Super Rugby: Highlanders vs. Sharks in Dunedin (04/05/2013)

[Darwin]

We won a game! :bananarock::bananarock::bananarock::bananarock::bananarock::bananarock:

It wasn't the most convincing result - I was getting worried that Slade's poor goal-kicking was going to cost us. Slade's try was certainly a highlight, and without doubt a contender for try of the season. Woodcock and Hore had improved games, but the pick of the forward pack again for me was John Hardie. TJ Ioane had a pretty handy game too with ball in hand, while I was impressed with Dixon's defense once he came on.

Aaron Smith had a very good game for a second week in a row - he is so much better when he is playing his natural game. Apart from his poor goal-kicking I thought Slade had a pretty good game at 10, while Ellison impressed in his return at centre. The outside backs didn't get much ball (as I expected), but generally were pretty solid (Smith did have a couple of good runs though).

The Highlanders are off to South Africa next week - hopefully they can make it 2 wins in a row against a Kings side that was hammered by the Waratahs...

 

[Kiwiwomble]

We won a game! :bananarock::bananarock::bananarock::bananarock::bananarock::bananarock:

It wasn't the most convincing result - I was getting worried that Slade's poor goal-kicking was going to cost us. Slade's try was certainly a highlight, and without doubt a contender for try of the season. Woodcock and Hore had improved games, but the pick of the forward pack again for me was John Hardie. TJ Ioane had a pretty handy game too with ball in hand, while I was impressed with Dixon's defense once he came on.

Aaron Smith had a very good game for a second week in a row - he is so much better when he is playing his natural game. Apart from his poor goal-kicking I thought Slade had a pretty good game at 10, while Ellison impressed in his return at centre. The outside backs didn't get much ball (as I expected), but generally were pretty solid (Smith did have a couple of good runs though).

The Highlanders are off to South Africa next week - hopefully they can make it 2 wins in a row against a Kings side that was hammered by the Waratahs...

just imagin if TJ was at 6 and dixon at 8 at the start

darwin, any idea who Maritino Nemani is? looked him up on wiki but no idea we were drafting in more guys

 

[Larksea]

this game was actually pretty epic

TJI was really good carrying, I think it's planned for him to carry like crazy and come off after 60min or so when he did his legs must have been burning.

Ben Smith was just... well he was very Ben Smith wasn't he.

100m+
linebreaks
offloads
the works

Better from slade, in particular goal kicking in the 2nd half

Aaron Smith is looking more ben smith now, much better form.

Ben Smith

 

[Draggs]

this game was actually pretty epic

TJI was really good carrying, I think it's planned for him to carry like crazy and come off after 60min or so when he did his legs must have been burning.

Ben Smith was just... well he was very Ben Smith wasn't he.

100m+
linebreaks
offloads
the works

Better from slade, in particular goal kicking in the 2nd half

Aaron Smith is looking more ben smith now, much better form.

Ben Smith

You forgot Ben Smith, he had a good performance.

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

just imagin if TJ was at 6 and dixon at 8 at the start

darwin, any idea who Maritino Nemani is? looked him up on wiki but no idea we were drafting in more guys

He was in the Chiefs squad last year, a wing from HB. Only got a couple of games for the Chiefs, they opted to use Tikoirotuma instead.

Quite a strong runner, but like many others can be a bit weak on defence.

 

[Darwin]

just imagin if TJ was at 6 and dixon at 8 at the start

darwin, any idea who Maritino Nemani is? looked him up on wiki but no idea we were drafting in more guys

That would make sense, but I'm not sure Joseph is a fan of dong things that make sense

As Invictus mentioned Nemani is a big powerful ball runner from Hawke's Bay. He is not that tall (under 6') but is over 100kg's, and would definitely be one of the most powerful wings in the country, and is also deceptively quick (think Rene Ranger with ball in hand). He has also played quite a bit at centre, but isn't a big fan of passing the ball so is probably better suited to the wing. He hits very hard in the tackle, but can be a bit reckless at times (with high tackles / spear-tackles), and his defensive positioning is a bit suspect. He has the potential to be a very dangerous wing at this level but at this stage he still has a few rough edges to his game....

