Steffon Armitage wanting to play for France.?!

[goodNumber10]

We're not exactly losing players by the bucketload, either. Most players who have gone haven't been regular internationals - think it's only really Haskell, Wilko and Delon Armitage that have gone, and Haskell turned down contracts to come back.

Haskell was a little different I think... Think he'd just had enough of all the cr*p around Wasps and wanted a different experience, think that was backed up by doing japan and New Zealand on short term contracts.

Just IMHO obviously.

 

[FrenchFan]

From the the Rugby Paper Armitage is "Apparently" is looking to use a 7s loophole for the Olympics which would mean he could play for France XV.

Ben Ryan talks about Eligibility here.

ELIGIBILITY. As its Olympic Qualification next year, it means all players have to be qualified under Olympic eligibility rules and that means they have to have a passport for that nation. No exceptions. As you have seen with Halai’s exclusion from the NZ sevens side to compete at the Commonwealth Games (they have the same eligibility criteria), not everyone that has played international sevens also holds a passport for that country. Qualifying on residency is a lot easier than getting a passport in nearly every competing country so there will be players next season that will not be able to play for their respective teams until they have a passport. Having seen at first hand the pacific players in other countries teams playing under residency criteria, it might now be the time to look at this globally and see whether three years is just too short a time frame to become eligible to play for another country. I haven’t got a firm opinion on this but targeted poaching happens in other Olympic sports and this whole area needs a careful eye kept on it to see how it develops.

SWITCHING NATIONS. A ripple from this is a window that will also exist next year for players to effectively ‘switch’ countries back to a country they have a passport to. Ill try to explain this as simply as possible, so: If you haven’t played for 18 months for one of the “capped†teams in the nation you have already played for, AND hold a passport for another country then you can play in next year’s series for that country. Interestingly, once you make the switch, you are then available to be chosen for the nations XV’s test side too. You cannot switch back. After this season, the 18 months will go up to 3 years and the switch can only happen in an Olympic qualifying event or the Olympics itself, so if you don’t do it next season then its not again possible until the actual Olympics. If it I put this into a practical example, I will use Josh Drauniniu â€" sure you don’t mind Josh! Gets you some airtime! He played for England 7s in 2011 and hasn’t played for any other national England sides since. He holds a Fijian Passport (as well as a UK one) as was born and raised in Fiji so would be eligible for me to select if I wanted to and he wanted to. He could then play for Fiji at national 15’s level. Let me just make clear that this is just an example and not a clever ploy to lure Josh to back to Fiji! I just know the timings in this example in this and it just illustrates the point and also shows you that players do exist out there in this -

See more at:
http://ur7s.com/news/ben-ryan-goes-...ything-you-need-to-know-#sthash.WRuGeAPY.dpuf

Will post TRP link when it comes up online.

Thought I should make a separate thread as I don't know if this should go in England or France.

Bienvenue to Steffon & his bro

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

We're not exactly losing players by the bucketload, either. Most players who have gone haven't been regular internationals - think it's only really Haskell, Wilko and Delon Armitage that have gone, and Haskell turned down contracts to come back.

Flood was before he announced a regular in the 23, but he wanted to start more so decided to walk, don't know how he would fit in the French team though.

 

[Peat]

There is no case in which I support players changing national allegiances in tier one international rugby once that first cap has been given. That should be it. To remove that line, consider how much players are moving now, risks farce. I would rather the farce of a player representing one team in Olympic Sevens and another in All Other Rugby than see a line of Saffas and Kiwis waiting patiently for their French passports.

Within that though, if Steff wants to do it, why not. Players have been been using the fluidity of international qualification to their advantage for a while now, why not him as well? I'm not going to judge him for making that choice.

I am a little irritated though. It's not often England lose out on international players we'd have liked, we don't have the practice. The Scots/Irish usually have the good grace to pick them when they're too young for us to notice. Talk about Lancaster not wanting him is possibly wide off the mark - it's certainly accusing him of being a liar, he's expressed an interest quite a few times.

p.s. While France hasn't got too many of our best players yet, I'd wait until after the World Cup cycle turns to start celebrating.

 

[Big Ewis]

Bienvenue to Steffon & his bro

tsk, pfff....such an arrogant reply...

Seriously though if this happens, and he actually makes the xv de France, he'll be soooooo hated by the English it would be hilarious :lol:
5 caps for England, 28yo...that's like the equivalent of...Antoine Burban who for some reason has binds with England and goes play for them in 3 years or smt we'd hate his guts :lol:

 

[goodNumber10]

p.s. While France hasn't got too many of our best players yet, I'd wait until after the World Cup cycle turns to start celebrating.

that's a fair point, but i don't think we should worry about it now... or change the rules when it happens.

