Should Robshaw Captain England?

[j'nuh]

I'd like to see Marler in the England EPS, even if he doesn't play. 5th props rarely get called upon, particularly when the props in front of them are young and less likely to break down. (And if it gets to that point, we can always call someone else up if we don't trust Marler to play.) I think training at the highest level could help Marler bring on his scrummaging and it would be nice to develop him sooner rather than later.

Also, Trinder is going to have a hard time pushing Tuilagi out, unless Leicester continue playing Tuilagi as a 12.

EDIT: halfway through Gloucester-Wasps. Jonny May for the England 22 shirt? He's in form, can play 11, 13, 14, 15, and he's very young...

 

[Patolski]

Tom Guest anyone?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I really like Tom Guest - would consider him if Robshaw was at 6, but if Croft is then I wouldn't as that'd be a very lightweight backrow (very pacy and great in openfield, but lacking in grunt)

 

[Patolski]

Wouldnt quite call him lightweight, the 4 years ive been at quins watching him develop hes never seemed to lack size or physicality

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

After the world cup I felt there were quite a few positions in which it was far from clear who our best player was, but by this stage in the domestic season I think the form of some players and lackof form of others has filled in the gaps.


1. Marler
2. Hartley
3. Cole
4. Lawes
5. Palmer
6. Robshaw
7. Wood
8. Waldrom
9. Youngs
10. Flood
11. Wade (Not a right-winger, but he'll be alright!)
12. Barritt
13) Tuilagi
14. Ashton
15. Foden

16. Corbisiero
17. Gray
18. Attwood
19. Croft
20. Care
21. Farrell
22. Armitage

 

[Peat]

Marler got buttf**ked by Gill. He is really not ready.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Was about to say the same - he needs a year or two to improve his scrummaging before looking at him in an England shirt.
Wouldn't mind him playing for the Saxons over that period though!

 

[psychic duck]

Seriously Marler is a pants scrummager, decent in the loose, but will cost you in the scrum, not good enough for Saxons either imo

Sheridan, Corbisiero, Mullan, Golding, Wood are all better (even Payne and Freshwater are probably better)

 

[j'nuh]

@Henry:
Wade? After his performance against Glos? Really? I'm already terrified at the idea of North running at him/competing in the air with him. I'm not even convinced he should make the EPS.
Also, Burns ahead of Farrell.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Unless you want Matt Banahan then everyone's going to struggle with North in the air - he's huge.

I'd have Sharples ahead of Wade, anyway.
Would definitely have Wade in (at least) the Saxons over the 6N, though - get some game time with them and then perhaps have him on tour in the summer.

 

[Peat]

Its going to be a struggle for Sharples. Its a more or less forgone conclusion with Wade.

But yeah, Wade hasn't scored a try in 4 games, and his defence is still dodgy. And Attwood's not in form.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I thought Attwood has been one of the best performers for Bath recently - then again, that doesn't say much.
Wade's still the top try scorer this season, despite not scoring for a while

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

As Olly said, Wade is still the Premiership's leading try scorer, and I don't think that can be ignored, especially given this supposedly clean slate and fresh start the England EPS will be getting. Add to this that Wade has been playing behind a Wasps pack who don't know the meaning of the words 'go forward'. Our backline has lived off scraps and credit should go to them for scoring any tries at all(rant about Wasps pack now over.......for now). I had literally forgotten about Sharples, shame on me! This said, on current form he may be slightly behind Wade. Also, I really don't think Wade's defence is so bad. He uses his body weight effectively, theres just not much of him! He reads the game very well and doesn't drift and become absent in the way Varndell often does. He's the least of Wasps' defensive worries (though I suppose this says more about how poor Wasps are at the moment rather than how good Wade's defense is)

Marler: I knew people would say that his scrummaging isn't up to scratch, and I know there's truth in that. I do think Corbisiero deserves to start more than Marler but at the same time Corbs offers versatile bench cover. If Marler can improve the technical side of his scrummaging, I think a front-row of him, Hartley and Cole would be difficult to push around, and bearing in mind that front three are also all prettyy decent in the loose, I think we'd be well set. This said, I'm not 100% convinced myself about my call for Marler to start...

Attwood: All i can say is that we have a bunch of guys who could be great locks, very few of them are really on form however. I think Attwood has looked strong all over the field in the couple of times I've seen him for bath. I think his physicality off the bench could prove useful, and he's also not too shabby at the lineout. Guess I just like him as a player.

Farrell: I think his cover of 12 as well as 10 could be invaluable. Also, offers slightly better goalkicking than Burns? In general I've been impressed by his ability to control a game and play tactically. I think being part of a winning side has really helped him.

