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[2015 RWC] Warm Up Match: New Zealand vs Australia (15/08/2015)

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Only the most one eyed allblack would say he hasnt cheated and burned the rules of the game for over a decade.

Can you give us your definition of cheating along with a list of flankers over the years who haven't cheated during their career please?
 
Only the most one eyed allblack would say he hasnt cheated and burned the rules of the game for over a decade.

I agree he has pushed the boundaries of the laws (call it cheated if you like), just like EVERY OTHER FLANKER IN THE GAME. If the first player to the breakdown is not pushing the limits, then he's not doing his job!

Neil Back
Heinrich Brussouw
George Smith
Francois Pienaar
Jean-Pierre Rives
Richard Hill
Marty Holer
Owen Finnegan
Michael Hooper
David Pocock
Sam Cane
Matt Todd
Francois Louw
Chris Robshaw

These are some of the best flankers ever to pull on a jerseys for their country, THEY ALL CHEAT(ED), without exception. The only difference is that NONE of them were subjected to the campaign of gratuitous violence that McCaw has been the victim of.


Can you give us your definition of cheating along with a list of flankers over the years who haven't cheated during their career please?

I can do that for you. Following is a list of five international flankers who never cheated...

1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
 
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Exactly. Show me a forward who doesn't "cheat" (in these terms) and I'll show you a bad forward.

what tosh.

IMO a cheat is someone who sets out to deliberately deceive the powers that be (be that the match officials or the organising committee). A player who takes a chooses to risk whatever penalty the law book prescribes by knowingly breaking the laws of the game is far from being a cheat.

by definition that's exactly what he is.

To me, anyone who can't make that distinction doesn't understand the game and almost certainly never played it to any sort of level.

What level did you play to then seeing as how your opinion is so much more valid then everyone elses, you must have played cream of the crop by that statement.

Regardless people aren't talking about making those kind of decisions, they are talking about cheating in a manner that hinders the opposing team from playing rugby and stifling the flow and ultimately the ethos of the game.

In short, Dean Richards = cheat, Richie McCaw = flanker.

perhaps, but that doesn't mean what he does isn't cheating.

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I agree he has pushed the boundaries of the laws (call it cheated if you like), just like EVERY OTHER FLANKER IN THE GAME. If the first player to the breakdown is not pushing the limits, then he's not doing his job!

Neil Back
Heinrich Brussouw
George Smith
Francois Pienaar
Jean-Pierre Rives
Richard Hill
Marty Holer
Owen Finnegan
Michael Hooper
David Pocock
Sam Cane
Matt Todd
Francois Louw
Chris Robshaw

These are some of the best flankers ever to pull on a jerseys for their country, THEY ALL CHEAT(ED), without exception. The only difference is that NONE of them were subjected to the campaign of gratuitous violence that McCaw has been the victim of.

McCaw isn't the only player to ever get a few digs, Richard hill got knocked clean out in one of the biggest games ever, Brian O'Driscoll was assualted in the most heinous of manners on the rugby pitch in a potentially career and life threatening manner.

That still doesn't make anything that happens to McCaw ok, and him being subjected to that level of attention doesn't make his cheating ok, nor anyone elses.
 
by definition that's exactly what he is.

By what definition? Not by mine.

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What level did you play to then seeing as how your opinion is so much more valid then everyone elses, you must have played cream of the crop by that statement.

what tosh.

(see how constructive such posts are)

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If the first player to the breakdown is not pushing the limits, then he's not doing his job!

I'm reliably informed that that is tosh!
 
Even if you want to call it cheating (which I'm still not sure about. I understand he pushes it, and just btw I wasn't talking about not supporting your own body weight. I mean that there are blurred lines in a lot of player activity, not being able to roll away could be interpreted as purposefully trying to slow the ball down and therefore cheating). It's just funny how McCaw wears the label the most, and he hasn't been at his best at the breakdown for years now. And then it's like some backhanded compliment "oh but all good players do it." Yeah, I've not once heard anyone single out Pocock for being a good cheater. He's acknowledged for what he is, a good player. I see him do questionable things all the time in terms of technique and what he can get away with. Some times he gets it spot on within the confines of the law, other times he should be penalized. That does not make him a cheater.

Whatsoever.
 
