A Political Thread

[ncurd]

It's precisely because of the EU's non-negotiable backstop plan for NI that could keep us subject to freedom of movement under this deal, and jeopardise the good friday agreement! Which is exactly why MP's keep voting it down!

We suggested the ******* backstop not the EU......

How does it subject us to Freedom of momevement? How does it jeopardise the GFA?

 

[ncurd]

That's not the point - the remain side made all of these false claims would come to pass just by the vote itself. Pure nonsense.

Please find me a single remain quote from the main camapign group that says it will happen because of the vote and not the actually leaving the EU.

I'll wait.

 

[ncurd]

Plus here's my thing about people 'knew what they were voting for' polls show that the Brexit Party is going to get around a third of the vote. They have no manifesto and refuse to answer questions on what they envision Brexit to be they won't even say they believe in no deal and WTO rules which is what many people tell me they voted for.

So a third of the voting populace are litreally about elect people which categorically nobody can say what they voting for obeyond some nebulous idea of Brexit which even that group won't define what it actually constitutes.

 

[Groundhog]

That's not the point - the remain side made all of these false claims would come to pass just by the vote itself. Pure nonsense.
What you're saying makes it even more laughable.

Yeah.... Right mate. Sure you're having a right giggle to yourself right now. Weird point to make on the vote affecting things but let's go there. Following the vote major companies like Bank of America, Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan, Morgan Stanley, Citigroup, UBS, HSBC (I can keep going here) have been shifting billions in assets out of London and into Frankfurt and a fee other locations. Nissan is halting plans they had to create their new line in Sunderland, that will go elsewhere. Honda has said they'll be out of the UK by 2021. 100 UK based asset managers have applied to be authorised here instead. I can go on and on if you want.
If you're not paying attention these moves wont we surface level yet, but a reckoning is coming. The amount of potential investment the UK has lost to other countries since Brexit is immeasurable. Your own government says they've missed out on 5 billion in infrastructure investment in the last year. I don't say this gleefully, it's awful for everyone.
Also speaking of lies, how's this gone?

 

[ncurd]

It should also be noted on science research grants investment in the UK has sharply dropped and EU based teams are far less likely to collaborate with UK partners they once did.

 

[Which Tyler]

As a ratio I agree that 52% to 48% looks very close.
But when you look at the actual votes that entails, leave won by 1.3 million votes.
That is huge.
That's more than the entire population of Birmingham.
So no - I definitely don't agree that it was close, I think leave won fair and square, and by quite a margin.

More democracy is always anti-democratic if the original democratic outcome of a referendum is completely ignored.

Utter nonsense yet again.

That's quite the double-think there.
It was close, but huge, and not close. It was fair and square despite breaking numerous electoral laws. More democracy is anti=-democratic really couldn't BE more Owellian - literally, you could have lifted that right out of 1984!

You're right though - you are spouting utter nonsense, with every sentence you type.

 

[Which Tyler]

Already hearing reports of several EU citizens being denied a vote because the council didn't have time to get the paperwork out to them

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-polling-booths-admin-errors?CMP=share_btn_fb

A nationwide picture is emerging of EU citizens in the UK being denied their democratic right to vote in the European parliament elections because of administrative errors by local councils.

Reports are coming in from across the country of EU nationals turning up at polling booths and finding their names crossed out and being told by officials they are not eligible to vote.

Dozens have contacted the Guardian to say that the forms they had to sign to declare they were choosing to vote in this country had either turned up too late or not turned up at all...


So much for legal, free and fair elections huh

 

[Which Tyler]

More and more reports of the same coming, along with some advice on handling it if you know anyone who's been effected:

 

[McTallshort]

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-polling-booths-admin-errors?CMP=share_btn_fb

A nationwide picture is emerging of EU citizens in the UK being denied their democratic right to vote in the European parliament elections because of administrative errors by local councils.

Reports are coming in from across the country of EU nationals turning up at polling booths and finding their names crossed out and being told by officials they are not eligible to vote.

Dozens have contacted the Guardian to say that the forms they had to sign to declare they were choosing to vote in this country had either turned up too late or not turned up at all...


So much for legal, free and fair elections huh

OK got some first hand experience on this one.

Just been to vote for the soap dodging hippie party and I enquired as to why my long suffering Polish wife had not received a poll card and it turns out that because she is a Polish citizen not a UK one she can vote in the EU elections in Poland but not here. If she could vote here she could technically vote here fly to Wrocrow and vote there too meaning she could vote twice in the same parliamentary election. The bloke was very knowledgeable and I thought his explanation made sense.

 

[ncurd]

Except his explanation is complete falsehood.

