2013 Junior World Championship

[big ginger 8]

Exactly. What is happening is pretty obvious to anyone who looks into the issue, but unfortunately there are still a number of people out there that are willfully ignorant.



Are you just trolling? Otherwise wow. Just wow.

As has been explained time and time again, these players are New Zealanders. The vast majority were born in New Zealand (Peleseuma is the sole exception I can find). Grew up in New Zealand. All played for New Zealand Secondary Schools. All were involved in the NZ Under 20 training camps. The fact NZ has a policy of only selected players in the their final year of eligibility means these players have the opportunity to turn out for there country of ethnic origin while they are 19, before being selected for the New Zealand side in their final year of eligibility (which was always going to happen regardless of whether they turned out for Tonga/Fiji/Samoa the year before). How you interpret this as being 'cherry picked' is truly bizarre.



Where did you get that from? I simply stated the Māori are Pacific Islanders. As are Tongans. As are Cook Islanders. As are Uveans. Pacific Islanders simply refers to people from the Pacific Islands.



Great to see you know how to copy and paste: http://www.educationcounts.govt.nz/publications/pasifika_education/27772/2

I am quite aware of what the term 'Pacific Islander' means. Are you? As the text you have quoted states, each Pacific Society has its own historical, political and cultural uniqueness. Māori are not Tongans. Tongans are not Fijians. Niueans are not Samoans. They are all Pacific Islanders though.




Spot on. If the rules were changed so that U20 caps tied players to particular nations these sort of players would almost certainly not turn out for Tonga/Fiji/Samoa. This would certainly weaken these sides not only at U20 level, but also at test level, as it would greatly reduce their potential player pool in future.

Thanks must spread rep around before giving it to TRF_Darwin again.

 

[dullonien]

Why does this have to always come up and spoil threads? I always really enjoy the U20 WC, and would like this thread to discuss that and not some deluded concept of NZ poaching players.

 

[TRF_heineken]

I'm so glad that i am not the only one seeing sifplays many faults and that he's just here to stir up ****! He's a world class troll, reminds me of a few other Cape based members that has been banned before for the same nonsense.

To attempt to educate a New Zealander about NZ's history you sure need to have facts! By just spitballing here, will once again just make you a fool. Like when he said that Tuks Varsity Cup players shouldn't play Varsity cup because they are professional rugby players. Yet the only criteria for a player to be eligible to play Varsity Cup is that he has to be a registered student for one of the competing universities...

What a effing moron!

 

[Darwin]

Australia Under 20 squad for JWC 2013:

Forwards: Allan Alaalatoa, Mark Baldwin, Curtis Browning (captain), Jack Dempsey, Oliver Hoskins, Siotome Kavapalu, Phill Kite, Silatolu Latu, Maile Ngaumao, Matt Philip, Andrew Ready, Patrick Sio, Thomas Staniforth, Senio Toleafoa, Michael Wells.

Backs: Luke Burton, Chris Feauai-Sautia, Samu Kerevi, Brad Lacey, Jake McIntyre, Ben Meehan, Jock Merriman, Alex Northam, Harry Parker, Jonah Placid, Ulupano Seuteni, Henry Taefu, Waldo Wessels.

Not sure what to expect out of this side - traditionally Australia have been pretty competitive at this level (apart from last season), but have relied heavily on a handful of 'superstars' each tournament, as they probably lack the depth of the other top sides. The obvious stand-out in this seasons squad is Chris Feauai-Sautia. He is capable of playing at either wing or centre, but I expect we will see him starting most matches at centre, as Australia needs to get the ball in his hands as much as possible! Feauai-Sautia, Jason Emery, and Jan Serfontein are three of the most promising centres I have seen at this level, so it is interesting that they are all playing in the same tournament (again..).

 

[smartcooky]

I'm so glad that i am not the only one seeing sifplays many faults and that he's just here to stir up ****! He's a world class troll, reminds me of a few other Cape based members that has been banned before for the same nonsense.

To attempt to educate a New Zealander about NZ's history you sure need to have facts! By just spitballing here, will once again just make you a fool. Like when he said that Tuks Varsity Cup players shouldn't play Varsity cup because they are professional rugby players. Yet the only criteria for a player to be eligible to play Varsity Cup is that he has to be a registered student for one of the competing universities...

What a effing moron!

Being a glass half full sort of chap, I don't like to think of it as "spoiling" a thread, rather, as an opportunity to further the education of the pig-ignorant!:cheers:

 

[TRF_heineken]

Being a glass half full sort of chap, I don't like to think of it as "spoiling" a thread, rather, as an opportunity to further the education of the pig-ignorant!:cheers:

HA!

