British & Irish Lions Back Row

[TPenn]

6. Ferris (my reasons are well known at this stage) suits any gameplan
7. Warbuton - best openside in Europe
8. Denton/Heaslip - depends what type of game you want to play and what you want your eight to do. You simply want to steamroll the Aussies Denton if you want a smarter footballer and better linkman Heaslip. As a side note with the Lions scrum likely to do pretty well control at the base could be important. IMO Heaslip is the best at this as he has shown numerous times on rapidly retreating scrums.

20. O'Brien - not the best in any of the positions and not necessarily but the best option who can play all three backrow positions.

Right now I'm not sure Warburton is the best openside in Wales.

 

[profitius]

O'Brien's never proved himself a better ball carrier at international level and imo last season struggled to replicate the carrying of his break out season at a domestic level. He's a better jackal, but not a better counter-rucker or ruck-clearer - I'd probably give the latter to Ferris, but that might just be bias speaking. Better skills? Can't say I've seen much evidence of that and would point out that Ferris offloaded more often than O'Brien last Six Nations. And last Heineken Cup too.

I'd also point out I see Ferris used more as a lineout option than O'Brien. He's also quicker. He's also a more destructive tackler.

And so on. And, like, you're wrong.

Ireland don't use SOB as a ball carrier. He plays 7 and his job with Ireland is to get stuck in. Having said that he had a good world cup and was very good against NZ during the summer, winning many turnovers. During the world cup the gameplan was to give it to himself and Ferris and let them carry. Wales had a plan to stop them and it worked. Don't forget he was European player of the year a few seasons back and last season he was carrying a hip injury.

Not taking anything away from Ferris. Everyone accepts that Ferris is a world class 6 while theres always debate about SOBs best position because he has the ability to play across the backrow. Personally I'd have the 2 of them playing and thats not being biased because I wouldn't have too many other Irish players on the team (Sexton, Healy) if I was picking it now.

 

[Peat]

Actually, to check the stats, O'Brien carried more ball than Ferris in the Six Nations and made less tackles.

I don't want to be doing down O'Brien - he's a very good player - but I found the comparison highly unbalanced, not least because he's never shown as well for Ireland in a number of ways as he has for Leinster - and there's plenty of possible reasons for that in fairness.

 

[UlsterRugby2012]

The reason I would put Ferris infront of O'Brien for 6 is because I don't think he's a complete blindside. I personally think he's more suited to 8, and then 7 then 6.

 

[dullonien]

I would butt-in shouting Lydiates name here, but I'm really not sure he'll make the tour. However I will shout Ryan Jones' name instead. Despite playing second fiddle to Lydiate last season, I still think he had a better season than both Ferris and SOB. He had the best season of his career, and has started this season just as strongly. If he keeps it up I think he'll be a certainty to make the plane because he also brings genuine leadership and plenty of versatility. The difference he has made to the Ospreys in the last two games has been immense.

So yeah: Ryan Jones > Stephen Ferris > SOB.

Preparing for severe abuse from LN7 and BG8 in particular.

 

[big ginger 8]

You have some time to prepare my onslaught won't come for a few days.

 

[Peat]

I would butt-in shouting Lydiates name here, but I'm really not sure he'll make the tour. However I will shout Ryan Jones' name instead. Despite playing second fiddle to Lydiate last season, I still think he had a better season than both Ferris and SOB. He had the best season of his career, and has started this season just as strongly. If he keeps it up I think he'll be a certainty to make the plane because he also brings genuine leadership and plenty of versatility. The difference he has made to the Ospreys in the last two games has been immense.

So yeah: Ryan Jones > Stephen Ferris > SOB.

Preparing for severe abuse from LN7 and BG8 in particular.

I personally believe that arguments based on form have no real place this far out - far too easy to lose it in the coming months.

There is an argument for Ryan Jones, but it should be made on his attributes as a player and how they'd slot in.

 

[Draggs]

I personally believe that arguments based on form have no real place this far out - far too easy to lose it in the coming months.

There is an argument for Ryan Jones, but it should be made on his attributes as a player and how they'd slot in.

"Judging on form" ugh.
If we did that, Fenby would start against Argentina. I am already having bad thoughts about that.

 

[dullonien]

This whole debate is a little futile at the moment, but as we're having it (can be quite interesting), form has to come into it.

Fenby is the new Brew.

 

[Draggs]

This whole debate is a little futile at the moment, but as we're having it (can be quite interesting), form has to come into it.

Fenby is the new Brew.

Rhys Patchell performed well, and Rhodri Williams has been in good form for Llandovery.

 

[dullonien]

Rhys Patchell performed well, and Rhodri Williams has been in good form for Llandovery.

Ok, ok. There's a big difference between Ryan Jones and Fenby, Patchell and Rhodri Williams. One is a proven performer over many years, the others are inexperienced players who need to show they can keep it going. There's nothing to say (other than gut feeling) that in the long run Fenby, Patchell and Williams won't still be playing well and playing for Wales. My gut feeling tells me that Fenby doesn't have the top two inches (like Tom James and Aled Brew). I'm undecided about Rhodri Williams, but initial thoughts about Patchell are good. Ultimately time will tell.