 

[admartian]

I missed this game. But good on the Highlanders for getting a win! I read that TJ and Ben Smith had good games. Not surprising at all to me!

BTW is TJ Ioane AB eligible (not that I think he should be picked right away or anything, especially with Luatua playing so well)? Just curious.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

good highlights here

 

[admartian]

^Thanks mate.

-That kick for the Treeby try was brilliant.
-The Boks are gonna have a field day with the ABs if we can't stop that rolling maul from the lineouts (legally) that led to that Bosman try.
-Mvovo's try was brilliant. Great catch and pass from Bosman.
-Great quick tap try by Aaron Smith.
-Slade needs to be more accurate.
-Ben Smith is brilliant setting up that Slade try. Great rapport with Aaron.
-Good draw and pass to the 2nd Bosman try.
-Good last stand - great tackle by Slade to stop Bosman short. Sharks had numbers out wide to the right. Should've scored.

 

[donmcdazzle]

I missed this game. But good on the Highlanders for getting a win! I read that TJ and Ben Smith had good games. Not surprising at all to me!

BTW is TJ Ioane AB eligible (not that I think he should be picked right away or anything, especially with Luatua playing so well)? Just curious.

Yeah TJ went to Wellington College, definitely eligable although if he was ever picked for the AB's then we would be in serious trouble.

 

[smartcooky]

^Thanks mate.

-That kick for the Treeby try was brilliant.
-The Boks are gonna have a field day with the ABs if we can't stop that rolling maul from the lineouts (legally) that led to that Bosman try.
-Mvovo's try was brilliant. Great catch and pass from Bosman.
-Great quick tap try by Aaron Smith.
-Slade needs to be more accurate.
-Ben Smith is brilliant setting up that Slade try. Great rapport with Aaron.
-Good draw and pass to the 2nd Bosman try.
-Good last stand - great tackle by Slade to stop Bosman short. Sharks had numbers out wide to the right. Should've scored.

What really, really annoys me is seeing the tactics the NZ teams are try to use when defending the rolling maul. Too many times I see NZ teams with two players in a maul, trying to stop a five or six man SA team maul from grinding forwards. Its not working, and the reason its not working is not rocket science; nor is the solution...... COMMIT NUMBERS!!!!

There is no point having just #2 AND #6 in the maul trying to hold back several opponents, while #1, #3,#4 and #5 are sea-gulling around the offside line as pillars. Two players in a maul are NOT going to stop 5/6 opposing players from pushing them backwards, and if their maul is being pushed back, the pillars are going to be constantly back-pedalling anyway and likely to be wrong footed if there is a break.

Those sea-gulling players need to commit to the maul and push, keeping their heads up and watching for the break

 

[Larksea]

yeah, I also hate seeing players go up the side and then kinda just sit there doing nothing and eventually just peel off and wander back. Heck if you find yourself off the side get the heck back behind the maul and do something

kiwi teams been nailed by lineout drives in particular over the last few weeks but I also think the refs are not being observant enough on attacking teams at the maul/drive, a lot of obstruction, off side, detach and re attaching going on by mauling sides. Does seem that the refs are mostly looking at the defenders when the drive is on. Hardly an even contest.

 

[admartian]

What really, really annoys me is seeing the tactics the NZ teams are try to use when defending the rolling maul. Too many times I see NZ teams with two players in a maul, trying to stop a five or six man SA team maul from grinding forwards. Its not working, and the reason its not working is not rocket science; nor is the solution...... COMMIT NUMBERS!!!!

There is no point having just #2 AND #6 in the maul trying to hold back several opponents, while #1, #3,#4 and #5 are sea-gulling around the offside line as pillars. Two players in a maul are NOT going to stop 5/6 opposing players from pushing them backwards, and if their maul is being pushed back, the pillars are going to be constantly back-pedalling anyway and likely to be wrong footed if there is a break.

Those sea-gulling players need to commit to the maul and push, keeping their heads up and watching for the break

Completely agreed. It's been too commonplace the past year or two with NZ teams.

