Australia vs England - 3 Tests - June 2016

[Aristodemus]

The international game is flooded by mercenaries now, so why isolate Hughes for condemnation?

Personally my view is that you should have lived in a country as a child (<18) and been in the country a minimum of 5 years, regardless of blood ties. This isn't the IRB directive though and you can't blame anyone for acting according to the rules. I would much rather Hughes represented England than Te'o though, who smacks of someone who only wants to represent England as a second choice.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Because he's the first real "project" player we've had this era (can't speak for way in the past, maybe we've had more), and I hate all that ****.

We don't need to be waiting on some merc from the SH to become available years down the line. Pick a guy who's grown up dreaming on playing for his country, a guy who owes England's rugby systems.
Not some guy who captained another nation, grew up wanting to play for that nation, and now thinks "Hey wait a minute, England's match bonuses are way way bigger than Fijis!"


International rugby is not club rugby, and shouldn't be about making as much money as you can.
I don't even think that international sides should pay their players per game. Sure give them tournament win bonuses, but paying someone 10s of thousands of pounds to turn out for their country is just ridiculous. If they're not motivated without the money then they shouldn't be wearing the shirt in the first place.

 

[johnmac99]

International rugby is not club rugby, and shouldn't be about making as much money as you can.
I don't even think that international sides should pay their players per game. Sure give them tournament win bonuses, but paying someone 10s of thousands of pounds to turn out for their country is just ridiculous. If they're not motivated without the money then they shouldn't be wearing the shirt in the first place.

I completely agree with this.

They should get OOP expenses only and fair recompense paid to their clubs.

 

[Aristodemus]

How do you know Hughes is motivated by money? I think it is much more likely his motivation is ambition. These guys would all play for nothing if that was the standard, so would I if I were good enough.

 

[Tony Manx]

Because he's the first real "project" player we've had this era (can't speak for way in the past, maybe we've had more), and I hate all that ****.

We don't need to be waiting on some merc from the SH to become available years down the line. Pick a guy who's grown up dreaming on playing for his country, a guy who owes England's rugby systems.
Not some guy who captained another nation, grew up wanting to play for that nation, and now thinks "Hey wait a minute, England's match bonuses are way way bigger than Fijis!"


International rugby is not club rugby, and shouldn't be about making as much money as you can.
I don't even think that international sides should pay their players per game. Sure give them tournament win bonuses, but paying someone 10s of thousands of pounds to turn out for their country is just ridiculous. If they're not motivated without the money then they shouldn't be wearing the shirt in the first place.

Was it not Martin Johnson who was the first captain to lead or threaten to lead his team out on strike over money?

Far as I know only Catt was a "mercenary" in that squad.....so all true Englishmen who had presumably all dreamed of playing for their country!!

 

[ratsapprentice]

How do you know Hughes is motivated by money? I think it is much more likely his motivation is ambition. These guys would all play for nothing if that was the standard, so would I if I were good enough.

Err....

lol

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Because he's the first real "project" player we've had this era (can't speak for way in the past, maybe we've had more), and I hate all that ****.

We don't need to be waiting on some merc from the SH to become available years down the line. Pick a guy who's grown up dreaming on playing for his country, a guy who owes England's rugby systems.
Not some guy who captained another nation, grew up wanting to play for that nation, and now thinks "Hey wait a minute, England's match bonuses are way way bigger than Fijis!"


International rugby is not club rugby, and shouldn't be about making as much money as you can.
I don't even think that international sides should pay their players per game. Sure give them tournament win bonuses, but paying someone 10s of thousands of pounds to turn out for their country is just ridiculous. If they're not motivated without the money then they shouldn't be wearing the shirt in the first place.

Love to agree with you. But the international game is where the money is and it's understandable that those players who provide the spectacle get their share. I think rugby's lost a bit of its soul by going pro, but it has and the reality is that money talks. That genie's not going back in the bottle.

