[EOYT] Scotland vs South Africa 16/11/13

[Big Ewis]

not me, ask the rugby community Mr Froggy

No my friend, the Rugby community will not say that the result in South Africa is 100% due to refereeing, only some of the South Africans will say that, rest assured, don't kid yourself.
The rest of us will say Bryan Habana was pretty much single-handedly responsible for the 2 tries he scored - will accept NZ still put 40 on SA in their own fortress, including a comfortable wide-open try by Read when they were down 14 men, and were a class above their hosts, especially in the second half.

And the Rugby community would also state as it is very obvious for a neutral who isn't so biased he doesn't see the limpid reality that France defended much better than South Africa did against NZ. Don't take it as an offense, it's merely a fact I present to you. For God's sake, could you just accept that ?? Your bias is turning on the ridiculous.
I'll say this, because I'm sure it will play a role in your accepting my post: South Africa are a better team than France for sure, and they may beat us at home well. But the point is France played NZ much better than SA did this year at home.

What bad faith to blame it all on the ref when there were 80 whole minutes of action apiece from both matches where obviously the one team played better than the other against NZ. It's pretty ridiculous :lol:

 

[TRF_heineken]

No my friend, the Rugby community will not say that the result in South Africa is 100% due to refereeing, only some of the South Africans will say that, rest assured, don't kid yourself.
The rest of us will say Bryan Habana was pretty much single-handedly responsible for the 2 tries he scored - will accept NZ still put 40 on SA in their own fortress, including a comfortable wide-open try by Read when they were down 14 men, and were a class above their hosts, especially in the second half.

And the Rugby community would also state as it is very obvious for a neutral who isn't so biased he doesn't see the limpid reality that France defended much better than South Africa did against NZ. Don't take it as an offense, it's merely a fact I present to you. For God's sake, could you just accept that ?? Your bias is turning on the ridiculous.
I'll say this, because I'm sure it will play a role in your accepting my post: South Africa are a better team than France for sure, and they may beat us at home well. But the point is France played NZ much better than SA did this year at home.

What bad faith to blame it all on the ref when there were 80 whole minutes of action apiece from both matches where obviously the one team played better than the other against NZ. It's pretty ridiculous :lol:

Err.... Habana didn't score 2 tries in that game against the Scots... It was JJ Engelbrecht that scored in the corner and in the final play of the game Jan Serfontein powered over...

 

[Big Ewis]

Err.... Habana didn't score 2 tries in that game against the Scots... It was JJ Engelbrecht that scored in the corner and in the final play of the game Jan Serfontein powered over...

well I was obviously talking about the NZ game, my mistake, sorry for the lost time. I thought he was talking about the NZ game for some reason...I'm very, very tired.

Oh, well the match about Scotland...well it's still unfair to reduce it to the refereeing, Scotland played admirably that day...S.A. had a huge scrum advantage (pen try), better backs too and still more than hung in there, in South Africa.

 

[TRF_heineken]

well I was obviously talking about the NZ game, my mistake, sorry for the lost time. I thought he was talking about the NZ game for some reason...I'm very, very tired.

Oh, well the match about Scotland...well it's still unfair to reduce it to the refereeing, Scotland played admirably that day...S.A. had a huge scrum advantage (pen try), better backs too and still more than hung in there, in South Africa.

And yet the common denominator in both thoses matches are:
The Boks
The Ref...

 

[Gena_ZA]

No my friend, the Rugby community will not say that the result in South Africa is 100% due to refereeing, only some of the South Africans will say that, rest assured, don't kid yourself.
The rest of us will say Bryan Habana was pretty much single-handedly responsible for the 2 tries he scored - will accept NZ still put 40 on SA in their own fortress, including a comfortable wide-open try by Read when they were down 14 men, and were a class above their hosts, especially in the second half.

And the Rugby community would also state as it is very obvious for a neutral who isn't so biased he doesn't see the limpid reality that France defended much better than South Africa did against NZ. Don't take it as an offense, it's merely a fact I present to you. For God's sake, could you just accept that ?? Your bias is turning on the ridiculous.
I'll say this, because I'm sure it will play a role in your accepting my post: South Africa are a better team than France for sure, and they may beat us at home well. But the point is France played NZ much better than SA did this year at home.