Oh good God, yet another "Richie's a cheat thread": most of us realise that all referees/officials interpret the rules slightly differently ... in fact, the same referee can differ their rulings from one game to the next on the same rule, due to instructions from the referee's guiding body, or, just how they see things on a particular day. Does it not make sense for good players to test the boundaries, and modify their play accordingly (just as they have to adapt to the weather conditions, how the opposition is playing, and other factors)

My point is simple: how can you clearly define player's as cheats, given the above. Anyway, I'm over this topic: It's discussed over and over, and it holds about as much interest as the "Ban the Haka" threads.

On the topic; the Wallabies have a massive battle on their hands, given New Zealand's record at Eden Park, and the fact that the All Blacks will be hurting from their loss to Australia last week. It should be interesting to see if the AB's can establish dominance in the forwards, and how they will counter David Pocock when he comes off the bench.
 
What a bunch of crap, threads ruined.

Can we get back to focusing on the game.
 
Only the most one-eyed All Black hater could convince themselves that McCaw has not been the target of cowardly and violent foul play throughout his career and has not had far more than his fair share. I don't buy the "comes with the territory" or "he has it coming" boIIocks that some idiots like to trot out.

No other player in world rugby has ever been subject to the amount of malicious violence that this man has taken; he has been heat-butted, kneed in the face, punched, kicked, eye-gouged, head stamped and spear tackled many, many times, and in all that time, he has never retaliated in kind, never punched an opponent, never been cited or appeared before a judiciary and never been red carded.

THAT is the measure of this man!

For the record
Forearm to the face (Dean Greyling)
Forearm drop to the head (Dylan Hartley)
Knee to the head (Jamie Heaslip)
Eye gouge (Aurelien Rougerie)
Knee to the head (Scott Higginbotham)
Head Butt (Scott Higginbotham)
Swinging forearm to the head (Andy Powell)
Punched (Phil Waugh)
Head stomp (Ali Williams)
Knee to the head (Quade Cooper - twice)
Spear tackled (Lote Tuqiri)
Eye gouge (Kevin McLaughlin)
Swinging forearm to the neck (Phil Waugh)

If you (whoever is reading this) think he deserved everything he got then you're a prick!

You are right, mate. Richie McCaw is a gentlemen. Respect for him

I'm going to buy the last Saders jersey, isn't very nice but it the last worn by McCaw and Carter.
 
I came here expecting to see an interesting threat about NZ and Aus, I instead find the Richie McCaw civil war.
 
I came here expecting to see an interesting threat about NZ and Aus, I instead find the Richie McCaw civil war.

Everybody know that the Wallabies are going to win by 50 so we are talking about the McCaw's trivial things ;)
 
Really disgusted this thread turned into a McCaw cheats thread, it should be a celebration of how much this man has given the sport. 142 caps is nothing short of amazing, he's a genuine legend and good person, captain and role model for kids and adults. He's given the shirt off his back every time he's played for the AB's and he's always been worth 2 players. Tonight he will kill the Australians, especially after last weeks loss.
 
Really disgusted this thread turned into a McCaw cheats thread, it should be a celebration of how much this man has given the sport. 142 caps is nothing short of amazing, he's a genuine legend and good person, captain and role model for kids and adults. He's given the shirt off his back every time he's played for the AB's and he's always been worth 2 players. Tonight he will kill the Australians, especially after last weeks loss.
To add though this all started with the quade is dirty comments.
A crap player yes, but no more dirty than the next.
He who is in glass houses shouldnt throw stones.
 
If you blokes think open sides cheat, don't even get started on what blind side flankers get up to...
 
To add though this all started with the quade is dirty comments.
A crap player yes, but no more dirty than the next.
He who is in glass houses shouldnt throw stones.

What are you smoking mate? He kneed McCaw in the head deliberately. Richie never plays like that.
 
What are you smoking mate? He kneed McCaw in the head deliberately. Richie never plays like that.
Richie is a cheat. Well known.
Deliberate? Did he say it was or can kiwis now read minds to?
 
This thread will be closed soon if we can't get back on topic.
 
Oh my goodness! Before the match it is McCaw and after the match it will be the ref.......whoever it is today!!!

We should rename this site as it seems it is becoming only vaguely about Rugby!!
 
How is this even a debate? Clearly people like General Tah have a chip on their shoulder about New Zealand so they bring out the cheater card. For years it was about stealing players from the Pacific Islands. Now that's been debunked they've moved on to something else and creating another myth. If you honestly think pushing the limits is cheating that's fine, but let's call everyone for what they are in that case. Warburton and Pocock are nothing but dirty cheaters too in that case.
 
Drop it. Warning people. Banning for a week the next off topic poster. This is a match thread and only posts about the specifics of the match are allowed.
 
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