I have no grievance against people wanting to earn a crust, it is a job after all, but if people don't value playing for their country enough so be it. We're a huge country, with immense resources, our structures should be good enough to handle departing players and we just saw that we're not massively off that with some third stringers stepping up on the summer tour.

tsk, pfff....such an arrogant reply...

Seriously though if this happens, and he actually makes the xv de France, he'll be soooooo hated by the English it would be hilarious :lol:
5 caps for England, 28yo...that's like the equivalent of...Antoine Burban who for some reason has binds with England and goes play for them in 3 years or smt we'd hate his guts :lol:

do you reckon? I think apart from a miserable few no one will give a t*ss, i don't think either he or Delon are particularly liked in the UK, certainly Delon is not a very well liked man within the professional circles so i doubt there is much change to the status quo there.

I think the bigger issue is it makes our international selection criteria a mockery, sold down the river for a spot on the Olympic's.

 

[Patchey]

I can't imagine him doing this to be honest. I guess the lure of an Olympic Games and maybe, if the loophole does allow him to then play XVs rugby, more test caps might be a draw, but he seems like a fairly decent bloke from the interviews and features I've read on him.

Even if it did happen and he was selected for the 7s team, I'm almost certain the RFU would mount an appeal to the IRB if he then tries to play XVs, just like the Welsh appeal over Shingler's eligibility with Scotland.

If he DID play 7s or 15s for France I'd be very disappointed. As has been pointed out, he went to France knowing full well that a move to Toulon would out his international career on ice, if not end it permanently. To try and have his cake and eat it by remaining at Toulon and trying to use a loophole in the eligibility laws to play for France would be pretty crass.

Of course this is all a rumour from The Rugby Paper so...

 

[ratsapprentice]

Of course this is all a rumour from The Rugby Paper so...

His dad (who posts on a different forum) doesn't seem to be denying it!

 

[j'nuh]

This Olympics nationality thing... what does this mean for players that play for GB? Do you suddenly become eligible for any of England, Wales and Scotland? For example, could Shingler use it to go and play for Scotland? Or if another nationality player did it, would they become eligible for any of the three?

 

[goodNumber10]

His dad (who posts on a different forum) doesn't seem to be denying it!

what forum is that then?

 

[Peat]

that's a fair point, but i don't think we should worry about it now... or change the rules when it happens.

I have no grievance against people wanting to earn a crust, it is a job after all, but if people don't value playing for their country enough so be it. We're a huge country, with immense resources, our structures should be good enough to handle departing players and we just saw that we're not massively off that with some third stringers stepping up on the summer tour.

Oh don't get me wrong, I am definitely against changing the rules. We'd lose far too many players to the French league if the rules changed.

That said, I have a suspicion that post WC we'll see a lot of fringe players making their way over the channel. The English national team will probably be ok, but its not entirely impossible that, say, Northampton, could end up losing Foden, Dickson and Myler. Or Leicester might lose Allen, Sarries Strettle... that sort of player. Completely absorbable by the national team, but really putting our top teams under pressure.

 

[ratsapprentice]

what forum is that then?

rugbynetwork

 

[goodNumber10]

ah, ok. is that still going, i couldn't really get into it find the layout really unfriendly.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Yeah - the forum structure itself is archaic - but the club forums are all pretty active, save for Gloucester's, because they have shed-web.

 

[Big Ewis]

well I quite like the archaiquity of the website. Things simple are the best, and inductively Tetris is the greatest game of all time.

So hey, when will we know when Steffonmitage takes his decision to play basketball for France ?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

In two years when he's eligible for a passport.

 

[Big Ewis]

In two years when he's eligible for a passport.

oh well thank you there Oliver. It's such a cold world out there...and I put in so much effort into my posting, being as coherent as possibility and all...and yet, I'm sometimes left hanging like a small bat who just shat diarrhea all over itself, dripping softly all over its face, sometimes.
Two years though ? fk that. He'll be grampa Armittage at that point and will have won about 5 more H Cups. Plus, a large number of us might turn to another sport during that time, like grass hockey. Two years is just too long...fk it. Let's bump this thing in about 6 months, see if we still care.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I'm presuming it's two years, anyway.
A lot of places are saying he could be eligible for the RWC, but these are all twitter/facebook pages and not actual media sources. I think they're confusing the old IRB nationaly requirements with the new one, and thinking that you can get a passport after 3 years and not 5.

 

[munstermuffin]

I'm presuming it's two years, anyway.
A lot of places are saying he could be eligible for the RWC, but these are all twitter/facebook pages and not actual media sources. I think they're confusing the old IRB nationaly requirements with the new one, and thinking that you can get a passport after 3 years and not 5.

The only thing Olyy and I could be completely wrong but maybe the years spent their as a kid are taken in to account.

 

[goodNumber10]

I think it is continual residence afaik.