RWC Semi Final: New Zealand - Australia (16-10-2011, 21:00)

[ACT1NUP]

so true.....the french have as much right to the WC as we do and have proven themselves as our ultimate bogey team! I think the last thing kiwis will be feeling right now is "cocky" maybe more relief than anything else.

Relief, with a bit of supreme confidence. On stuff.co.nz they have a survey. 7161 people (96.2%) think the ABs will go all the way now with just 280 (3.8%) thinking otherwise. Theres always going to be talk about France getting up for the big one rah rah rah but in reality this is the ABs to lose. It's going to take one hell of a choke to lose the final, something like our entire 15 will have to emulate Quade Cooper and not want to tackle or just plain fall to pieces. Bit too much experience in this team for that too happen as well as the harsh lessons of past world cups in everyones mind. I actually feel slightly sorry for whoever has to cross this team (in this case France) in the final. ABs are going to be savage beasts in a world cup final, at home, if this is what they play like in a semi at the fortress of Eden park.

 

[UilamOsa]

Cruden did a good job but the reality is the game was won by the guys in front and the back Three. And the game plan which prevented the Aussies from targeting Cruden and also all nut nullified the impact of Pocock at the breakdown.

If anything the All Blacks played how they always should. Much more like how the wallabies protect Cooper of the boks protect Steyn, I think I said about 5 years ago that the All Blacks game plan revolved around carter too much. Carter is brilliant and doesn't need protection, he thrives on being in the thick of battle and being "The Man" but it's too much to ask anyone else to come in and run the team the same way.

Cruden was never isolated on defense, always had someone on his shoulder to help him and never got the ball on attack with an Aussie defender anywhere near him, didn't have to kick for goal or do much ground kicking and had Kahui, Jane, Nonu and Dagg at times all came in to play first receiver.

Dont want to take too much away from Cruden because what he was asked to do he did well but the largest part of the responsibility that needed to me taken up with Carter out was shared around other players not given to Cruden. For the most part Cruden went through the game without any pressure on him.

Agreed.

Also, they divvied up the 1st receiver role between Dagg & Cruden & Nonu. Too many targets for Pocock to cover if he did happen to get out of the rucks he was buried in. Everyone was directing play, rather than just DC doing it.
And, Cruden's defense was beyond awesome. It was easily 10 times better than earlier this year.

I'm not too sure the French team can hang with this AB's team. This is based on last nights performance and the French performance against England.

 

[Bokbe4k]

Congrats NZ, really hope you win the final, making you the third SH team to win the WC twice, although this semi should have been against the Boks, see how easy it is to brush aside the aussies when an honest ref is in control of the game.

 

[ACT1NUP]

Congrats NZ, really hope you win the final, making you the third SH team to win the WC twice, although this semi should have been against the Boks, see how easy it is to brush aside the aussies when an honest ref is in control of the game.

lol. I think the Boks wouldn't have put up anymore resistance than the Aussies to be fair. Too old, predictable, poorly coached etc. Either team was in for a hiding ABs could have taken both on at once, I'm sure of it.

 

[TRF C A Iversen]

lol. I think the Boks wouldn't have put up anymore resistance than the Aussies to be fair. Too old, predictable, poorly coached etc. Either team was in for a hiding ABs could have taken both on at once, I'm sure of it.

Wow, doing your bit to prove us kiwis aren't arrogant, aye? Just so you know, the AB's that you love so much wouldn't like you being that arrogant on their behalf.

It's better to just enjoy the win without trying to rub something in.

 

[William18]

Great game by the All Blacks. They had the game from the very beginning. The back three were outstanding as well were the backrow. Cruden silenced his critics and showed New Zealand why he should've been picked over Slade in the beginning. One thing I don't agree with is the shoulder charge by Sonny Bill. If he can get a yellow card for a shoulder charge then surely Sam Warburton should've got a yellow card instead of red. IMO a shoulder charge has more intent than a pick up tackle.
Dagg, showed why he was required over Mils and I bet even Mils will be thinking the same. He created opportunities for the people around him and was dangerous on attack when the Aussies were on the backfoot.
Well done to McCaw for stepping up when he needed to and pretty much kept Pocock out of the game. Read's return to form was exactly what he needed and Mr.Consistent Jerome Kaino showed more signs of being player of the tournament.

Yeah but no one has ever been unable to walk after receiving a shoulder charge.

 

[donmcdazzle]

Yes it right. I had a look back through the records. The final has always been referees by one of the quarter-final referees, and never by a semi-final referee

IMO, Wayne Barnes will get the final. Certainly I expect the pressure will come on from the RFU to pick Barnes.


By the way folks... I see a lot of posters here writing off the French..... DANGER, DANGER!!

They were written off at the quarter-final stage... and they won!

They were written off at the semi-final stage... and they won!

And we have history with them, and that history is not all beer and skittles!!

It will be a pisstake if Barnes gets the final. He has been ok in this world cup but I don't think his form warrants the final compared to Joubert. Also, given Barnes is not a popular guy in NZ due to him screwing us last time we played France in a World Cup it would seem like an unnecesarrily inflammatory appointment.

