The selction of Goode and Nowell does not surprise me at all. They fit into Lancasters plan of playing dull predictable rugby with a set gameplan. You only need to look at how long he kept selecting players like Barritt and Farrell to see this. Players who have individual brillance like May or Wade for example don't fit into that plan. I would imagine if you put May in New Zealands team he would flourish and turn into a world class player. Unfortunately England focus more on what players can't do than what they can. To me Lancaster is a very limited coach and his back room staff is also poor (Except Rowntree). This is the most talented group of players we have had in a long time but they are not filling their potential. You wont beat teams like NZ playing a predictable game plan you need players like May who can create that spark unfortunately we seem to be heading back to dark days of picking limited players like Goode and Nowell.
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[2015 Six Nations] Ireland vs England (Round 3)
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LiRFCMatt
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That's my opinion on him as well. Of course I'd love to see him excel at this level, but it doesn't seem possible.
lucky number 7
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He's only gotten 13 caps in three years though. I think you're judging him far too harshly for the potential he has shown and continues to show.
I've always had a soft spot for players like him however.
I like Wade also but he's going to be hamstrung by his physical limitations I reckon.
This might be true however there is a world cup 6 and a half months time. This is a competition where players need to show they are up to this level or the next line get his chance. We can't keep choosing players this year in hope they'll finally blossom, May had a good chance and he blew it in the first two games.
On equal measure Sam Burgess has the potential of becoming a true monster at Rugby Union but he's not playing because he still has a lot to learn. Are you suggesting he should be playing for England even though he's not up to it yet?
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Glawsfan I think you need to take off the Gloucester blinkers there a little by all accounts Nowell has been anything but limited for Exeter this season. I know we all have our favorite's from our clubs but Lancaster wouldn't be picking the players he has in the backline if he wanted a limited gameplan.
Goode is being selected because he has no other choice.
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j'nuh
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In attack, I agree. Well, at least, at this level. He doesn't have the same problems at club level. Which makes me think that the problem is more of a confidence one, one that should go away with more exposure to international rugby.
No? How do you figure this? None of his defensive mistakes have come from not knowing what to do.
Nowell and Yarde aren't as lanky as May is. May carrying in the short channels is a disaster waiting to happen. May needs to attack space and half-gaps in defences (note that May was originally a 13). His main asset is his turn of pace, which is absolutely useless when he has no room to work it in. I suppose the debate is whether Lancaster is failing May by not giving May the space to work in, or whether May is failing Lancaster by not being able to work within the parameters of how Lancaster uses his wingers. I personally find Lancaster's use of wingers to be extremely lacking, so I think it's the former.
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goodNumber10
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what potential is that, at this level?
He made one superb try scoring run against New Zealand in November, he made a good run against New Zealand in the spring Tours, but outside of that i'm struggling to think of a moment when watching i may i didn't have my face in my palm.
In contrast by the end of last years 6 Nations Nowell was most people starting 14 and he'd scored his first international try and Watson is on the score board in his 3rd game - i know they are playing 14 and May is playing 11 but wingers need to have that kind of impact.
and then we look at his defence...
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perhaps, but like i said others have had more of an impact so is it safe to assume they are more suited to the step up?
Because he looks constantly panicked when it comes down his channel, watch his shoulders, he's turning in then out then in then out just not knowing what to do - liek i said his decision making in defence is nearly as poor as in attack (at this level). He often shows the outside and then doesn't utilise the touchline effectively
It's really not, he could be looking to run off Fords shoulders, or offering himself off 9. He could be tracking ball as a cleaner (maybe i'm wrong but I don't recall seeing him doing this at all.
I understand what you're saying about wingers under Lancaster but other wingers have looked comfortable - maybe the point is that May's just not right for these structures.
Glad you can see it unfortunately the England coaching staff and some England fans can't. Don't worry though when we lose on Sunday they will find a new scapegoat.
lucky number 7
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He has actually been a huge , huge let down at club level alone from what I've seen and should be nowhere near an English squad.
May on the other hand is one of the top wingers in the Premiership and has shown brilliance at an international level and also a handful of flaws.
I don't think either of Mays performances would constitute having blown it either.
I'm a neutral observer , I don't give a **** about whatever club rivalries there are but being patient with May would be the best course of action IMO he's got too much talent to throw by the wayside for what some percieve to be substandard performances.
Statistically speaking May also far outplayed Watson in the Italy game.
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You speak of the defensive frailties of May while ignoring Three missed tackles out of 7 potential tackles from Watson?
May ran more with ball in hand , put Cipriani in for a nice try and didn't miss a single tackle....aside from the limp attempt to knock the 13 into touch for the try in the last throws of a dead game , although didn't count as a missed tackle due to the opponent coming to ground which is bizzare.
Believe me i'm not Gloucester bias. I have said 36 should not be in the England saquad I also think Kevesic shouldn't be playing. Nothing to do with Gloucester bias I say it how I see it. I wouldn't be overly annoyed it May was replaced with someone like Wade or if for example we had a world class winger coming back into the side. But for Nowell it seems a conservative move. You could also have moved Watson to FB where he plays for Bath and not played Goode but again SL has gone for the dull conservative option.
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He is also in the team of the tournament so far if you go by stats but people don't mention that is it goes against their agendas. Why change a winning team?
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He is also in the team of the tournament so far if you go by stats but people don't mention that is it goes against their agendas. Why change a winning team?
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Watson got a fair amount of flack for his defensive performance actually, plus he was unexpectedly playing out of position for most of the game and didn't butcher an absolutely nailed on try with an unfathomably poor decision. Watson does sometimes make wrong decisions within sight of the line for Bath actually, but nothing like that, and he does not as consistently seem to mess up for England as May.
When else has May messed up for England then?
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Nothing to do with agendas, it's just that stats are worse than useless when not paired with observation and understanding. If I was picking a team of thetournament based on stats, I'd just pick 6 fullbacks in the backline and expect scintillating running rugby because fullbacks always run the most metres.
Because any team can be improved, different teams play different styles, and a winning team against Italy is not necessarily a winning team against Ireland
goodNumber10
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I don't think anyone has ignored the fact that Watson has made mistakes, pretty much everyone flagged up the fact he fell off the tackle for the first Italy try in the England vs Italy thread. But i'm not sure pointing out that May did the exact same thing is really a great example of his defensive solidity.
stats are fine for a baseline but you have to look at the context those stats are collected under. Watson moved to 15 after 10 minutes(?), so a better comparison would be JJ's stats. how do they shape up?
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He often bites in when he shouldn't in defence, often doesn't pass when he should pass in attack, and frequently seems to fall over for no particular reason.
thechosenfamily
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Not so good
C Joseph 2/0 10 1/2/6 118 2 5 1 0 6/1 0/0 0 0/0
W May 0/1 0 1/4/11 97 2 3 1 1 6/0 0/0 0 0/0
Joseph has a missed tackle but then May's tackle doesn't really count.
This also mainly focus' on the Italy match, May had issues against Wales as well.
goodNumber10
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exactly.
Even then Watson at that stage was only his fourth internationla match, May his 13th - it's about right, he's dropped now, goes away works on what is needed and then comes back better for it.
**fourth start not international (I think)
Even then Watson at that stage was only his fourth internationla match, May his 13th - it's about right, he's dropped now, goes away works on what is needed and then comes back better for it.
**fourth start not international (I think)
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I would go for Dulin instead if I were you - looks like he'll replace Spedding.
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