England 6N 2016 - General Chit Chat

[Patchey]

Definitely not me. I think the best thing we could do for our pack is to fire Haskell out of a cannon into the sun.

Oh...

 

[Thingimubob]

Wasn't the question, though, was it?
Weren't we talking about creating players for the future?

All I was saying is Moriarty is an example of England creating a player, not Wales.

Aye fair enough.

At the same time, as VC pointed out, he played a decent chunk of his junior / youth rugby in Wales (apparently was a goal keeper for Swansea City at 11 too :lol so could certainly argue Wales have had a hand in there too!

I think the main reason he crossed the border was his dad heading to Gloucester as a defence coach?

Anyway, doesn't matter - he's still an exception as the majority of this team came through the Welsh systems.

 

[TW27BA]

After the success of Itoje and Kruis, where does this leave Launchbury? He's too good to be just an impact player from the bench and wasn't his name being bandied around as a future England captain just after the last RWC?

4 Itoje
5 Kruis
6 Launchbury
7 Clifford
8 Billy V

??

 

[j'nuh]

Let him earn his place back. Good for competition to have Itoje, Kruis and Launchbury competing for the starting spots, and I really want to see Ewers at 6.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

After the success of Itoje and Kruis, where does this leave Launchbury? He's too good to be just an impact player from the bench and wasn't his name being bandied around as a future England captain just after the last RWC?

4 Itoje
5 Kruis
6 Launchbury
7 Clifford
8 Billy V

??

I don't think he's hit his pre injury heights yet. If you're considering Itoje as a lock then Launch is very much 3rd choice at the moment. But assuming he gets his form back, in 18 months I reckon this back 5 could be pretty tasty:

4. Kruis
5. Launch
6. Itoje
7. Underhill
8. Hughes

 

[Rich Taff]

Stop bloody showing off with your second row factory!

 

[Peat]

There's no such thing as too good to be an impact sub. An entire bench of players of Launchbury's calibre should be our aim.

...

I do slightly worry that he's too quiet to be a Jones type player and will end up getting overlooked.

 

[Rich Taff]

I feel Wales have missed out, by picking our second rows on the wing recently.....

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Yeah, Eddie has said he views it as a 23 man team not a XV + subs.
World class players 1-23 should be the aim for every side wanting to be at the top of the game.

 

[j'nuh]

Yeah, Eddie has said he views it as a 23 man team not a XV + subs.
World class players 1-23 should be the aim for every side wanting to be at the top of the game.

It's a tough one. We've reached a saturation point in our second row. We literally can't even try any new players out. Itoje and Kruis have two positions locked down and Launchbury presumably will take the last. And when you look who is behind them... Lawes, Beaumont*, Kitchener, Slater...

And then you look over on the flanks, and although there's plenty of competition, places aren't really locked down there. I'd like Launchbury, Itoje, Kruis and Lawes to stay in the second row, but I would be tempting Beaumont and Slater into looking at 6, cuz otherwise I don't know when they will get their chance.

* I know Beaumont plays 8 now, but he's not gonna get much of a look in with Vunipola there.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Slater is a 6 anyway, but he isn't as good as Ewers.

 

[Peat]

Someone will need to cover for Ewers when he's get injured... like now.

Will be interesting to see if Vunipola and Ewers in the same back row works. Potentially awesome, potentially leaving some big gaps in the required skillset unfilled.

 

[Patchey]

It's a tough one. We've reached a saturation point in our second row. We literally can't even try any new players out. Itoje and Kruis have two positions locked down and Launchbury presumably will take the last. And when you look who is behind them... Lawes, Beaumont*, Kitchener, Slater...

And then you look over on the flanks, and although there's plenty of competition, places aren't really locked down there. I'd like Launchbury, Itoje, Kruis and Lawes to stay in the second row, but I would be tempting Beaumont and Slater into looking at 6, cuz otherwise I don't know when they will get their chance.

* I know Beaumont plays 8 now, but he's not gonna get much of a look in with Vunipola there.

I actually don't quite buy this.

I mean yes, you're right in that we have such a wealth of good and potentially class players in one position that it will be hard to see what anyone else can do.

But then NZ have been in this position plenty of times and still managed to! It is possible it just requires some very good man management, which is something Jones has a rep for .

Not saying there aren't going to be some, potentially a fair few, locks coming through who don't get the international career they mig have had. But that is just the nature of the beast. I'd rather we had Graham Kitchiner on a list of 'unfulfilled talent' than have Mortiz Botha in the EPS!

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Someone will need to cover for Ewers when he's get injured... like now.

Will be interesting to see if Vunipola and Ewers in the same back row works. Potentially awesome, potentially leaving some big gaps in the required skillset unfilled.

Might (might not) look stunning in the 6N, but the ABs wouldn't lose any sleep over it. They've have proven time and again that skill will beat size and this is what we should be aspiring to. Rodber, Clarke and Richards once did the business against the ABs, but we really should be looking for the kind of balance that the holy trinity of Hill, Back and Dallaglio had.

Mind you just for a one off against Wales, Ewers, Binny and Hughes might be quite good fun

 

[ratsapprentice]

Someone will need to cover for Ewers when he's get injured... like now.

Will be interesting to see if Vunipola and Ewers in the same back row works. Potentially awesome, potentially leaving some big gaps in the required skillset unfilled.

Two flankers needed - pick two from Kvesic, Ewers, Underhill and Clifford if he's not playing 8.

 

[j'nuh]

What about Beaumont?

I want to see Beaumont.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Idgaf

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Nah, Beaumont's an 8 who can cover lock in an emergency.
Realistically his only chance will be if Binny is injured(/rested) and we realise we don't want someone who shows he has no commitment to anything other than money like Hughes.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Nice to see neither of Earle or Spencer's names on the Sarries team sheet again this week...

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Interested to hear more about Underhill. I know he's 19 (by way of comparison McCaw was 20 when he made his AB debut and the great Michael Jones 21/22). What is his X factor over say over Kvesic and Fraser? Is this "kid" that good that England use their exceptional circumstance rule for him this early I.e. Suggestions for the Australia tour? Or is it more a case that England are desperate to tie him down before the Welsh get their hands on him like they did with Moriaty and Francis.