The problem with the pig however is, that he cannot comprehend the fact that he is wrong. How do you educate someone, who does not show any willingness to be educated, and also not realise that he is wrong??

 

[sifplay]

Being a glass half full sort of chap, I don't like to think of it as "spoiling" a thread, rather, as an opportunity to further the education of the pig-ignorant!:cheers:

Is that really necessary to be that offensive. As a muslim I find that very insulting and degrading. No need for that

I'm so glad that i am not the only one seeing sifplays many faults and that he's just here to stir up ****! He's a world class troll, reminds me of a few other Cape based members that has been banned before for the same nonsense.

To attempt to educate a New Zealander about NZ's history you sure need to have facts! By just spitballing here, will once again just make you a fool. Like when he said that Tuks Varsity Cup players shouldn't play Varsity cup because they are professional rugby players. Yet the only criteria for a player to be eligible to play Varsity Cup is that he has to be a registered student for one of the competing universities...

What a effing moron!

Here you are again. You barge into every threat then start throwing insults to -ersons you do not know or do not see from your -point of view. I know NZ history pretty well. First off all its hard to see proffesional players being Varsity students as they train monday to Friday and go on tours. The requirement for it is 18 Bona Fide students and not simply be registered and Tuks have broken that rule twice in two years. Young Pollard is in Argentina then going to play JRWC. Hard to see him doing his studies along with the rest of his team mates. There you have it and for the umpteenth stop with the insults. If you do not agree with someone tell them why and state your case. Swearing is not that as it shows a lack of education. Its nothing to sit behind a keyboard and swear at people who disagrees with you. Anyone can do that. Normally trolls do that. So go look in the mirror if you are looking for one.

Secondly ask a Kiwi what was the Fuzz when Christian Cullen and Braid were selected for the Moari team. Or ask him how the composition of the All Blacks would look if the Quota system used in South Africa were applied over there. Racism comes in many forms.

 

[LittleGuy]

Is that really necessary to be that offensive. As a muslim I find that very insulting and degrading. No need for that

Cave Dweller 3.0...how have you been?

 

[TRF_heineken]

Here you are again. You barge into every threat then start throwing insults to -ersons you do not know or do not see from your -point of view. I know NZ history pretty well. First off all its hard to see proffesional players being Varsity students as they train monday to Friday and go on tours. The requirement for it is 18 Bona Fide students and not simply be registered and Tuks have broken that rule twice in two years. Young Pollard is in Argentina then going to play JRWC. Hard to see him doing his studies along with the rest of his team mates. There you have it and for the umpteenth stop with the insults. If you do not agree with someone tell them why and state your case. Swearing is not that as it shows a lack of education. Its nothing to sit behind a keyboard and swear at people who disagrees with you. Anyone can do that. Normally trolls do that. So go look in the mirror if you are looking for one.

Secondly ask a Kiwi what was the Fuzz when Christian Cullen and Braid were selected for the Moari team. Or ask him how the composition of the All Blacks would look if the Quota system used in South Africa were applied over there. Racism comes in many forms.

Tell you what, how about you just browse on this forum alone, and look at the discussions regarding NZ, pacific islands, maori's etc. and see for yourself.

Not admitting you are wrong is the definition of ignorance. So get off your high muslim horse and just stop trying to be a know it all.

 

[psychic duck]

Cave Dweller 3.0...how have you been?

Cave Dweller was an Argentine. It isn't him.

 

[nickdnz]

Here you are again. You barge into every threat then start throwing insults to -ersons you do not know or do not see from your -point of view. I know NZ history pretty well. First off all its hard to see proffesional players being Varsity students as they train monday to Friday and go on tours. The requirement for it is 18 Bona Fide students and not simply be registered and Tuks have broken that rule twice in two years. Young Pollard is in Argentina then going to play JRWC. Hard to see him doing his studies along with the rest of his team mates. There you have it and for the umpteenth stop with the insults. If you do not agree with someone tell them why and state your case. Swearing is not that as it shows a lack of education. Its nothing to sit behind a keyboard and swear at people who disagrees with you. Anyone can do that. Normally trolls do that. So go look in the mirror if you are looking for one.

Secondly ask a Kiwi what was the Fuzz when Christian Cullen and Braid were selected for the Moari team. Or ask him how the composition of the All Blacks would look if the Quota system used in South Africa were applied over there. Racism comes in many forms.

1. Players often do study at universities...I used to see Victor Vito around campus quite a lot, while many players like Conrad Smith have finished prestigious law degrees while also being a professional rugby player. I do believe Jannie du Plessis is in fact a doctor - so despite playing professional rugby for a decade he's also clearly studying in South Africa for what is usually about 7 years..

