[2019 Six Nations] England Squad

[BPM]

That's what I would go for, maybe Nowell or Daly over Joe, but I don't mind either really.

I'm not sure Genge has been outstanding enough to leapfrog Moon, let alone Mako. Other than that, I'd be happy with that side.

I like Genge a lot, but I feel like Moon deserves to stay in the picture.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Has Mako?
His scrummaging isn't great and he almost got binned for getting demolished by Willgriff John who is a passable prem standard scrummager at best.

Makos selling point is he's basically a number 8 - so is Genge, but he's way more brutal with it in the tight, Which is what our pack needs.
If we don't have someone with a bit of edge then POM is gonna rub our pack's faces in the mud all night.
Curry can't do all the scrapping by himself.

 

[BPM]

I take your point on the 'edge' element, but Genge has been no more than average/good since his return.

Mako's scrummaging has never been great. I'd go so far as to say it's an outright weakness, but I suspect any of our 1s will struggle up against Furlong and I think his other strengths balance it out in a way I'm not sure Genge would right now.

In other words, Mako has proved he can be a big contributor for England. Genge hasn't yet and I'm not sure I'd be keen to bank on him doing so in Dublin.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

How long till we are talking JJ back in the 13 shirt? And i never watched the bath game how did he get on?

The problem is it's quite hard to judge JJ fairly as Bath are pretty dire at the moment. We have virtually no ability to actually create space for our backs relying more on people busting through tackles. JJ doesn't do that but from what I saw, he is better than most Bath players at properly running straight and fixing the defender before passing out just before contact. English players as a whole are pretty poor at this and tend to either drift or pass well before contact so the defender never needs to commit to them.

 

[curtbob7]

I take your point on the 'edge' element, but Genge has been no more than average/good since his return.

Mako's scrummaging has never been great. I'd go so far as to say it's an outright weakness, but I suspect any of our 1s will struggle up against Furlong and I think his other strengths balance it out in a way I'm not sure Genge would right now.

In other words, Mako has proved he can be a big contributor for England. Genge hasn't yet and I'm not sure I'd be keen to bank on him doing so in Dublin.

Genge has been his usual monsterish self in the Scrum alongside Cole and Kerr/TPN. He's carried very well and hits hard. That puts him ahead of Mako 100%. Harsh on Moon but Genge has a higher ceiling and should be given a proper go before the WC.

 

[Scotty]

Genge has been his usual monsterish self in the Scrum alongside Cole and Kerr/TPN. He's carried very well and hits hard. That puts him ahead of Mako 100%. Harsh on Moon but Genge has a higher ceiling and should be given a proper go before the WC.

Yes genge is ahead in tge scrum but Mako hits hard to and also carries hard, can fix a defender and has a good passing/offloading game, as well as experience, genge is no way 100% above Mako. Im not saying genge shouldnt get a go im saying mako deserves more credit than your giving him.

Also Mako plays with the likes of george itoje billy and faz week in week out and when pretty much the entire irish teams spread across 2 teams you need players who are used to playing together, it will make a difference.

 

[BPM]

Absolutely. How many games has Genge played this season to 100% put him ahead of Mako? 3 or 4? At least a couple of those were not noteworthy either.

I'm with Scotty on this. I really rate Genge, I just disagree that he's ahead of Mako - definitely to the extent you're suggesting.

 

[curtbob7]

I don't think we're playing well enough to chuck Mako back in, sacrificing the scrum and relying on his open play antics. Neither is he, hes had so much time to adapt his scrummaging but time and time again he gets shown up. Its the last Six Nations before the world cup and Genge barely has any caps at all. I think he deserves a shot to create another option, form-wise and with how Moons performed I see no reason to drop him out the 23...this is why im saying Genge ahead of Mako right now. He has to have a chance in my eyes.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Good arguments, but quite apart from anything else I simply think Mako is more effective from the bench.

Bloody Marler.

 

[curtbob7]

Good arguments, but quite apart from anything else I simply think Mako is more effective from the bench.

Bloody Marler.

I agree, very effective from the bench and I see him as one of the top two LH's we have, hence naming him in my actual 23...but I just think it would be incredibly harsh on Ben Moon. This is Ireland in Dublin, we're gonna need nasty WUM's.

Yeah bloody Marler, Quins are laughing.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

There are plenty of arguments to start Mako, no denying that.
But fact is we're going up against the best tighthead in the world and against a pack with one of the biggest arseholes in the game*. I want the better scrummager and the bigger aggressor.
Tbh I'd consider starting moon and having genge and Mako fight for the bench spot, such is the importance of the set piece.




*POM is a **** but one of those guys who you'd love to have on your side but hate to play against

 

[Duck a l'Orange]

Jonathon Joseph's been added to the squad.

 

[MarkyH]

What? He's been out of action for a while, why rush him back? Let him play for Bath a few times first.

Tuilagi, Slade, Daly already in the squad as well as Teo. We don't need to rush him back.

 

[MarkyH]

https://twitter.com/bathrugby/status/1087738035448569856

 

[Scotty]

Maybe he thinks he will get out of training with england than he will from a prem cup game and he can see where he is at. EJ must have been impressed by him for Bath at the weekend.

Personally i think they should let him play the prem cup games, get him some game time. Then look at him for the second or even wait til 3rd game.

 

[Which Tyler]

Gotta say, he looked sharp against Wasps.
I'd bring him into the squad, release him to get game time against Gloucester, and be tempted to give him the 23 shirt against Ireland (but probably still give that to Nowell)

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Probably means Manu's carrying an injury.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Probably means Manu's carrying an injury.

He always is, I'd almost place a bet that He won't make every game without an injury.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Farrell's the one injured

 

[MarkyH]

He always is, I'd almost place a bet that He won't make every game without an injury.

Apart from the fact Tuilagi has played more games than Teo and JJ this season. And the tail end of last season.