Just give the damn thing to Joubert, nobody complains about him after the game which is the biggest compliment a ref can get.

 

[Dizzy]

Cruden did a good job but the reality is the game was won by the guys in front and the back Three. And the game plan which prevented the Aussies from targeting Cruden and also all nut nullified the impact of Pocock at the breakdown.

If anything the All Blacks played how they always should. Much more like how the wallabies protect Cooper of the boks protect Steyn, I think I said about 5 years ago that the All Blacks game plan revolved around carter too much. Carter is brilliant and doesn't need protection, he thrives on being in the thick of battle and being "The Man" but it's too much to ask anyone else to come in and run the team the same way.

Cruden was never isolated on defense, always had someone on his shoulder to help him and never got the ball on attack with an Aussie defender anywhere near him, didn't have to kick for goal or do much ground kicking and had Kahui, Jane, Nonu and Dagg at times all came in to play first receiver.

I suppose you didn't see the break he made which ended in the 22?

Dont want to take too much away from Cruden because what he was asked to do he did well but the largest part of the responsibility that needed to me taken up with Carter out was shared around other players not given to Cruden. For the most part Cruden went through the game without any pressure on him.

I wouldn't say without ANY, I mean, after all, it's his first start in the World Cup and it's against arguably the toughest opposition in the tournament. He would've been probably the most nervous one out there because of his lack of experience. But he did distribute correctly and made some good choices with ball in hand, he did what a First-Five is required to do which is unleash his backs. No, he didn't get as much responsibility as our first choice First five has but it's poor form to say he didn't do much at all. He dropped a goal, made a break, made his tackles and overall did his job as our first five. I say well done to him.

 

[Dizzy]

its the truth.

Not true, Cruden got the ball a couple of times with Aussie defenders, and when he did get the ball without them around, he distributed to his more dangerous backs.

What would you had liked him to do? Take on the line and risk getting crunched?... The boy did what he was required to do and that's that.

 

[Wally]

Well done Kiwis, you played the superior rugby from the get go. Australia were completely pathetic, like they have been for the whole world cup, and after promising so much this campaign has done nothing for the game in this country. In the end we were probably just too young and some serious questions will now be asked of Cooper and Deans. Who knows if Cooper will even be around in four years but I'd wonder if he is the man to lead us there anyway.

 

[james5000]

Cruden did a good job but the reality is the game was won by the guys in front and the back Three. And the game plan which prevented the Aussies from targeting Cruden and also all nut nullified the impact of Pocock at the breakdown.

If anything the All Blacks played how they always should. Much more like how the wallabies protect Cooper of the boks protect Steyn, I think I said about 5 years ago that the All Blacks game plan revolved around carter too much. Carter is brilliant and doesn't need protection, he thrives on being in the thick of battle and being "The Man" but it's too much to ask anyone else to come in and run the team the same way.

Cruden was never isolated on defense, always had someone on his shoulder to help him and never got the ball on attack with an Aussie defender anywhere near him, didn't have to kick for goal or do much ground kicking and had Kahui, Jane, Nonu and Dagg at times all came in to play first receiver.

Dont want to take too much away from Cruden because what he was asked to do he did well but the largest part of the responsibility that needed to me taken up with Carter out was shared around other players not given to Cruden. For the most part Cruden went through the game without any pressure on him.

You are taking everything away from him, Cruden was excellent, he did everything asked of him and more.

I honestly hope DC head's off to make some big dollars in Europe in the near future.

a) DC has been a great servant of NZ Rugby and deserves all the riches that European club's can provide.

b) Cruden need's all the experience he can get before the next cup. I honestly can't see DC maintaining his exceptionally high standards till the next cup. Cruden is on the way up, DC fighting him for his spot may hinder his development. We all know that with DC's career history, Cruden wont just have to be better to knock him off, he'll have to be much better because DC already has established himself. I don't think that's fair on Cruden and the other developing 10's.

Look at Jonny Wilkinson, he's holding back a couple of generation's of talent. Dan Carter will be heading down the same road IMO.

 

[ACT1NUP]

Wow, doing your bit to prove us kiwis aren't arrogant, aye? Just so you know, the AB's that you love so much wouldn't like you being that arrogant on their behalf.

It's better to just enjoy the win without trying to rub something in.

If arrogance is the truth then yes last part was a joke, well the part where I said ABs would take both at once. AB fans have copped heapsa flak due to past world cups, choking, being useless without DC or McCaw seems only a little fair to give a little back.

 

[donmcdazzle]

^^ I think you're getting a bit carried away. Carter still has plenty to give NZ rugby, the guy is the best 10 we've ever had and is still in brilliant form. Still plenty of miles on the clock.

As for Cruden, he did well, behind a very good forward pack. Larksea I know your comments are a tad bit harsh on him if you are being honest. The only mistakes he made were the early pass into touch, and a grubber that ended up getting toed back down our end. If Donald had played like that you would be praising him a bit more I reckon. His passing was accurate, he kicked well for territory, and most importantly defended brilliantly. All those that assumed he was weak on defence cause he is small need to pipe down now.