An EU citizen is allowed to participate in EU election of the country they reside in.

It's not the first instance by any means of presiding officers lying/now knowing what they are talking about.

 

[McTallshort]

Except his explanation is complete falsehood.

An EU citizen is allowed to participate in EU election of the country they reside in.

It's not the first instance by any means of presiding officers lying/now knowing what they are talking about.

Well he didn't seem to be the lying type and none of the poles and Romanians at work had poll cards.

 

[ncurd]

Well he didn't seem to be the lying type and none of the poles and Romanians at work had poll cards.

We will go for misinformed.

You still have to be registered to vote and the local authorities supposedly had to send out forms that you have fill out to say your not registered in your home country (because apparently that's an issue - it's not no more than requirements for voter ID are it's voter surpression). However there's been tons of stories of local authorities not sending the forms out in time or not processing them.

Apparently you have to 9pm to prove you are entitled to vote. If your presiding officer within the polling station is not helping you exercise your right to vote if you are entitled to do so by contacting their boss that actually is voter surpression and they are breaking the law. Not matter how knowledgeable they sound.

 

[ncurd]

Having read more basically if your wife is registered to vote she if either a G or K voter. G voters are those who did not fill out the form and K are those who did. If you did not receive a form your local authority have engaged in voter surpression.

 

[Which Tyler]

OK got some first hand experience on this one.

Just been to vote for the soap dodging hippie party and I enquired as to why my long suffering Polish wife had not received a poll card and it turns out that because she is a Polish citizen not a UK one she can vote in the EU elections in Poland but not here. If she could vote here she could technically vote here fly to Wrocrow and vote there too meaning she could vote twice in the same parliamentary election. The bloke was very knowledgeable and I thought his explanation made sense.

Yeah. He's wrong. Very, very wrong.

An EU citizen has to apply, and declare where they're voting, but suppressing that right is illegal.

 

[McTallshort]

Yeah. He's wrong. Very, very wrong.

An EU citizen has to apply, and declare where they're voting, but suppressing that right is illegal.

OK my wife voted in the General election, local council elections and Police Commission elections because she is a registered voter. She cannot vote in the EU elections because she is a Polish citizen not a UK one. Please don't take me for a naive fool. If my wife wants to vote in EU elections as a UK citizen she has to apply for UK citizenship as it is she has a Polish passport and can vote in her home town so she could vote at home town and by you reckoning here too meaning she could vote twice.

I have no cause to push here or any agenda and neither did the very obvious Liberal voter who I spoke to at the poll station

 

[McTallshort]

Having read more basically if your wife is registered to vote she if either a G or K voter. G voters are those who did not fill out the form and K are those who did. If you did not receive a form your local authority have engaged in voter surpression.

She was G but who is doing the surpressing?

 

[ncurd]

She really doesn't Tallshort we've explained the rules, I've checked with people who really are in the know (high up LD activists within Cheltenham who make it their business to understand electoral law). You can chose to believe us or not.

 

[Which Tyler]

OK my wife voted in the General election, local council elections and Police Commission elections because she is a registered voter. She cannot vote in the EU elections because she is a Polish citizen not a UK one. Please don't take me for a naive fool. If my wife wants to vote in EU elections as a UK citizen she has to apply for UK citizenship as it is she has a Polish passport and can vote in her home town so she could vote at home town and by you reckoning here too meaning she could vote twice.

I have no cause to push here or any agenda and neither did the very obvious Liberal voter who I spoke to at the poll station

I'm not saying you're naive, just wrong.

Why do you think thisnis such a big thing?
Why do you think the electoral commission have specifically reinforced that EU citizens had the right to vote in these elections?
Why do you think so many EU citizens tried (and succeeded) to vote today? Including my French wifish (not a UK citizen, and had her polling card before her "settled status")

She was G but who is doing the surpressing?

The person who turned her away and illegally prevented her from voting (assuming the relevant forms had been filed, if they hadn't, then herself for not doing so, possibly the council for not sending her the forms)

 

[ncurd]

She was G but who is doing the surpressing?

So this is where it gets complex,

Did she receive a form your local authority to declare she was only voting in this country? If no your local presiding officer and local authority have engaged in voter surpression.

Did she fill out said form before the given deadline? If yes your local presiding officer and local authority have engaged in voter surpression are duty bound to ensure you are allowed to vote. Failure to do so is voter surpression, the presiding officer within the polling station should also be following up if you believe that said form was filled out. Not telling you a cock and bull story about citizenship.

 

[ncurd]

The story coming out seams to be due to the speed in which these elections were held local authorities didn't send out the forms in time.

I have zero idea what the actual fallout will be probably the police deciding it's not politically convenient again.