2. You're now just bouncing around in terms of arguments. First it was that we poach, now its some vague reference to Cullen being selected for the NZ Māori. The reason that cause a bit of a stir (not so much at all for Daniel Braid), was that Christian Cullen was barely Māori in the sense that his heritage was reasonably vague. The NZ Maori team has quite an important cultural and historical meaning to some people, and the feeling was that it had to be used to genuinely represent Māori culture, rather than be used as a development squad. Most people didn't really care either way. None of this has anything to do with PI players being 'poached'.

3. What would NZ look like with the quota system that SA uses? Very grim. They are only a handful of black or coulered South Africans that I've met in New Zealand, and very few of them play rugby. It would be unfair to force them to play for our national team.

If you mean in terms of Pākehā, Māori or Pacific Islanders or w/e - I'm sure most would disagree with it. We have a fairly even blend of cultures within rugby, and I don't think a quota system would achieve much in terms of who plays, other than people would dislike selection on the criteria of race/ethnicity. Fail to see how that's racist. There is racism in every country of course, but you seem to have just taken a random punt at New Zealand, showing none of the historical nouse you apparently have of New Zealand...

 

[BZHopenside]

Just hoping the USA can pick up a win and maybe avoid the drop. That would be cool.

 

[smartcooky]

Is that really necessary to be that offensive. As a muslim I find that very insulting and degrading. No need for that

Sorry, but what did my comment have to do with your faith?

BTW, many of your comments clearly show that you have little if any idea about life in this country. Some things about a country can't be Googled you know; you have to actually live here or at least be here for some time in order to understand them.

First off all its hard to see proffesional players being Varsity students as they train monday to Friday and go on tours.

What on earth are you talking about?

The requirement for it is 18 Bona Fide students and not simply be registered and Tuks have broken that rule twice in two years.

Who or what are "Tuks" and what do they have to do with Pacific Island rugby players in New Zealand

Young Pollard is in Argentina then going to play JRWC. Hard to see him doing his studies along with the rest of his team mates.

Who is "Pollard"?

 

[norcalbuff]

Just hoping the USA can pick up a win and maybe avoid the drop. That would be cool.

That would be nice. Great experience for our young players regardless. Need to find a goal kicker to replace Hughes from last year.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Jennings ruled out of the England squad due to surgery being required on an injury - replaced by Henry Purdy

 

[big ginger 8]

Apparent Ireland Squad:

Full Name DOB (AGE) CM KG Position
Adam Boland 15/07/1993(19) 178 90 Prop
Edward Bryne 09/09/1993(19) 185 109 Prop
Jake Caulfield 07/02/1993(20) 191 120 Prop
Peter Dooley 04/08/1994(18) 186 109 Prop
Niall Horan 21/04/1993(20) 183 115 Prop
Brian Scott 09/03/1993(20) 192 122 Prop
Chris Taylor 11/03/1993(20) 183 113 Prop
John Andrew 26/05/1993(19) 183 98 Hooker
Brian Byrne 09/09/1993(19) 180 105 Hooker
John Donnan 16/02/1993(20) 195 110 Lock
Sean McCarthy 12/02/1993(20) 196 114 Lock
Gavin Thornbury 19/10/1993(19) 203 110 Lock
Conor Joyce 05/07/1993(19) 193 104 Flanker
Dan Leavy 23/05/1994(18) 193 103 Flanker
Ryan Murphy 05/03/1993(20) 185 100 Flanker
Peadar Timmins 08/01/1994(19) 189 97 Flanker
Josh Van Der Flier 25/04/1993(20) 186 98 Flanker
John Creighton 20/03/1993(20) 170 73 Scrumhalf
Luke McGrath 03/02/1993(20) 175 84 Scrumhalf
David Shanahan 20/06/1993(19) 173 79 Scrumhalf
Steve Crosbie 10/01/1993(20) 186 94 Flyhalf
Tom Daly 31/01/1993(20) 193 102 Centre
Mark Roche 25/01/1993(20) 173 89 Centre
Rory Scannell 22/12/1993(19) 180 94 Centre
Max McFarland 13/07/1993(19) 174 78 Wing
David Panter 03/02/1993(20) 180 88 Fullback
Rory Scholes 23/04/1993(20) 186 94 Fullback
Darren Sweetnam 05/05/1993(19) 187 90 Fullback

Bit underwhelmed no Henshaw or Olding so they're presumably going to America, Chris Farrall not recovered and no Adam Byrne for reasons I cannot fathom.

