Dire England....again

[Leonormous Boozer]

I also found a post I made about it at the time (Mid January):
"a quick look on statbunker suggests that it's just Premiership, so not including AIs or Champions Cup (they have Lawes with 812 Prem minutes + 400 EPCR + 210 AIs)"

Its worth noting that Schmidt has tried to limit Stander's minutes, he would have got 60 mins instead of 40 mins off against Italy but for Conan picking up a knock, and did limit Henderson's minutes.I'd wager that Devin Toner or Jacob Stockdale are the Irish players with the most minutes this season with summer tours included.

Edit: Worth noting due to the contrast between the English system and one that serves the national team. It is something taht is often negated at RWC's as we're more than aware of.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Not sure why it's even questioned.... the NZ system is basically the gold standard for performance.

It's really as simple as that.

 

[mania]

Please.
AB lose in the AI's, New Zealander's "it's because the players are tired" every single time.

evidence?

 

[mania]

Personally feel that lions tour should be finished now.

why? its an awesome showcase of rugby. its unique , has history and really entertaining.
naysayers were saying before the last tour that it was outdated and meaningless.
heard a lot about the Lions just come to NZ to get a hiding. yet the Lions got here, got put thru a baptism of fire playing against NZ superRugby teams and they learnt and became a better team.
the drawn series was a perfect result for giving credibility to the Lions.

 

[Nudger]

Personally feel that lions tour should be finished now.

If they don't go on a lions tour they go on an England

 

[Maverick1987]

Personally feel that lions tour should be finished now.

I don't know if you are taking the **** but I genuinely feel like the lions tours time is coming . Especially if the push for a real global season ever gains traction

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

I don't know if you are taking the **** but I genuinely feel like the lions tours time is coming . Especially if the push for a real global season ever gains traction

nah not taking the ****.

Love the concept and love the lions but it isn't feesable with the amount of games already being played by pro players, sure SH unions get a nice pay day but it's just outdated.
Barbarians can still work because there isn't any pressure on them, they train a bit on the whole and party, whereas the lions is a serious business.

I can't see it going though too much money, but they need to limit the games.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

If they don't go on a lions tour they go on an England

Difference between 3 games and 10 games.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

nah not taking the ****.

Love the concept and love the lions but it isn't feesable with the amount of games already being played by pro players, sure SH unions get a nice pay day but it's just outdated.
Barbarians can still work because there isn't any pressure on them, they train a bit on the whole and party, whereas the lions is a serious business.

I can't see it going though too much money, but they need to limit the games.

 

[mania]

If they don't go on a lions tour they go on an England

arent england players over worked and too tired?

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

A 10 game and 6 week Lions tour where its possible to be involved in three games in 8 days =/= a two and a half, three test tour. The Lions is undoubtedly more physically and mentally draining, the only positives for the international teams involved are for the SH.

 

[mania]

nah not taking the ****.

Love the concept and love the lions but it isn't feesable with the amount of games already being played by pro players, sure SH unions get a nice pay day but it's just outdated.
Barbarians can still work because there isn't any pressure on them, they train a bit on the whole and party, whereas the lions is a serious business.

I can't see it going though too much money, but they need to limit the games.

its an awesome concept. lose this and no other tour like this will be offered in its stead. its the last of its kind that i can think of.
this goes back to the days when sides toured properly and played not only tests but local sides as well.
its an awesome concept and southern hemispherions highly look forward to this
if you asked the players they would all be in favour of keeping this tour. the recent tour gave the Lions tourist such awesome experience and i expect to see great things from alot of these players after they not only survived but flourished with the gruelsome itinerary they went thru

Please.
AB lose in the AI's, New Zealander's "it's because the players are tired" every single time.

evidence please

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

A 10 game and 6 week Lions tour where its possible to be involved in three games in 8 days =/= a two and a half, three test tour. The Lions is undoubtedly more physically and mentally draining, the only positives for the international teams involved are for the SH.

Yep and people can mention that the players will be playing for their unions instead but at least then the union can mange their own players so you don;t end up with leaving players like Cole, Best and Marler on the pitch for 80 minutes in a pointless midweek game that is being played for no fecking reason.

NZ took the **** doing all the super rugby teams IMO should have been 3 at the most and no midweek game during the tests.

 

[mania]

A 10 game and 6 week Lions tour where its possible to be involved in three games in 8 days =/= a two and a half, three test tour. The Lions is undoubtedly more physically and mentally draining, the only positives for the international teams involved are for the SH.

i think u should check with the players what they got out of this. im sure the lions have grown as professional players after this tour. they can all hold their heads high for their performance

 

[mania]

NZ took the **** doing all the super rugby teams IMO should have been 3 at the most and no midweek game during the tests.

agree. playing the super sides was insane. but saying that the Lions grew from those games and got better as the tour went on. imo NZRFU handed the Lions the perfect opportunnity to beat the ABs . those that survived the Super teams went on to take the ABs on to a standstill.
imo had the Lions played provincial sides they wouldnt of been anywhere near as ready for the ABs

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

its an awesome concept. lose this and no other tour like this will be offered in its stead. its the last of its kind that i can think of.
this goes back to the days when sides toured properly and played not only tests but local sides as well.
its an awesome concept and southern hemispherions highly look forward to this
if you asked the players they would all be in favour of keeping this tour. the recent tour gave the Lions tourist such awesome experience and i expect to see great things from alot of these players after they not only survived but flourished with the gruelsome itinerary they went thru
evidence please

Last time England beat NZ. NZ public said it. I'm not going through social media just to find posts.

On that last point about players growing, most Lions players have gone backwards since it on the whole. The ones who have made great strides forward are the ones who missed out. (Bar freaks like Sexton).

How about we have a home union tour?
Make a SH team come to us for a change and the home unions can get the cash then see how up for it the SH unions are for the tour.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Barbarians are far less justifiable than the Lions, IMO... with the need to give Tier 2 countries tests.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Barbarians are far less justifiable than the Lions, IMO... with the need to give Tier 2 countries tests.

From a player welfare POV it's alot more justifiable.
Barbarians also actually play lower tier teams aswell like v Czech Republic.
Lions tour does nothing to expand the game currently.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

i think u should check with the players what they got out of this. im sure the lions have grown as professional players after this tour. they can all hold their heads high for their performance

It's a great honour for a player sure but ask Stephen Ferris, Luke Fitzgerald, Tom Croft, Cian Healy, Alex Corbisiero, Jared Payne etc... whether they'd rather have their tour experience or the proceeding 2-6 years of their career with significantly less injury problems and I reckon they'd choose the latter.

The number of players who experience long term injury problems from a Lions injury or an injury picked up in the early stages of the following season is shocking. I'd replace it with 4 team, three test tournaments in the US or Asia like you see big soccer clubs do in the summer, it'd be more beneficial for the players and unions.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

It's a great honour for a player sure but ask Stephen Ferris, Luke Fitzgerald, Tom Croft, Cian Healy, Alex Corbisiero, Jared Payne etc... whether they'd rather have their tour experience or the proceeding 2-6 years of their career with significantly less injury problems and I reckon they'd choose the latter.

The number of players who experience long term injury problems from a Lions injury or an injury picked up in the early stages of the following season is shocking. I'd replace it with 4 team, three test tournaments in the US or Asia like you see big soccer clubs do in the summer, it'd be more beneficial for the players and unions.

Bring back a proper Churchill cup!!
Actually would love a proper A team Churchill cup now that U20's can't be teams second choices.