Many of the choices I made for my 22 are debatable, but I guess that's good in that there's always other options, and I can think of few match day 22's which offer such versatile cover all over the park as this one would.

 

[nickdnz]

I'd love to see Wade get the call up. His defense is a tad shaky, but he seems like one of those players who are just exceptional. Certainly a more exciting wing prospect than any other in my opinion.

 

[gingergenius]

I think Wade needs a full season in the Premiership - as Olyy says, Saxons to start with - that's what they're there for. Sharples is certainly the frontrunner for the wing berth (hopefully) left by Cueto; after that call it club bias but I really think someone like James Short, who's been excellent this season and last, deserves a go.

Marler is far from ready.

There's a theme here - we're all very keen to try out young players, which is good, but we can't start picking players for England based entirely on how much potential talent they have - there must be some level of experience/ competence there to ensure they won't freeze on the international stage, lose confidence and start playing crap for their clubs. It's necessary to pick players who are young, talented, exciting, but have also proved again and again that they can cut it at the top level.

Throw Marler up against Murray, Jones, Ross, Castrogiovanni and n'importe Pilier Droit and he'll be royally ****ed. Wade's a slightly different story because wing's a different position, but I think since Sharples and Short have been impressing for over a year, in the HC and big Premiership games, then their noses are in front.

I named my squad, let's go ahead with a provisional starting lineup:

1. Corbisiero
2. Hartley (c)
3. Cole
4. Lawes
5. Robson
6. Robshaw
7. Wood
8. Waldrom
9. Care
10. Flood
11. Sharples
12. Farrell (k)
13. Tuilagi
14. Ashton
15. Foden

16. Gray
17. Stevens
18. Attwood
19. Croft
20. Youngs
21. Barritt
22. Armitage (sneaks ahead of Brown for versatility's sake)

I've given Hartley the captaincy because he's got club experience, he's nailed onto the 2 jersey, and hopefully he becomes less of a **** day by day. Still don't like him.

 

[McTallshort]

Glad people are not all jumping on the we love Marler bandwagon like the press seem to be. His scummaging is not up to scratch but that will improve if he is given time in the Saxons and not pushed too soon.

Really like both Wade and Sharples even though Wade has not scored much since everyone got back from the world cup and would be happy to give both a go.

 

[welshglory]

What does everyone think of Jonny May. I have to say that in the games i've seen him play for Gloucester he looks very impressive and naturally talented. And apparently hes the fastest player in the Gloucester squad which is very impressive considering Sharples was the fastest player in the England squad and Vainikolo is very quick as well.

 

[psychic duck]

What does everyone think of Jonny May. I have to say that in the games i've seen him play for Gloucester he looks very impressive and naturally talented. And apparently hes the fastest player in the Gloucester squad which is very impressive considering Sharples was the fastest player in the England squad

this kind of player is what the Saxons is for not the senior team and

Vainikolo is very quick as well.

no he is not

 

[welshglory]

this kind of player is what the Saxons is for not the senior team and



no he is not

I don't buy that attitude, sometimes you've got to take risks with selections when you have exceptionally talented players. But with the England set up i wouldn't really expect him to flourish there or any other talented young player. Ifhe was Australian or Welsh on the other hand...

You probably don't have a good memory. Vainikolo burst onto the scene with Gloucester and score 5 tries on his debut. He is very quick but is used as a battering ram by most teams he plays for. Put him on a 100m/40m track and he is a very quick fella.

From wikipedia which isn't saying a lot but they've got links:
He attended De La Salle College, Mangere East and holds the school's 100m record of 10.90s.[4]​ Vainikolo ran the 100 metres in 10.6 seconds in qualifying for the 1998 World Junior Athletics Championships.[5]

​

 

[psychic duck]

I don't buy that attitude, sometimes you've got to take risks with selections when you have exceptionally talented players. But with the England set up i wouldn't really expect him to flourish there or any other talented young player. Ifhe was Australian or Welsh on the other hand...

You probably don't have a good memory. Vainikolo burst onto the scene with Gloucester and score 5 tries on his debut. He is very quick but is used as a battering ram by most teams he plays for. Put him on a 100m/40m track and he is a very quick fella.

From wikipedia which isn't saying a lot but they've got links:
He attended De La Salle College, Mangere East and holds the school's 100m record of 10.90s.[4]​ Vainikolo ran the 100 metres in 10.6 seconds in qualifying for the 1998 World Junior Athletics Championships.[5]

​

he's not even in Gloucester first choice XV, and by the way England have defeated both Wales and Australia the last times they played in the 6N or AI

I seem to remember, at least the union version of Vainikolo being large, clunky, and slow