What bad faith to blame it all on the ref when there were 80 whole minutes of action apiece from both matches where obviously the one team played better than the other against NZ. It's pretty ridiculous :lol:

now calm the F down mister, I was just referring to the ref in that game based on your statement that they nearly rolled us over in our own backyaurd
Nothing more and nothing less, no bias, no nothing, so chill
No need to pull in all arguments to counter me, I did not make any statements, if you are so neutral, be objective as well please

 

[Gena_ZA]

it seems you did not understand me reading all your attacking posts again - never did I refer or compare SA/France and the mighty All Blacsk - SA vs. Scotland - kinda the main topic here, was what I commented on.
Now go on and degrade me even more, seems you get a kick out of it

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

The 10 Springboks who were awarded long-term contracts are: Willem Alberts, Jean de Villiers, Bismarck du Plessis, Jannie du Plessis, Eben Etzebeth, Siya Kolisi, Tendai Mtawarira, Frans Steyn, Adriaan Strauss and Duane Vermeulen.

JdP.... argh. Maybe he comes back better after injury/rest. Frans Steyn. Interesting.

 

[Big Ewis]

it seems you did not understand me reading all your attacking posts again - never did I refer or compare SA/France and the mighty All Blacsk - SA vs. Scotland - kinda the main topic here, was what I commented on.
Now go on and degrade me even more, seems you get a kick out of it

dude, I apologize for my confusion. I said I was sorry, I said I was very tired. Let's forget this. No, I'm not pathetic enough to pick fights online on purpose, no "kick out of it" :lol: it bores me if you want to know.
What I said about the S.A. NZ match stands though. I understand that wasn't your comment, but I have seen this before about that match so I was just reacting to seeing it again (or so I thought).

And about the SA SCO match: you ARE much too sensitive and biased, I merely said Scotland "gave them a good run for their money", which was the case. I've seen the match you see, so I couldn't care less about ref this ref that, as far as I'm concerned did Scotland play a fantastic match ? Sure did. Then if you say the ref was hellsent and wtvr, sure, maybe. But Scotland definitely played fantastic out there, again, esp. given the fact they had very little to compete with on paper VS South Africa, and with the scrum disadvantage in particular.

You don't see it, but you take what I say much farther than it actually is going. Your pride for the Boks is so strong you think ppl are saying things they aren't actually saying.

To this affirmation, can I ask you in one sentence what you respond:
Scotland, last summer in SA, gave the Boks a very good fight, responded to the physical assault SA was throwing at them, and given the two rosters on paper fought admirably for 80 minutes.

Yes, no ?

 

[Gena_ZA]

sure love, whatever blows your hair back
Excuse me for not replying, just lost interest in you and what you have to say

 

[Big Ewis]

sure love, whatever blows your hair back
Excuse me for not replying, just lost interest in you and what you have to say

I'm asking a simple question, which is 100% a topic that you brought here (SA SCO match) which I only eluded to in very fair and objective terms - saying Scotland played admirably well in S.A.
I haven't attacked you or insulted you, only reacted to what you gave me. You've kept calling me names "Mr Froggy" "love" etc...since I tried to reason with you here, and now you send me bad rep, insult me further and still won't answer a simple question I ask you, because you've "lost interest" from a topic you've precipitated yourself.

Unfair, unjustifiable.
Your personal flaws surface as you're vexed from the very topic, that it's a lot more than just some ref's whistle that gave Scotland its 17 points, and allowed them to hold for 80 whole minutes.
You've attacked me personally and completely forgotten this was a forum, made to debate, and that's the only thing I was offering to do.

 

[Gena_ZA]

The 10 Springboks who were awarded long-term contracts are: Willem Alberts, Jean de Villiers, Bismarck du Plessis, Jannie du Plessis, Eben Etzebeth, Siya Kolisi, Tendai Mtawarira, Frans Steyn, Adriaan Strauss and Duane Vermeulen.

JdP.... argh. Maybe he comes back better after injury/rest. Frans Steyn. Interesting.

I was concerned when Frans Steyn was left out with no explanation - could have missed it is the media - most likely
Wondering what is the long term plan with him, is it at 12 - JdV and Serf or 15 - personally I think this is a real possibility.

On Jannie, never been a fan but after the new scumming laws he showed his worth 10 times over, happy with Jannie at present.
Interesting that Skolisi got a contract before Arno Botha

 

[TRF_heineken]

dude, I apologize for my confusion. I said I was sorry, I said I was very tired. Let's forget this. No, I'm not pathetic enough to pick fights online on purpose, no "kick out of it" :lol: it bores me if you want to know.
What I said about the S.A. NZ match stands though. I understand that wasn't your comment, but I have seen this before about that match so I was just reacting to seeing it again (or so I thought).

And about the SA SCO match: you ARE much too sensitive and biased, I merely said Scotland "gave them a good run for their money", which was the case. I've seen the match you see, so I couldn't care less about ref this ref that, as far as I'm concerned did Scotland play a fantastic match ? Sure did. Then if you say the ref was hellsent and wtvr, sure, maybe. But Scotland definitely played fantastic out there, again, esp. given the fact they had very little to compete with on paper VS South Africa, and with the scrum disadvantage in particular.