As for Hughes, blame the system not the player. And, bluntly, why would a player in his position choose Fiji over England? Ignoring the financial, the rugby case is pretty unanswerable too. Like it or not we offer the best facilities and the opportunity to regularly play in front of huge crowds and be in at the sharp ends of major tournaments. Most players, particularly with Hughes talent would want that opportunity.

But I wouldn't cry if all English players had to be born within 25 miles of Nelson's Column.

 

[Peat]

We've had this argument probably a good dozen or so times by now so I shan't be getting too involved. No one's going to change their mind and it's all irrelevant as, barring injury, Nathan Hughes will play for England.

I don't even think that international sides should pay their players per game. Sure give them tournament win bonuses, but paying someone 10s of thousands of pounds to turn out for their country is just ridiculous. If they're not motivated without the money then they shouldn't be wearing the shirt in the first place.

They pay their players because the guys who were motivated enough to do it for free decided the situation wasn't on.

As such, I flat out don't believe anyone who would claim that if you put them in the position of a professional rugby player, they wouldn't want payment for representing their country. Not after ten or so years of it. The idea they shouldn't be paid is absurd.

 

[McTallshort]

Anyone listened to the pod cast yet of last night's five live special with Eddie Jones?

 

[Maverick1987]

Anyone listened to the pod cast yet of last night's five live special with Eddie Jones?

Nope . Anything interesting in it ?

 

[McTallshort]

Yeah, he talked about Wade, where the tigers head coach is rumored to be going and loads of other things, Sonia what's her name shows herself up with her total lack of rugby understanding but otherwise it's worth a listen

 

[Maverick1987]

Where can I listen to it ? And what do you mean about the Tigers head coach ?

 

[RedruthRFC]

Anyone listened to the pod cast yet of last night's five live special with Eddie Jones?

I'm part way through it (my router decided to have a funny five minutes). I was a bit disappointed to be honest, I didn't think that there was much substance in anything Jones had to say, he struck me very much like a politician dodging any question relating to England.

I got the distinct impression that Christian Wade isn't the sharpest tool in the box - when given the opportunity to send a message to the England coach, is saying "YOLO" really making the best of it?!? I wonder if this stands against him with international coaches.

 

[McTallshort]

Where can I listen to it ? And what do you mean about the Tigers head coach ?

Aron is off to New Zealand for a job with the national team

 

[McTallshort]

I'm part way through it (my router decided to have a funny five minutes). I was a bit disappointed to be honest, I didn't think that there was much substance in anything Jones had to say, he struck me very much like a politician dodging any question relating to England.

I got the distinct impression that Christian Wade isn't the sharpest tool in the box - when given the opportunity to send a message to the England coach, is saying "YOLO" really making the best of it?!? I wonder if this stands against him with international coaches.

"Eddie were you impressed with Wade's 6 tries against Worcester?"

"I thought Alex here could have scored 3 of them in the shape he's in"

 

[RedruthRFC]

"Eddie were you impressed with Wade's 6 tries against Worcester?"

"I thought Alex here could have scored 3 of them in the shape he's in"

I'm not sure what point you're making. He certainly seemed pretty frosty on Wade - one of the few insights into the England camp that you could glean.

 

[McTallshort]

I'm not sure what point you're making. He certainly seemed pretty frosty on Wade - one of the few insights into the England camp that you could glean.

That was the point I was making, no matter how much that Sonia bird tried bigging him up Eddie seemed very indifferent.

 

[Aristodemus]

Err....

lol

I'm not sure how me or you can understand the inner motivation of him to be fair. Maybe it is naivety on my part but people don't reach the top level of sport (or very rarely) when money is their inner drive to succeed. It's about winning trophies, running out at HQ in front of 82k, these sort of things.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

I'm not sure how me or you can understand the inner motivation of him to be fair. Maybe it is naivety on my part but people don't reach the top level of sport (or very rarely) when money is their inner drive to succeed. It's about winning trophies, running out at HQ in front of 82k, these sort of things.

Naivety IMO.

- - - Updated - - -

Aron is off to New Zealand for a job with the national team

LOL please tell me you actually don't believe that.

 

[McTallshort]

Eddie and Ali Williams seemed convinced