential.

Although... When I reading the list I was like:
Gerry Flannery... Yes, good
Gethin Jenkins... Oh, even better
Euan Murray.... Great!
Phil Vickery.... Wait, whattt...

Surprised that Vickery only got chirped off in the 4th page. What the hell is he doing there!

Besides that, much like everyone else I raised an eyebrow when I only saw 2 flyhalfs. Powell and Worsley's selection is also unexpected. I'm sure Prestwick is wetting his pants in anticipation to see how Powell will do on the hard, dry grounds of the highveld.

Not so clued up on NH players but from that squad the most likely starting XV will be imo:

15 - Byrne
14 - Halfpenny
13 - O'Driscoll
12 - Flutey
11 - S. Williams
10 - R. O'Gara
9 - Phillips
8 - Powell
7 - M. Williams
6 - Heaslip
5 - O'Connell
4 - O'Callaghan
3 - Murray
2 - Flannery
1 - Jenkins

 

[Thingimubob]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Steve-o @ Apr 21 2009, 04:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Imagine picking that squad...

We need a bit of Byrne here, a little of Murray there, and a pinch of O'Driscoll to finish it off.
Brilliant!
I think this tour is gonna be immense, that is some squad. I won't go as far as saying it is a star studded squad, but it definitely has a lot of potential.

Although... When I reading the list I was like:
Gerry Flannery... Yes, good
Gethin Jenkins... Oh, even better
Euan Murray.... Great!
Phil Vickery.... Wait, whattt...

Surprised that Vickery only got chirped off in the 4th page. What the hell is he doing there!

Besides that, much like everyone else I raised an eyebrow when I only saw 2 flyhalfs. Powell and Worsley's selection is also unexpected. I'm sure Prestwick is wetting his pants in anticipation to see how Powell will do on the hard, dry grounds of the highveld.

Not so clued up on NH players but from that squad the most likely starting XV will be imo:

15 - Byrne
14 - Halfpenny
13 - O'Driscoll
12 - Flutey
11 - S. Williams
10 - R. O'Gara
9 - Phillips
8 - Powell
7 - M. Williams
6 - Heaslip
5 - O'Connell
4 - O'Callaghan
3 - Murray
2 - Flannery
1 - Jenkins[/b]

I really think the Lions do have a chance, because they can put together a fantastic team of players with this squad. Not too sure about Shaw and Vickery, but I expected there to be a few random Wasps in there.
Your team is pretty much there for the strongest, though I'd have Powell on the bench as an impact sub (a role he played pretty well for the Blues in the last two games), Heaslip at 8 and Wallace at 6 (or vice versa) and AWJ instead of O'Callaghan. I think Jamie Roberts will play a role as an impact sub too (as well as a utility back), especially considering how different a player he is to Flutey.

And to whoever said it, Halfpenny 100% does not have a big ego, and I really can't see him letting any of this getting to his head. I read an article earlier this year (just after the Six Nations I think) where he said he just couldn't believe that he'd managed to play for the Blues so many times, let alone Wales! He said his aim at the start of the season was to play for the semi-pro Cardiff RFC, and hopefully get a couple of games for the Blues while players were on International Duty.

Another thing is, I think it's great that the3re's so many young players involved, with the likes of Halfpenny and Earls only starting to play fully professional rugby this year. There's also the likes of Roberts who is only in his second season at the Blues, and started playing in a new position this season, and AWJ who shows a massive amount of maturtity for his age. Great to see that Fitzgerald (21) Kearney and Ferris (both 23) made it too. Brilliant that so much young talent is coming through

 

[Count of Devonshire]

Shaw and Vickery provide almost as much natural strength and beef as the rest of the team put together, plus have all the experience of regularly playing (and beating!) the Boks. I expect at least one of them to be a midweeker and the other to be a sub/subbed, but both chaps are in there because they offer attributes no other player available has.

 

[shazbooger]

I'm not going to predict a team as there will always be one or two players coming through (on form) during the first warm up matches.

I agree with whats-his-face above when he mentioned the clean slate. Geech may have combinations in his head, but it never quite works out that way on tours such as these. There is no history of selection, there are few if any guaranteed places as the quality of player travelling is superior to any other squad assembled over the past 4 years (in the NH of course). I could easily see O'Connell play with Jones, but you could easily see Hines usurp the lot of em as well.

Previous form becomes pretty much irrilevent once you get on the plane. its how you perform on tour in training and the first four matches that will count. Stars are always born on a Lions tour. Whats the odds of Earls, Fitzgerald and Halfpenny all strating the first test?

On and ........

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>

Although... When I reading the list I was like:
Gerry Flannery... Yes, good
Gethin Jenkins... Oh, even better
Euan Murray.... Great!
Phil Vickery.... Wait, whattt...[/b]

That summed it up for me perfectly.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Count of Devonshire @ Apr 21 2009, 05:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Shaw and Vickery ................. both chaps are in there because they offer attributes no other player available has.[/b]

That being experience. I'm not complaining about their selection but Geech himself said it was a balance between youth and experience. The likes of Halfpenny or Earls will get eaten up without the likes of Vickery and Shaw to look after em. Also, as count mentioned, not many of this squad have every actually beaten South Africa on any kind of regular basis. These guys have.

 

[Thingimubob]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Count of Devonshire @ Apr 21 2009, 05:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Shaw and Vickery provide almost as much natural strength and beef as the rest of the team put together, plus have all the experience of regularly playing (and beating!) the Boks. I expect at least one of them to be a midweeker and the other to be a sub/subbed, but both chaps are in there because they offer attributes no other player available has.[/b]

ah yes...they bring the abilty to attract more penalties and yellow cards than any of the player available <_<

 

[tomrugbyking10]

I'm probably not the first to say this, but i'm amazed that Nick Kennedy and Delon Armitage arent there! Delon was one of the best players for England in the 6N, if not the best! As for Nick Kennedy, he is a player who has performed time and time and time again for both club and country, but no Simon Shaw is there as he is a waspy. Deary me.