He would've gained so much from that game, especially making that line break. Should give him belief that his natural game will still work at this level.

 

[nickdnz]

As I've said, both McCaw and Carter have been signed till the next World Cup, and if they're both not starters than they'll certainly be in the squad. Carter is still head and sholders aboved the next best 1st 5/8th in the world and I can see him staying there at 33 years old (if he's the highest test points scorer, and highest Super Rugby points scorer now, how far is he going to get in four years!).

I actually felt really sorry for Cooper. This World Cup he has received hell. I hope we ease off now, as we have targeted him as a nation (partly because he messed with McCaw) but players like Botha and Hartley didn't get anywhere near the amount of flack (I admit I boo'd during the USA v Australia and at home). It was fun to hate the guy and throw him off all World Cup, but I can't imagine what it would be like to go through, 60,000 people in a stadium and four million in home, celebrating your every error.

 

[james5000]

^^ I think you're getting a bit carried away. Carter still has plenty to give NZ rugby, the guy is the best 10 we've ever had and is still in brilliant form. Still plenty of miles on the clock.

He has been exceptional throughout his Career but four years is a long way away.
Maybe he could play well till the next World Cup, I just think age and Injuries will wear him down.

He's the best we have at the moment, but will he be the best next year? or the year after that?

I'd Imagine if Cruden played a big role in winning the cup he'd grow immensely from that one game.
Cruden has all the skill's that Carter has, he just need's to get the experience and to have the confidence to use those skills.

 

[Dizzy]

I know what you're saying nick, but when you come out in the media all cocky and say you love all the flak and it makes you better, you love being public enemy number 1. Then sympathy is something you won't get from me.

 

[InsaneAsylum]

my personal opinion is that mccaw's body wont be there in 2015, maybe he'll be there as coach. Carter has more of a chance, but again he should be in the squad, on the bench, as a mentor.

NZ should/will go on to win this, they should celebrate and then get on with business of bringing the next generation through. i have to say i admire that deans had the balls to go down that route when he came on board,
it's not easy, it would be like starting a job and making half of the longer serving members redundant. the option was to leave things unchanged and go into this world cup on the back of baxter and dunning.
I know i'd rather the wallabies bow out in the semis now, and be more of a force in 2015 than bow out in the semis now and have to start from scratch.

if I could have this game again, I would have liked to have a fit kurtley beale selected, as well as barnes in for mccabe. i thought once again barnes helped to settle cooper down. i want to see the cooper that came off the bench against italy and stepped his way to a try, it's like cooper is stuck in two minds now, the natural game he wants to play versus the game that has been coached into him.

speaking to my kiwi mate after game, we were both taking the **** saying donald was man of the match, because he didn't get onto the field

 

[ACT1NUP]

You are taking everything away from him, Cruden was excellent, he did everything asked of him and more.

I honestly hope DC head's off to make some big dollars in Europe in the near future.

a) DC has been a great servant of NZ Rugby and deserves all the riches that European club's can provide.

b) Cruden need's all the experience he can get before the next cup. I honestly can't see DC maintaining his exceptionally high standards till the next cup. Cruden is on the way up, DC fighting him for his spot may hinder his development. We all know that with DC's career history, Cruden wont just have to be better to knock him off, he'll have to be much better because DC already has established himself. I don't think that's fair on Cruden and the other developing 10's.

Look at Jonny Wilkinson, he's holding back a couple of generation's of talent. Dan Carter will be heading down the same road IMO.

Cruden has alot of potential for sure and I don't think Carter is going to hold off his development at all. If anything Cruden will be better for playing behind Carter, is there anyone else better to learn the trade off than the master himself? We lose Carter to overseas and we lose a wealth of knowledge from one of the greatest flyhalfs of all time. Not too sure if anyone will ever surpass Carter if he really wants to make the next world cup, he's that sort of player.

 

[james5000]

Cruden has alot of potential for sure and I don't think Carter is going to hold off his development at all. If anything Cruden will be better for playing behind Carter, is there anyone else better to learn the trade off than the master himself? We lose Carter to overseas and we lose a wealth of knowledge from one of the greatest flyhalfs of all time. Not too sure if anyone will ever surpass Carter if he really wants to make the next world cup, he's that sort of player.

It's not his mind that worries me, it's his body. He really wanted to play in this World Cup, he didn't even finish all his training sessions haha.

Cruden will learn more playing, than sitting on the bench watching, just my opinion any way.

I'd love Carter to prove me wrong, but he doesn't hurt his legacy going for the big bucks at this stage of his career.
Cruden will only get better, he will get much better playing the big games at international level than sitting on the bench.
I don't think Carter is going to get any better at his stage of his career, age catches up with every one, and Carter has a history of injuries.

 

[ACT1NUP]

I don't think Carter can get any better for sure. It's unhuman, the mans a genius. Your right if anything gives out his body will, but if he manages himself well(just as Thorn has) properly he could play into his thirties and still be the Dan the man. Cruden will have to turn into one hell of a player to seriously challenge Carter for a starting spot, I'd love it if he did or anyone else did but probably a bit premature to start talking about life after Carter when the man is still probably the best all round rugby player in the world easily.