[RWC2023 QF3] England vs Fiji (15/10/2023)

[Welsh Exile]

I won't be happy with a close game. SA should, and better, win this by at least 14 or I'll be sending Rassie an email.

 

[OldSchoolRugga]

I'm hoping for a South Africa - Argentina final. It's a stretch, but one can dream. Argentina being in two world cup finals in two different sport codes, and South Africa defending their crown in their second consecutive World Cup Final. What a story that will be.

 

[Grizwald]

It's almost cat in hells chance territory against the Boks. Their a much better side than 2019 and have added a solid attack to their usual dominant pack. They can play ugly and cut loose when it's on. I worry they'll monster us in the scrum then kick pens or for territory and that's all they'll have to do.

One straw that I'm cluthing at is the 27-26 win in Nov 21. We had a weaker pack then, and it was Smith at 10, they had a real go at SA in the first half then faded in the second going behind bit hung in enough and slotted a late pen for the won.

England might have a performance in them, SA didn't look tired to me after yesterday's game while France looked like they emptied the tank and were running on fumes.

 

[BrokenWing]

I won't be happy with a close game. SA should, and better, win this by at least 14 or I'll be sending Rassie an email.

I hear he prefers videos

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

I won't be happy with a close game. SA should, and better, win this by at least 14 or I'll be sending Rassie an email.

In the spirit of NH togetherness feel free to use the one I sent Cheika as a template.


Dear Michael,

Congratulations to Argentina on both reaching the RWC semi finals and finding a particularly cruel way to break Welsh hearts. Not that it was much of an achievement mind, even though they did have 2 Englishmen in their backline……another 12 would probably have done the trick, eh?

See you in the final.

Best

VT

 

[Welsh Exile]

I do find it funny reading these posts from SH people bragging about SH dominance. I will actively support any SH team over a NH team and couldn't care less about the NH doing well, they can go **** themselves apart from Wales obviously. Conversely I actually like the SH teams, with the exception of maybe Australia because, you know, they're Ozzies.

 

[TommiG88]

I do find it funny reading these posts from SH people bragging about SH dominance. I will actively support any SH team over a NH team and couldn't care less about the NH doing well, they can go **** themselves apart from Wales obviously. Conversely I actually like the SH teams, with the exception of maybe Australia because, you know, they're Ozzies.

It's ok, I support anyone but Wales

 

[Welsh Exile]

It's ok, I support anyone but Wales

View attachment 18184

The way it should be. I hate it when you have those "I just want to see a good game of ruggers" English rugby fans who say they love supporting the home nations. **** off.

 

[TommiG88]

The way it should be. I hate it when you have those "I just want to see a good game of ruggers" English rugby fans who say they love supporting the home nations. **** off.

I'll add Scotland into that too, but I was supporting Ireland and France this past weekend

 

[Welsh Exile]

I'll add Scotland into that too, but I was supporting Ireland and France this past weekend

Nah. **** em. I don't dislike the Irish but they're neighbours so by definition you have to hate them a little bit. I actually like France but they can go **** themselves too. Everyone can go **** themselves come to think of it.

 

[Jimbo]

Mad how Tom Curry doesn't start vs Fiji and we lose and then Tom Curry does start vs Fiji and we win
Will ponder this further

On a serious note curry has been a bit underwhelming imo, injury and the Ban probably key factors here, you just know he is absolute class in general and if England do sort their **** out he will be a big part of it, long term I think he's one of the few who can actually provide leadership.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Sounds like rustiness after playing one game since May tbh
Think he still ended the game as top tackler and didn't give away any penalties after his back to back ones early on

Looking at the stats it looks like Borthwick is asking him to play a different game to what he should be though, kind of like how he ruined Itoje in the 6N - 0 metres on the carry despite being a very very good link player. Lawes got the ball 20 times, Curry got it 4

 

[Jimbo]

I really dislike Ryanal, think he's a pretty bad ref but he was consistently bad for both teams yesterday.

I just find it funny how there is no mention of some of the bad decisions going against Fiji. Reading this thread you would think Fiji had Ryanal as their 16th man but against Wales it was a different story. It's almost like we're all biased.

Except the Fiji vs Wales ref Carley is English so represents us to some extent so we are going to judge him, secondly I don't remember Fiji being camped on the England line for what seemed like an eternity whilst giving away pen after pen some probably justifying a yc in their own right, then an instant yellow for a single infringement moments later down the other end. Englands defence at times in and around our own line was to pedestrian and rolled over to easily to spend too much time there anyway, if we are all prepared to ignore these facts by all means get upset that people don't lead off alarmingly in the same way when Fiji play England as when Wales do.

 

[Jimbo]

Sounds like rustiness after playing one game since May tbh
Think he still ended the game as top tackler and didn't give away any penalties after his back to back ones early on

Looking at the stats it looks like Borthwick is asking him to play a different game to what he should be though, kind of like how he ruined Itoje in the 6N - 0 metres on the carry despite being a very very good link player. Lawes got the ball 20 times, Curry got it 4

With a player like curry at his best you come to expect him to have a few key moments in a game which I've not noticed, still averages very well as you say and never has a poor game, just not so many, Curry's at it again, I also felt him and Underhill complimented each other soo well. Is Curry doing a slightly different role in general he's a little bigger and more physical, I seem to recall him getting over the ball a hell of a lot and being a little more agile but able to punch above his weight, maybe I'm just miss remembering though.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

With a player like curry at his best you come to expect him to have a few key moments in a game which I've not noticed, still averages very well as you say and never has a poor game, just not so many, Curry's at it again, I also felt him and Underhill complimented each other soo well. Is Curry doing a slightly different role in general he's a little bigger and more physical, I seem to recall him getting over the ball a hell of a lot and being a little more agile but able to punch above his weight, maybe I'm just miss remembering though.

Yeah EJ asked him to put on a lot of mass, when EJ got the boot he promptly lost a lot of it and ended the season playing some of his best rugby this RWC cycle
Wouldn't be surprised if Borthwick has told him to bulk up again, he told Ben Curry he was too small during the 6N

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Think it's more likely just a case of him having not really played rugby for what, 5 months? I'm one of Curry's biggest fans but putting on some size wouldn't really explain the absolute penalty machine he's been so far this tournament. To me it looks like he's just off his game (understandably).

I don't really believe that Curry would have suddenly dropped a ton of weight as soon as EJ was sacked without first having some conversation without Borthwick about whether that was what he wanted from him.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Yeah EJ asked him to put on a lot of mass, when EJ got the boot he promptly lost a lot of it and ended the season playing some of his best rugby this RWC cycle
Wouldn't be surprised if Borthwick has told him to bulk up again, he told Ben Curry he was too small during the 6N

Time to wheel this out again, England selection criteria meeting:

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Think it's more likely just a case of him having not really played rugby for what, 5 months? I'm one of Curry's biggest fans but putting on some size wouldn't really explain the absolute penalty machine he's been so far this tournament. To me it looks like he's just off his game (understandably).

Yeah I'm not saying the bulk is what's caused his form to drop off just that that's an explanation as to why he's been playing a different kind of game the last couple of years to the ones before
It's easy to see the difference that England has had on him as there's an identical clone of him that hasn't had that influence and they're very different shapes these day

 

[Zac_ETNZ]

On that performance against Fiji, SA will walk through to the final..

 

[Jimbo]

Yeah I'm not saying the bulk is what's caused his form to drop off just that that's an explanation as to why he's been playing a different kind of game the last couple of years to the ones before
It's easy to see the difference that England has had on him as there's an identical clone of him that hasn't had that influence and they're very different shapes these day

I'd probably take both but which is the biggest asset?