My test 15
15 - Kearney
14 - Bowe
13 - O'Driscoll
12 - Flutey
11 - Fitzgerald
10 - O'Gara
9 - Phillips

8- Heaslip
7 - Williams
6 - Wallace
5- O'Connell
4- O'Callaghan
3- Murray
2 - Flannery
1 - Jenkins

For me No Halfpenny, i would take him on tour and have him as a starter for the midweek side to give him an experience ready for the next tour to Australia. O'Connell and O'Callaghan second row as they know each others game inside out. Funnily enough i have got quite a large Irish contigent in my 15, purely as we were the best performers in the 6N.

Thank you

 

[Prestwick]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>

Besides that, much like everyone else I raised an eyebrow when I only saw 2 flyhalfs. Powell and Worsley's selection is also unexpected. I'm sure Prestwick is wetting his pants in anticipation to see how Powell will do on the hard, dry grounds of the highveld.[/b]

I'm giddy with excitement...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (tomrugbyking10 @ Apr 21 2009, 04:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

I'm probably not the first to say this, but i'm amazed that Nick Kennedy and Delon Armitage arent there! Delon was one of the best players for England in the 6N, if not the best! As for Nick Kennedy, he is a player who has performed time and time and time again for both club and country, but no Simon Shaw is there as he is a waspy. Deary me.

For me No Halfpenny, i would take him on tour and have him as a starter for the midweek side to give him an experience ready for the next tour to Australia. O'Connell and O'Callaghan second row as they know each others game inside out. Funnily enough i have got quite a large Irish contigent in my 15, purely as we were the best performers in the 6N.

Thank you[/b]

I am convinced that Nick "MIIISSSSTAAAAH" Kennedy is the lock to have at national and lion test level and would have been a perfect partner for POC. I think Halfpenny would deserve a starting place in one of the main tests as he does have a lot of potential. If he did prove himself in the tour games I think he should get his chance.

 

[Thingimubob]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (tomrugbyking10 @ Apr 21 2009, 05:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

I'm probably not the first to say this, but i'm amazed that Nick Kennedy and Delon Armitage arent there! Delon was one of the best players for England in the 6N, if not the best! As for Nick Kennedy, he is a player who has performed time and time and time again for both club and country, but no Simon Shaw is there as he is a waspy. Deary me.

My test 15
15 - Kearney
14 - Bowe
13 - O'Driscoll
12 - Flutey
11 - Fitzgerald
10 - O'Gara
9 - Phillips

8- Heaslip
7 - Williams
6 - Wallace
5- O'Connell
4- O'Callaghan
3- Murray
2 - Flannery
1 - Jenkins

For me No Halfpenny, i would take him on tour and have him as a starter for the midweek side to give him an experience ready for the next tour to Australia. O'Connell and O'Callaghan second row as they know each others game inside out. Funnily enough i have got quite a large Irish contigent in my 15, purely as we were the best performers in the 6N.

Thank you[/b]

Ah yeah I forgot about Armitage and Kennedy. I would have picked Kennedy ahead of Shaw anyday, and I'd have prefered Armitage to Monye, because he showed more consistent form for me, and is a goal kicking option.

 

[monkeypigeon]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (tomrugbyking10 @ Apr 21 2009, 05:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

I'm probably not the first to say this, but i'm amazed that Nick Kennedy and Delon Armitage arent there! Delon was one of the best players for England in the 6N, if not the best! As for Nick Kennedy, he is a player who has performed time and time and time again for both club and country, but no Simon Shaw is there as he is a waspy. Deary me.

My test 15
15 - Kearney
14 - Bowe
13 - O'Driscoll
12 - Flutey
11 - Fitzgerald
10 - O'Gara
9 - Phillips

8- Heaslip
7 - Williams
6 - Wallace
5- O'Connell
4- O'Callaghan
3- Murray
2 - Flannery
1 - Jenkins

For me No Halfpenny, i would take him on tour and have him as a starter for the midweek side to give him an experience ready for the next tour to Australia. O'Connell and O'Callaghan second row as they know each others game inside out. Funnily enough i have got quite a large Irish contigent in my 15, purely as we were the best performers in the 6N.

Thank you[/b]

Kearney instead of Byrne makes it look a tad biased but I don't have any huge objection to the rest. Shaw would have been the only wasp besides flutey I could consider worthy. He's done it all before and might bring a bit of calm to the younger fellers. I think Kennedy's a better player though and Armitage can feel hard done by.


And I would love to see Earls and Halfpenny in a test match!

If I had

9. Phillips/O'Leary
10. Jones/O'Gara
11. Williams/Fitzgerald
12. Earls
13. BOD
14. Halfpenny
15. Byrne

running at me I'd be seriously worried. Vicious attacking ability there. And with Wallace and Heaslip in the backrow I'd be even more afraid.

I'm not saying that these would be my starters. I'm just saying that it could produce glorious, beautiful rugby!


And in response to Sir Speedy, yes Earls does have test experience! He played the entire match against Canada scoring a try with his first touch!

 

[Meh]

On the face of it I'm thrilled that they got the obvious ones right.

But also...


Ellis - what the actual hell? What on earth is he doing there?

No Croft?! ANDY POWELL????

Quinlan? Come on...

And the fact that neither Peel OR Blair made it and that we have only two fly halves.

Wanted Armitage to go too.