You don't see it, but you take what I say much farther than it actually is going. Your pride for the Boks is so strong you think ppl are saying things they aren't actually saying.

To this affirmation, can I ask you in one sentence what you respond:
Scotland, last summer in SA, gave the Boks a very good fight, responded to the physical assault SA was throwing at them, and given the two rosters on paper fought admirably for 80 minutes.

Yes, no ?

Not meaning to point out the obvious here, but of course we are going to be sensitive and biased! We are South Africans and Springbok supporters!! when it comes to our team we will always be like that. Everyone is that way towards their team...

Anyways, it's pointless arguing with you.

And as for this fixture, you can't compare it to the previous on in Nelspruit. Here are the reasons:
1. No Romain Poite
2. No Debutants - Unless Schreuder gets called up, which I highly doubt.
3. A much more settled Bok team
4. More experience
5. Did I mention no Romain Poite??

I was concerned when Frans Steyn was left out with no explanation - could have missed it is the media - most likely
Wondering what is the long term plan with him, is it at 12 - JdV and Serf or 15 - personally I think this is a real possibility.

On Jannie, never been a fan but after the new scumming laws he showed his worth 10 times over, happy with Jannie at present.
Interesting that Skolisi got a contract before Arno Botha

I think this is the incentive Frans needed to get fit and lean.

Jannie has been a great asset, but he is tired and deserves a rest. the new laws certainly helps a lot. And any knowledgable rugby coach would tell you, a tighthead prop becomes a vital and great weapon and only becomes better with age.

As for the Kolisi/Botha - thing. It's hard to give a guy a contract when he's been out injured nearly 6 months. Kolisi has been playing well when he has come on, so there's no reason not to give him a contract... And this will keep the politicians happy too...

 

[Gena_ZA]

I'm asking a simple question, which is 100% a topic that you brought here (SA SCO match) which I only eluded to in very fair and objective terms - saying Scotland played admirably well in S.A.
I haven't attacked you or insulted you, only reacted to what you gave me. You've kept calling me names "Mr Froggy" "love" etc...since I tried to reason with you here, and now you send me bad rep, insult me further and still won't answer a simple question I ask you, because you've "lost interest" from a topic you've precipitated yourself.

Unfair, unjustifiable.
Your personal flaws surface as you're vexed from the very topic, that it's a lot more than just some ref's whistle that gave Scotland its 17 points, and allowed them to hold for 80 whole minutes.
You've attacked me personally and completely forgotten this was a forum, made to debate, and that's the only thing I was offering to do.

okay, let's sort this, not my nature to fight online
I am not to argue with you and loose a fight in words as this is not my first language and probably not yours, linguistically you are most likely superior to me.

On the game, it is my opinion and my right to have that opinion that the ref of day, couldn't care about his nationality, did not officiate the off line at the rucks correctly. Scotland and their no 7 used this very effectively and unsettled the Boks massively - well done by them and pathetic that the Boks could not adjust sooner. So yes, based on what they were allowed they did hold their own against the Boks on the day. Had it been reffed fairly in my opinion, they would not have come as close.

On the remarks, do not attack someone else and expect them not to counter. When they do and it is not in your taste, don't make it as if it was there fault in the first please, hence the negative rep.
Report me if you like.

I had my say

 

[Big Ewis]

Not meaning to point out the obvious here, but of course we are going to be sensitive and biased! We are South Africans and Springbok supporters!! when it comes to our team we will always be like that. Everyone is that way towards their team...

Anyways, it's pointless arguing with you.

And as for this fixture, you can't compare it to the previous on in Nelspruit. Here are the reasons:
1. No Romain Poite
2. No Debutants - Unless Schreuder gets called up, which I highly doubt.
3. A much more settled Bok team
4. More experience
5. Did I mention no Romain Poite??

I assure you it's not, I'm not a stubborn person man, and I certainly don't want arguing. I'm just saying the things I've commented on are only for the sake of discussion; I really think it's highly reductive and in bad faith to mention the mere referee when Scotland obviously played their best match in years. I'm merely trying to give credit to Scotland, and emphasizing the bias and injustice of some Boks posters here.

WHY IN THE WORLD would I connect to my forum and get mad and look for trouble ? As if it wasn't obvious enough, I encourage anyone to read what I'm saying, that I was looking to make a point and not attack a user.

Do you understand that, heineken ? I don't mean to harm your sensitivities, I really just simply don't.