It's a numbers game; Don't get scared by if or when they spin it out wide or run it as they'll just have as many (or less) men to attack with as you do. It's simple, basic math - Team A commits 8 players into maul, Team B commits 8 players = both teams are left with 7 each to either attack or defend with (it's not like they're asked to write an essay on this subject: LINK). You either match the numbers; or send enough to halt or slow the advance (i.e. a team like the Chiefs can probably afford to send 1 or 2 less players if Tameifuna is involved ).

Athletes these days are supposed to be smarter....

It's failure to recognise these sort of tactics and address them that make me facepalm when watching sports. Drives me nuts.

 

[Larksea]

heh yeah, big "bee sting" ben (my new nickname for him because he's all swollen up like he's got a bee sting)

he is definitely using his ~140kg's well

I think the worst think is deliberate penalties that result in yellow cards in this area. Heck it is just not worth doing something obviously illegal to stop close in tries. If they are gonna score they are going to score. It's vary rare a player will save a try but give away a yellow card that the opposition doesn't eventually get a scoreboard advantage from. Urgency and technique are far better options.

 

[admartian]

heh yeah, big "bee sting" ben (my new nickname for him because he's all swollen up like he's got a bee sting)

he is definitely using his ~140kg's well

I think the worst think is deliberate penalties that result in yellow cards in this area. Heck it is just not worth doing something obviously illegal to stop close in tries. If they are gonna score they are going to score. It's vary rare a player will save a try but give away a yellow card that the opposition doesn't eventually get a scoreboard advantage from. Urgency and technique are far better options.

Or you know; basic physics.

800kgs vs 850kgs is much better than 250kgs vs 850kgs when it comes to two forces jostling for momentum and ground.

 

[Draggs]

Or you know; basic physics.

800kgs vs 850kgs is much better than 250kgs vs 850kgs when it comes to two forces jostling for momentum and ground.

Cue Feic and some random physics equations...

 

[austingtir]

Completely agreed. It's been too commonplace the past year or two with NZ teams.

It's a numbers game; Don't get scared by if or when they spin it out wide or run it as they'll just have as many (or less) men to attack with as you do. It's simple, basic math - Team A commits 8 players into maul, Team B commits 8 players = both teams are left with 7 each to either attack or defend with (it's not like they're asked to write an essay on this subject: LINK). You either match the numbers; or send enough to halt or slow the advance (i.e. a team like the Chiefs can probably afford to send 1 or 2 less players if Tameifuna is involved ).

Athletes these days are supposed to be smarter....

It's failure to recognise these sort of tactics and address them that make me facepalm when watching sports. Drives me nuts.

Its not just numbers its poor technique and the SA rolling maul's have been the best i have seen in a very long time. NZ teams need to start using it more thats the only way imo that they will really learn to combat it properly.... Ali Williams has been about the only NZ lock i have seen that seems to be capable of semi legally breaking one down almost by himself by pulling his body through the opposition players as they are rolling it up and attaching himself to the ball carrier. I dont like the guy but the AB's pretty much have to select him this year just based on that alone.

I have seen plenty in the last couple of weeks where we have comited enough numbers but still pretty much been blown out of the way.

NZ teams when they get in that 10 metre zone with a lineout are still going one man off rather than setting a maul. It should be standard practice for our teams to do it everytime imo. In fact i think the NZRU or Hanson should step in and direct our super franchises to do it.

 

[Larksea]

If you saw the Brumbies v Crusaders match tonight you would have seen Craig Joubert do exactly what you are asking. Twice he penalised players (one from each team) for putting their hands on the ground beyond the ball.

yes he did, but it was twise out of about a dozen instances of players doing it. Wasn't that impressed with Joubert.

 

[SomeOke]

What about the tactic where you just don't engage in the maul? It was briefly popular for a while but it seems to have gone out of style, just let them make a meter and force the obstruction? You win a penalty out of it as well not just a turn over.

 

[smartcooky]

What about the tactic where you just don't engage in the maul? It was briefly popular for a while but it seems to have gone out of style, just let them make a meter and force the obstruction? You win a penalty out of it as well not just a turn over.

Like this?




Possible, but difficult to do at a line-out, because you cannot come around and tackle the ball carrier until the ball has left the line-of-touch (you would be offside if you did).

Timing has to be near-perfect.

Having said that, I agree. I don't see why more teams don't try this when they are being mullered at maul time.