 

[Zed]

Their heritage states that the children always belong to their village. Most of them are born in NZ but grew up in Samoa or Fiji with a gran or other family member. The only reason the Kiwi's use them is to get other youngster to play for NZ as role models play a big part of their life. And it still do not explain anything from ripping their best youngsters away and taking them for yourselves. Even if they are born in NZ you took them born in Samoa and Fiji as well. So its really selfish and you should be helping them as a developing rugby nation rather than plundering them. But I suppose if you guys don't do it the French and English would take them.

I can only guess you're drinking? Australia and NZ are both very multicultural countries, there are a lot of Pacific islanders that emigrated to Aus & NZ to seek a better life for them and their kids. A lot of them that are Samoan or Fijian have never actually been to the country their parents were born in and are more Kiwi than islander. You're wrong, but then I suspect you know you are and are simply trolling for a reaction.

 

[big ginger 8]

Apparent Ireland Squad:

Full Name DOB (AGE) CM KG Position
Adam Boland 15/07/1993(19) 178 90 Prop
Edward Bryne 09/09/1993(19) 185 109 Prop
Jake Caulfield 07/02/1993(20) 191 120 Prop
Peter Dooley 04/08/1994(18) 186 109 Prop
Niall Horan 21/04/1993(20) 183 115 Prop
Brian Scott 09/03/1993(20) 192 122 Prop
Chris Taylor 11/03/1993(20) 183 113 Prop
John Andrew 26/05/1993(19) 183 98 Hooker
Brian Byrne 09/09/1993(19) 180 105 Hooker
John Donnan 16/02/1993(20) 195 110 Lock
Sean McCarthy 12/02/1993(20) 196 114 Lock
Gavin Thornbury 19/10/1993(19) 203 110 Lock
Conor Joyce 05/07/1993(19) 193 104 Flanker
Dan Leavy 23/05/1994(18) 193 103 Flanker
Ryan Murphy 05/03/1993(20) 185 100 Flanker
Peadar Timmins 08/01/1994(19) 189 97 Flanker
Josh Van Der Flier 25/04/1993(20) 186 98 Flanker
John Creighton 20/03/1993(20) 170 73 Scrumhalf
Luke McGrath 03/02/1993(20) 175 84 Scrumhalf
David Shanahan 20/06/1993(19) 173 79 Scrumhalf
Steve Crosbie 10/01/1993(20) 186 94 Flyhalf
Tom Daly 31/01/1993(20) 193 102 Centre
Mark Roche 25/01/1993(20) 173 89 Centre
Rory Scannell 22/12/1993(19) 180 94 Centre
Max McFarland 13/07/1993(19) 174 78 Wing
David Panter 03/02/1993(20) 180 88 Fullback
Rory Scholes 23/04/1993(20) 186 94 Fullback
Darren Sweetnam 05/05/1993(19) 187 90 Fullback

Bit underwhelmed no Henshaw or Olding so they're presumably going to America, Chris Farrall not recovered and no Adam Byrne for reasons I cannot fathom.

Apparently this squad is not set and is only to satisfy the IRB. Squad will be finalised after Scotland warm up game.

 

[norcalbuff]

No USA squad announced yet, but two warmup matches against Canada have been announced for May 4th and 11th in Minnesota. Presumably we'll at least get a list of who will be there and get a better idea of the JWC squad from that.

 

[norcalbuff]

USA u20 have 2 warmup matches against Canada u20 starting tomorrow. Here is the 23:

1. Korbin Lindell, Central Washington 2. Cameron Falcon, LSU and Trinity
3. Henry Hall, St. Mary's
4. Teli Veamatahau, Metropolis/Spearhead Rugby Academy
5. Nick Barrett, Metropolis/Spearhead Rugby Academy
6. Joel Smith, Glendale
7. Vili Toluta'u, Metropolis/Spearhead Rugby Academy
8. Ross Deacon, Landsdowne
9. Nick Boyer, UC Berkeley
10. Liam Bourke, UCD
11. Lemoto Filikitonga, Metropolis/Spearhead Rugby Academy
12. Jared Stewart, Newcastle
13. Mike Teo, Belmont Shore
14. Noah Tarrant, Las Vegas Blackjacks
15. Conor Kearns, Trininity

16. Casper Huizenga, Kutztown
17. Gary Vimahi, Metropolis/Spearhead Rugby Academy
18. Vei Tomasi, Las Vegas Blackjacks
19. Brendan Hardiman, SFGG
20. Zach Bonte, UCLA
21. Tom Bliss, Loughborough
22. Nu'u Aiava, Las Vegas Blackjacks
23. Dylan Audsley, St. Mary's