 

[Draggs]

Ok, ok. There's a big difference between Ryan Jones and Fenby, Patchell and Rhodri Williams. One is a proven performer over many years, the others are inexperienced players who need to show they can keep it going. There's nothing to say (other than gut feeling) that in the long run Fenby, Patchell and Williams won't still be playing well and playing for Wales. My gut feeling tells me that Fenby doesn't have the top two inches (like Tom James and Aled Brew). I'm undecided about Rhodri Williams, but initial thoughts about Patchell are good. Ultimately time will tell.

Lions backline: Tavis Knoyle, Rhys Priestland, Andy Fenby, Gareth Owen, Scott Williams, Kristian Phillips, Liam Williams.
Heart and soul, no chance the Aussies can compete.

So many wings in Wales with "top two inches issues" (Top foot if we are talking about Czekaj)

 

[psychic duck]

Ok, ok. There's a big difference between Ryan Jones and Fenby, Patchell and Rhodri Williams. One is a proven performer over many years, the others are inexperienced players who need to show they can keep it going. There's nothing to say (other than gut feeling) that in the long run Fenby, Patchell and Williams won't still be playing well and playing for Wales. My gut feeling tells me that Fenby doesn't have the top two inches (like Tom James and Aled Brew). I'm undecided about Rhodri Williams, but initial thoughts about Patchell are good. Ultimately time will tell.

You cannot compare Tom James to Aled Brew.

Neither have impressed for Wales, but for completely different reasons.

By the way, Brew is much better than Fenby. How he resurrected his career with a club which is a laughing stock is admirable. He's a much more intelligent player and better finisher than Tom James as well.

 

[dullonien]

Lions backline: Tavis Knoyle, Rhys Priestland, Andy Fenby, Gareth Owen, Scott Williams, Kristian Phillips, Liam Williams.
Heart and soul, no chance the Aussies can compete.

So many wings in Wales with "top two inches issues" (Top foot if we are talking about Czekaj)

Well, Czekaj's top two inches is all hair.

I'd love to be able to start praising Gareth Owen again, he's always been a favorite of mine.

You cannot compare Tom James to Aled Brew.

Neither have impressed for Wales, but for completely different reasons.

By the way, Brew is much better than Fenby. How he resurrected his career with a club which is a laughing stock is admirable. He's a much more intelligent player and better finisher than Tom James as well.

Maybe, but he's still all but bombed for Wales. I like Brew, I love the effort he gives every time he steps onto the pitch and he comes across as a very humble guy, but he just hasn't been able to step-up and imo that's because up until now he's lacked that top to inches as they say. Tom James lacks a brain altogether at times, so Brew > James. I feel it is unfair to rule out Fenby already, but like I said he also appears to lack the rugby brain needed for anything above regional rugby.

 

[Draggs]

Well, Czekaj's top two inches is all hair.

...Yes...

 

[lucky number 7]

I would butt-in shouting Lydiates name here, but I'm really not sure he'll make the tour. However I will shout Ryan Jones' name instead. Despite playing second fiddle to Lydiate last season, I still think he had a better season than both Ferris and SOB. He had the best season of his career, and has started this season just as strongly. If he keeps it up I think he'll be a certainty to make the plane because he also brings genuine leadership and plenty of versatility. The difference he has made to the Ospreys in the last two games has been immense.

So yeah: Ryan Jones > Stephen Ferris > SOB.

Preparing for severe abuse from LN7 and BG8 in particular.

I'm not even mad.

I'm just a bit upset ..I thought you were a smart bloke..and that we could be friends...and play xbox together while talking about our feelings..


But you've ruined everything..you heartless *******

 

[dullonien]

I'm not even mad.

I'm just a bit upset ..I thought you were a smart bloke..and that we could be friends...and play xbox together while talking about our feelings..


But you've ruined everything..you heartless *******

Cuddles?

 

[lucky number 7]

Cuddles?

 

[GarethEWilliams]

Back row has to be Jones/Tuperic/Faletau with Warbs and Lydiate on the bench with Quinell in the squad too. This is obvious right?

 

[dullonien]

I'm less certain about the backrow than ever. Those mentioned as certainties have fallen out of form (Warburton, Denton) and Lydiate and Ferris are running out of time to make claim for a place on the plane. Ryan Jones, after a small wobble has re-emerged as a probable squad member. Heaslip's form against England has raised doubts over his place in the starting 15, whilst Faletau is re-emerging as a more credible option. Beattie is also putting his hand up. On form, Robshaw is currently the only shoe-in, with Tipuric my front-runner at 7. SOB's showing against Wales also puts him right up there.

So where the hell does that leave us?

06 Robshaw (possible captain)
07 Tipuric (best out and out 7 available by quite some distance)
08 Heaslip (but was out-played by Faletau in the opening 6 nations game, and was utterly rubbish yesterday)

20 SOB / Ryan Jones