Bottom line: unfair to look at the ref for that match. Quite an acid, defensive mindset I personally can't respect. Give the damn Scots credit, goddamn it. Will be interesting to see how they contain the Boks again, or attempt that, next week.
Period.

 

[TRF_heineken]

I assure you it's not, I'm not a stubborn person man, and I certainly don't want arguing. I'm just saying the things I've commented on are only for the sake of discussion; I really think it's highly reductive and in bad faith to mention the mere referee when Scotland obviously played their best match in years. I'm merely trying to give credit to Scotland, and emphasizing the bias and injustice of some Boks posters here.

WHY IN THE WORLD would I connect to my forum and get mad and look for trouble ? As if it wasn't obvious enough, I encourage anyone to read what I'm saying, that I was looking to make a point and not attack a user.

Do you understand that, heineken ? I don't mean to harm your sensitivities, I really just simply don't.

Bottom line: unfair to look at the ref for that match. Quite an acid, defensive mindset I personally can't respect. Give the damn Scots credit, goddamn it. Will be interesting to see how they contain the Boks again, or attempt that, next week.
Period.

No need to be blasphemous!!

Why should I give credit when I don't want to?? Why should I just hold my mouth about a ref/player/coach when I know that they had an influence?? Even more so when it's appearing in newspapers??

And stop trying to be so high and mighty. Like many others already mentioned on this forum, you are looking for kicks. Not just my or Gena's opinion, but many forum member's opinion.

 

[Gena_ZA]

"As for the Kolisi/Botha - thing. It's hard to give a guy a contract when he's been out injured nearly 6 months. Kolisi has been playing well when he has come on, so there's no reason not to give him a contract... And this will keep the politicians happy too.."

Don't take me wrong on this pease, also happy for Skolisi - just though that Arno Botha is earmarked as a future Bok captain but due to his injury makes my statement actually null and void

 

[Big Ewis]

No need to be blasphemous!!

Why should I give credit when I don't want to?? Why should I just hold my mouth about a ref/player/coach when I know that they had an influence?? Even more so when it's appearing in newspapers??

And stop trying to be so high and mighty. Like many others already mentioned on this forum, you are looking for kicks. Not just my or Gena's opinion, but many forum member's opinion.

You're entitled to your opinion; it's getting excited, calling names and being detestably disrespectful to others I won't take.
I don't know what I have to do for you people to understand I'm not looking for trouble one bit...

Like on this very thread, heineken, give me one sentence that is crossing the line, and in any way looks like it is trying to provoke people gratuitously ? You won't, but still try since you're hellbent on making me a scapegoat it seems.
For anyone with a clear, logical mind, it's rather limpid I come here to comment on Rugby. Period. I make jokes too, but that's it.
If you're referring to nick from that "Hard men" thread, read it again, this time without your bias of blind hatred for me, and tell me who crossed the line, and who was just trying to make a little spicy joke. Go on, since you're making a case out of this, you better back it up, do it the whole way, or no way at all.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

I really look forward to seeing the stuff that comes up next week.

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

The 10 Springboks who were awarded long-term contracts are: Willem Alberts, Jean de Villiers, Bismarck du Plessis, Jannie du Plessis, Eben Etzebeth, Siya Kolisi, Tendai Mtawarira, Frans Steyn, Adriaan Strauss and Duane Vermeulen.

JdP.... argh. Maybe he comes back better after injury/rest. Frans Steyn. Interesting.

You'd have to think it's more for secondary reasons rather than just being the best in their position. Both Jannie and Frans are worth a lot for commercial purposes

 

[TRF_heineken]

You're entitled to your opinion; it's getting excited, calling names and being detestably disrespectful to others I won't take.
I don't know what I have to do for you people to understand I'm not looking for trouble one bit...

Like on this very thread, heineken, give me one sentence that is crossing the line, and in any way looks like it is trying to provoke people gratuitously ? You won't, but still try since you're hellbent on making me a scapegoat it seems.
For anyone with a clear, logical mind, it's rather limpid I come here to comment on Rugby. Period. I make jokes too, but that's it.
If you're referring to nick from that "Hard men" thread, read it again, this time without your bias of blind hatred for me, and tell me who crossed the line, and who was just trying to make a little spicy joke. Go on, since you're making a case out of this, you better back it up, do it the whole way, or no way at all.

Oh, was that the only thread this has come up?? odd...

You'd have to think it's more for secondary reasons rather than just being the best in their position. Both Jannie and Frans are worth a lot for commercial purposes

I can see Frans as a commercial asset, but not Jannie...

And Bismarck already has the Commercial role... Pump-by-dam-pump

But we are digressing from the topic again...